--- Log opened Sun May 20 00:00:23 2018
--- Day changed Sun May 20 2018
00:00  * Cann0n hands jim some gasoline
00:00 < Cann0n> wtf
00:00 < badsekter> lol
00:00 < revel> lol
00:00 < uplime> lol
00:00 < jim> oh look here it comes!
00:01 < uplime> thats actually pretty funny
00:01 < uplime> this channel just peaked
00:01 < badsekter> hand jim some bella hadid
00:01  * uplime hands jim some OneMillionDollars
00:01 < uplime> damn
00:02 < Cann0n> and if bella hadid enters the chan...
00:03 < jim> what's a bella hadid?
00:03 < Cann0n> Off-topic: I found a magically fishing hole today fly fishing... its loaded with red fish.... like... big suckers
00:03 < Cann0n> thought id share.
00:03 < Tech_8> i dont like sea food, but sounds fun
00:04 < Cann0n> i only eat florida pompano... and i throw everything back
00:04 < jim> I don't like fish generally, but I love prawns
00:04 < zzero1> I 've booted with a 18.04 ubuntu x64 and chrooted into 16.04 x64 installation. How  can I upgrade the 16.04 to the 18.04  ? The upgrade tool does not work because it detects the 18.04 from the chroot host. Any ideas ?
00:05 < Cann0n> i like catching them. I tie my own flies... very rewarding much like customizing a kernel to the exact specs of your computer and optimize it to boot in 10 seconds
00:05 < zzero1> without booting with a 16.04 media to chroot ?
00:05 < Cann0n> zzero1: why do you want to update?
00:05 < tds> zzero1: what output do you get from do-release-update? I'd expect it to work fine in a chroot, though iirc it won't do an upgrade from an LTS until 18.04.1 is released
00:05 < jim> zzero1, ubuntu is derived from debian, which was probably the first dist to get upgrades rock solid
00:06 < zzero1> Checking for a new Ubuntu release No new release found.
00:06 < Cann0n> thats one thing i never fully understood cutting edge updates... security updates are one thing but if it's a solid rock, leave it be until deps are required or problems are found
00:07 < tds> zzero1: going from 16.04, I think you want do-release-upgrade -d
00:07 < zzero1> tds: thanks now it detects
00:07 < jim> zzero1: can yuou actually boot the 16.04?
00:09 < zzero1> yes I can but I prefer to chroot because I boot with chrooted root and a kernel that efiboots
00:09 < Cann0n> debian left a bad taste in my mouth
00:09 < uplime> you're not supposed to eat it silly
00:10 < Cann0n> yeah but my computers cup holder...
00:10 < Cann0n> the most gorgeous girl just left the cafe im at right now...
00:10 < uplime> oh yeah you typically want proprietary cup holders
00:11 < Cann0n> i doubt she is interested in my recently discovered fishing hole...
00:11 < Cann0n> and on that note, i'm gonna go get drunk with my buddy
00:11 < Cann0n> until next time
00:11 < uplime> o/
00:12 < TRS-80> go talk to her about GNU/Linux
00:12 < Cann0n> i have no problem running chicks off without bringing up linux or the Tux tattoo on my leg
00:14 < jim> phogg, it looks like the latest for debian is 4.9.0-6
00:16 < A4L> How to download Youtube video or just sound using bash?? I can also use 3rd party servers. tnx
00:18 < A4L> How to download Youtube video or just sound using bash?? I can also use 3rd
00:18 < A4L> +party servers. tnx
00:19 < zzero1> I had to change the prompt to normal in the /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades
00:20 < revel> A4L: youtube-dl
00:20 < zzero1> and it worked. Thanks everyone :)
00:21 < A4L> revel: yeah but it doesnt show any output. just freezes
00:21 < Sveta> A4L: for how long?
00:21 < revel> Get better hardware.
00:21 < A4L> revel: raspberry pi zero w
00:22 < A4L> revel: yeah
00:22 < revel> I have one of those as well and it works on it.
00:22 < A4L> revel: yeah at about 15 secs it responds
00:24 < tds> zzero1: ah, I thought adding -d would stop it requiring that, but glad that sorted it :)
00:24 < tds> you might want to change it back after the upgrade to avoid going to the next non-lts version, though
00:24 < A4L> revel: im trying to do a portable sound entertainment center (pifm trahnsmitter)
00:25 < revel> Right. Well, no idea how to do that.
00:25 < A4L> revel: i have everything already done just the youtube-dl part.
00:26 < revel> So you want something more real-time?
00:26 < pnbeast> I bet you could make a Beowulf cluster of Pis and play videos at really high resolution really quickly.
00:26 < A4L> revel: what do u mean
00:27 < revel> Well, more like streaming than downloading it.
00:28 < CoCo_Kid594> any Ham Radio people in here?
00:28 < A4L> revel: downloading a music video using cromium takes like 5 secs max, then ffmpeg-ing it another 5 secs, so it is gonna be ok
00:29 < b> About 460 people in ##hamradio
00:29 < revel> I think you can have youtube-dl automatically convert downloaded videos right after fetching them.
00:29 < revel> i.e to extract audio and then convert it to whatever format tickles your fancy.
00:29 < A4L> revel: thanks will check that
00:33 < nekUwU> test
00:34 < A4L> nekUwU: it works ;-)
00:34 < nekUwU> indeed!
00:37 < A4L> revel: Thanks a lot it just needs patience. like 12 seconds just to launch youtube-dl, but after that it works smooth
00:37 < caplet> A4L: have a look at this here script: https://paste.linux.community/view/raw/c20f69bb
00:37 < revel> Probably since it's bloody massive and written in Python.
00:39 < A4L> revel: tnx i've got my code now (bash), verry messy but it works.
00:39 < A4L> good night
00:39 < A4L> quit
00:40 < cmptr> Is there a way to have a different ppi setting for each monitor in x?
00:41 < TRS-80> OK, I can't seem to find answer to this one searching internet: local machine names don't resolve when I am connected to VPN
00:41 < storge_> cmptr: xrandr, i think so
00:42 < TRS-80> VPN client (OpenVPN) inserts VPN's DNS servers as top 2 lines of resolv.conf; this is desired behavior to stop DNS leaks when on VPN
00:43 < cmptr> storge_: I've tried using xrandr --output DP-0 --dpi 187 --output DP-2 --dpi 108 but nothing changed, unless there is some other command that I'm missing to restart the server.
00:43 < TRS-80> but is there any way to resolve local machine names while connected to VPN? I tried editing hosts file, to no avail. Do I need to reload hosts file somehow?
00:44 < indigoblue> TRS-80: might be able to do it by setting a route
00:45 < TRS-80> indigoblue: on local machine? I guess I need to search how to do that
00:45 < fujisan> hi
00:45 < mgolisch> hosts file should work
00:45 < mgolisch> it will usualy be asked before dns
00:45 < indigoblue> you could do it at the router level
00:45 < indigoblue> and at the client level too for extra measure
00:45 < TRS-80> mgolisch: I did that, but do I need to refresh somehow?
00:45 < mgolisch> no
00:46 < TRS-80> indigoblue: my router DNS ends up as 3rd line of resolv.conf after VPN DNS are inserted as line 1 and 2
00:47 < TRS-80> therefore, it never goes that far
00:47 < indigoblue> there are a couple ways to do it
00:47 < TRS-80> which is by design, I'm pretty sure (DNS leaks on VPN)
00:47 < nekUwU> minimalism: what's your opinion on fvwm?
00:47 < fujisan>  hi
00:48 < nekUwU> Hello fujisan
00:48 < TRS-80> I read somewhere that hosts should work, mgolisch said same, but that did not work for me for some reason :/
00:48 < indigoblue> are you sure you got the formatting correct?
00:49 < mgolisch> how did you check?
00:49 < TRS-80> edited file then hosts computername
00:49 < fujisan> im in bed with irc
00:49 < TRS-80> sorry, host computername
00:49 < indigoblue> format is ip hostname
00:49 < fujisan> TRS-80: tandy?
00:49 < indigoblue> so, for example:
00:49 < mgolisch> not sure that works
00:50 < mgolisch> think host does dns lookups only
00:50 < indigoblue> 127.0.0.1     trs80
00:50 < TRS-80> mgolisch: aha lemme try nslookup or other command
00:50 < mgolisch> try ping name or something
00:50 < TRS-80> indigoblue: yes I know
00:50 < TRS-80> indigoblue: I am talking about commands I used to check, nott what I put in hosts file
00:51 < TRS-80> ok mgolisch lemme try that, brb
00:52 < domhnall> content aside, this list is ordered in relativity to importance in development and security. https://www.vaultproject.io/downloads.html (share)
00:52 < TRS-80> mgolisch: That worked! And here I was, wondering what the differences between host, nslookup, and (forget now the other one) were! :)
00:53 < mgolisch> dig?
00:53 < TRS-80> yeah thats the one! :)
00:53 < TRS-80> dig seemes more in depth
00:54 < mgolisch> its nice as you can specify alot of stuff on the cmdline without going interactive like with nslookup
00:59 < uplime> host looks up A (and I think AAAA) records for a hostname. nslookup does lookups of various records for various hostnames. dig is a better version of nslookup
01:04 < rud0lf> hi. i wanna execute last line of example.txt as bash command. where should i pipe "tail -n 1 example.txt" ?
01:04 < rud0lf> simply | bash ?
01:05 < tds> host will do an MX lookup by default as well
01:05 < tds> I quite like it as a quick way of seeing a + aaaa + mx
01:06 < veridiam> rud0lf: wrap it in backticks?
01:06 < rud0lf> hm.. it should work, thanks
01:07 < uplime> gross. use $(), not ``
01:08 < iflema> variable even
01:10 < iflema> ave a disk thrash maybe... lol
01:14 < saustin> I’m trying to setup an intel X550T to use SR-IOV on linux.  The BIOS has VT-D and SR-IOV enabled.  The kernel command line has intel_iommu=on and iommu=pt.  The kernel is 3.10.  The device files under /sys/class/net/em1/device/ do not contain sriov_numvfs or sriov_totalvfs … while any attempt to modprobe ixgbe with max_vfs= spits out an error directing me to use pci sys … Anyone have ideas on how I can get going wtih sriov?
01:19 < superguest> how is a bind mount functionally different to a symbolic link? I will provide a simple example:
01:21 < superguest> mount /etc/resolv.conf /chrootDir/etc/resol.conf --bind
01:21 < superguest> vs.
01:22 < superguest> ln -s /etc/resolv.conf /chrootDir/etc/resolv.conf
01:24 < domhnall> vs. cp --dereference /etc/resolv.conf /chrootDir/etc/
01:31 < domhnall> superguest: i believe you want to know if mount creates a hard or soft link.
01:32 < arooni> having trouble getting my ruby script command that works fine within my bash/fish shell over ssh; but when its run via cron; it fails.  i tried following; http://g14n.info/2016/05/crontab-best-practices/ ;; still running into the same issue
01:32 < revel> superguest: Err, a symlink? That won't work very well.
01:32 < superguest> domhnall, I think know what the difference is.
01:32 < revel> Since it'd just end up as a symlink to itself if you chroot.
01:32 < revel> Equivalent to running `ln -s /etc/resolv.conf /etc/resolv.conf` from within the chroot.
01:33 < revel> Just cp'ing it over would be better.
01:33 < superguest> revel, the line is actually from the arch-chroot script
01:34 < revel> The what?
01:34 < revel> It creates /chrootDir ? Funky script...
01:34 < superguest> no it doesn't
01:34 < dviola> arooni: are you using absolute paths like /usr/bin/ruby /path/to/foo.rb in your crontab?
01:34 < superguest> lone moment please
01:34 < domhnall> ..
01:34 < superguest> line 42 https://github.com/falconindy/arch-install-scripts/blob/master/arch-chroot.in
01:35 < dviola> arooni: are you using rbenv/rvm/chruby for your ruby installation?
01:35 < revel> superguest: That seems to be a bindmount.
01:35 < superguest> it's doing a bind mount.
01:36 < domhnall> ok
01:36 < superguest> The question regarding the functional difference to symlink is raised by me
01:36 < superguest> but I think I know now
01:36 < revel> Yeah. Symlinks are dumb and contextless.
01:37 < superguest> the etc/resolv.conf on the "Chroot" dir stays unaffected
01:37 < superguest> for the duration of the mount
01:38 < revel> Eh? No, if you run `ln -s /etc/resolv.conf /chrootDir/etc/resolv.conf`, it'd create a symlink to /etc/resolv.conf and stick it in the chroot dir. If you chrooted in, it'd just be a symlink to itself.
01:40 < superguest> revel, the question is regarding the functional difference between bind mount and symlink.
01:40 < revel> Well, the bindmount option actually works :^)
01:40 < kurahaupo> bind mount is much more akin to a hard link
01:40 < superguest> it's not really about this live system scenario
01:40 < revel> If you don't chroot, then the symlink option works.
01:41 < superguest> revel, but I understand what you are pointing out in this live system scenario
01:41 < dviola> arooni: please stop crossposting here and on #ruby
01:42 < dviola> I hate giving help just for the person to ignore and ask for help somewhere else, it's considered rude
01:42 < revel> A simple symlink is probably at least slightly less resource-heavy and will also persist past reboots unless it's in /tmp or a tmpfs mount or something.
01:42 < arooni> dviola: i get that; didnt know which was a better chan to be honest; i'm using rvm but it seems to be working now; i wasnt using the correct wrapper
01:43 < superguest> revel, speaking of tmpfs, I just learned that bind mounts are "tmpfs" (after perusing the output of 'mount')
01:43 < arooni> i have this /home/david/.rvm/wrappers/ruby-1.9.3-p551/ruby /var/www/find_my_phone_rails/current/script/complete_scheduled_calls.rb >> /var/www/find_my_phone_rails/shared/log/completed_scheduled_calls.log 2>&1 ... but it does seem to update the log file with both stdout and stderr
01:43 < arooni> so am i not doing the >> redirection 2>&1 part right?
01:43 < dviola> arooni: oh, ok, no worries, just so that you know next time :)
01:44 < dviola> arooni: btw, there is also a #rvm channel
01:44 < revel> superguest: ext4 for me. Probably based on the filesystem the original file is on.
01:44 < arooni> dviola: i wish i would have realized it was a rvm issue earlier
01:44 < superguest> revel, right, I am on the live system trying to install arch (as you might guessed)
01:45 < dviola> arooni: it's fine, glad you got it working
01:46 < arooni> dviola: well its working now; but my log file doesnt seem to be updating correctly
01:47 < arooni> dviola: scratch that ; removed the shell variable and i guess it works fine in the sh shell now
01:54 < Brewster> I am having way too much trouble rotating the screen
01:54 < pnbeast> Is this a Linux problem or a physics/manufacturing problem?
01:54 < dviola> Brewster: why? what have you tried so far?
01:54 < Brewster> I am getting output default cannot user rotation right reflection none
01:55 < Brewster> sorry I'm trying to get the error messages for you
01:55 < Brewster> xrandr --output default --rotation right gives the error message I just told you
01:56 < Brewster> and xrandr -o right gives me x error of failed request: badMatch (invalid parameter attributes)
01:56 < dviola> Brewster: can you share the output of xrandr without arguments? use a pastebin like https://paste.linux.community to paste
01:57 < Brewster> sure gimme a sec
01:57 < jim> thor??
01:58 < dviola> here `xrandr --output VGA-1 --rotate right' works just fine
01:58 < jim> Immune, you're here from two different IPs. what's up with that?
01:58 < Brewster> https://paste.linux.community/view/63b6120f
01:59 < jim> make that three
01:59 < Brewster> I am using plain intel graphics
02:00 < adam7> check https://www.reddit.com/r/TopMindsOfReddit/comments/8du0vn/welcome_to_the_matrix/
02:01 < Brewster> I tried making a config file with a device section in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d with the option RandRRotate "True" but that makes the system hang on startup with no sort of error in the xorg log
02:01 < pnbeast> adam7, top minds of reddit?  Is that like top minds of the state school?  Top minds of the dev-challenged class?
02:01 < adam7> lol yeah, something like that.  meanwhile look at the fucking thing
02:01 < pnbeast> adam7, do you have a Linux question?  Why are you spamming the channel?
02:02 < Brewster> I have spent a day and a half on this and it's really starting to get to me
02:02 < jim> adam7, also please watch your language while you're here
02:02 < Brewster> everything is the latest version
02:03 < Brewster> I am running kali linux with kernel version 4.15
02:03 < adam7> i have a "youre int he matrix" stop trying to kill everyone, message
02:03 < cmptr> Is there a way to force a specifc application to use a specific ppi?
02:03 < pnbeast> Brewster, why are you running a distro aimed at temporary use for "pen testing" and trying to configure monitors for it?  Just curiosity...
02:04 < cmptr> Because I have tried everything, and I am not able to get the ppi individual of my monitors.
02:04 < jim> adam7, ok, how are you seeing this message?
02:04 < adam7> jim: http://rigel.s.lamc.la
02:04 < jim> what's that?
02:04 < Brewster> pn: I wanted to install it on a permanent section on my hard drive because I'm going to use it to learn for my OSCP cert
02:04 < adam7> it's the eye of ra, like the intersect from chuck.   that's a link explaining what i experience.
02:05 < MetaNova> jim: religious spam
02:05 < MetaNova> by a known spammer
02:05 < pnbeast> Yeah, jim, it's the eye of ra.  Don't you know?
02:05 < adam7> something like 'i know kung fu'
02:05 < MetaNova> see the antispam announcement channel
02:05 < jim> eyera?
02:05 < Brewster> I'm configuring the rotation for it because it's on an asus transformer laptop and for some reason the default rotation is to the left and unless I want to learn with my head tilted to the left, I should probably fix this
02:05 < pnbeast> jim, sure, almost like the ira, but slightly less bomby.
02:06 < dviola> MetaNova: you should be seeing something like VGA-1, HDMI-1 or eDP-1 in xrandr, not default, iirc
02:06 < MetaNova> wrong person
02:06 < day> does a program exist that records another program (display only)? something like 'scrot -s'
02:06 < dviola> MetaNova: sorry
02:06 < MetaNova> no worries
02:06 < dviola> Brewster: read what I said earlier
02:06 < Brewster> oh yeah it just says default
02:07 < Brewster> I thought that was weird too
02:07 < pnbeast> day, what do you mean by "records"?  There's typescript, but somehow I suspect you're wanting to make some kind youtube video.
02:07 < dviola> Brewster: I'd try removing any custom xorg.conf and let X detect the display
02:07 < Brewster> right there is no xorg.conf
02:07 < Brewster> this is the default behavior
02:07 < dviola> I don't know about kali, maybe it's using ancient stuff?
02:08 < day> pnbeast: well 'scrot -s' @24fps would describe my requirement best i think
02:08 < Brewster> nah it's pretty up to date
02:08 < pnbeast> day, okay, good luck!
02:08 < Brewster> I remember that used to be the case
02:08 < day> pnbeast: thanks
02:08 < dviola> I get this when I xrandr: VGA-1 connected primary 1360x768+0+0 (normal left inverted right x axis y axis) 576mm x 324mm
02:08 < dviola> on my thinkpad I get eDP-1
02:09 < Brewster> yeah if I do that when I boot up my other linux partition I get something like DP1
02:10 < Brewster> and linux mint also had this problem where the screen was rotated by default but I managed to set up a script to query the accelerometer and to rotate the screen to the proper direction based on its orientation
02:10 < dviola> no idea tbh
02:10 < gabbiel> hey guys how do I enable sound on my arch linux
02:11 < Brewster> really, at this point I would be happy with just one position that I can see without tilting my head
02:11 < matsaman> gabbiel: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Advanced_Linux_Sound_Architecture
02:12 < jim> adam7, ok... when you did that, a little bird told me that link matched something you must have posted before
02:12 < MetaNova> jim: a number of times
02:12 < jim> MetaNova, how recent, if you know?
02:13 < rascul> there's a bird around? i'll get the shotgun
02:13 < dviola> Brewster: I'd see if there's something in the X logs
02:13 < dviola> Brewster: check ~/.local/share/xorg/Xorg.0.log or something
02:14 < MetaNova> jim: 4/23 and 4/25 in ##gentoo
02:15 < MetaNova> and those are just the incidents I know of, since the alert was added for spam in other channels, I can only imagine where else he's spread his nonsense
02:15 < jim> so not today
02:15 < jim> I just now noticed you placed the pattern in asm
02:16 < MetaNova> indeed
02:16 < dviola> Brewster: look for messages with (EE)
02:18 < Brewster> oh this is interesting
02:18 < Brewster> more errors to google
02:18 < Brewster> thanks dviola
02:18 < Brewster> I'll get back to you if I need more help
02:18 < dviola> what are the errors?
02:19 < dviola> np
02:19 < Brewster> open /dev/dri/card0: No such file or directory
02:19 < dviola> Brewster: that's a kali issue I think
02:19 < dviola> it means it can't access your GPU
02:19 < Brewster> Screen 0 deleted because of no matching config section
02:20 < Brewster> I think the first one might be from my config file that I tried to make
02:20 < Brewster> or maybe not
02:20 < Brewster> idk
02:21 < dviola> it sounds like the kernel kali is using doesn't have all the drivers you need or is misconfigured in some way
02:21 < dviola> does /dev/dri/card0 exists at all?
02:21 < matsaman> um, but kali has a dragon wallpaper, so that's obviously not possible
02:22 < dviola> Brewster: I'd use a better distro, you can install these pentesting tools in other distros anyway
02:22 < Brewster> there is no /dev/dri directory
02:22 < dviola> well, there you have your answer
02:22 < Brewster> lol yep
02:22 < jim> can you get the debianized source for the pentesting tools in kali?
02:23 < Brewster> probably
02:23 < Brewster> I found a possible solution to the /dev/dri/card0 issue
02:23 < Brewster> I'm trying that right now
02:23 < jim> if you can, there's nothing stopping you from running plain vanilla debian, which is pretty much the top of the tree
02:24 < Brewster> I will probably do that when I have spent a weekend or two on this
02:25 < Brewster> installing all the packages myself seems like such a pain
02:25 < dviola> iirc, /dev/dri/card0 is created when you load the driver, i915 in your case
02:25 < Brewster> hmm
02:26 < dviola> what does `zgrep CONFIG_DRM_I915 /proc/config.gz' says?
02:27 < dviola> I'd also check `dmesg | grep i915'
02:28 < Brewster> there is no config.gz
02:28 < Brewster> and the dmesg command says nothing
02:29 < dviola> look like they made some bad choices when compiling their kernel
02:30 < matsaman> ^
02:30 < matsaman> and yet their kernels are enormous
02:30 < dviola> I wouldn't waste any time with it, use a better distro
02:30 < Brewster> ok
02:30 < dviola> matsaman: that's odd
02:30 < matsaman> heh
02:31 < Brewster> I might try another thing or two and then give up
02:31 < Brewster> thanks for your help
02:31 < matsaman> well, what is it you're trying to do, rotate your screen?
02:31 < Brewster> yes
02:31 < matsaman> you don't want to change distro over that
02:31 < matsaman> I mean if your distro sucks, sure change it
02:31 < matsaman> but not just for that =P
02:31 < Brewster> I know but I've been at this for a day and a half
02:32 < dviola> maybe they think "by removing this functionality we're going to think extra secure" but they are just making your life even more difficult
02:32 < Brewster> oh fuck me
02:32 < Brewster> sorry for the language
02:32 < Brewster> I got it to work
02:32 < dviola> s/think/be/
02:32 < Brewster> it was something I did
02:32 < matsaman> you should be, this is a family channel, and families have nothing to do with that word
02:33 < matsaman> dviola: plus they have like everything in the world else enabled =P
02:33 < Brewster> I added nomodeset to the grub command line because I was having trouble getting it to boot without it but now everything is working
02:33 < Brewster> and autorotation works without the script I was going to set up
02:34 < matsaman> that's another case of too much in the kernel by default
02:34 < dviola> Brewster: ah yes, nomodeset will disable screen detection (modesetting)
02:34 < matsaman> so you're disabling things that were enabled for no reason =P
02:34 < Brewster> but
02:34 < Brewster> it wasn't booting fully before without it
02:34 < matsaman> yup, gj
02:34 < Brewster> thanks guys
02:37 < dviola> if it doesn't work without nomodeset then that means there are more serious issues, like a driver bug, you really never want to use nomodeset unless you don't want any screen detection at all
02:38 < Brewster> well most of the time I'll put it in there to get the installer and first boot going and then I'll take it out once I have all the drivers and whatnot installed
02:39 < Brewster> my usual distro is linux mint and it has that nice driver installation program that tells you what's missing
02:39 < dviola> if you use proprietary drivers like nvidia then that makes sense
02:39 < Brewster> idk I guess my habits shot me in the foot this time
02:39 < dviola> but for things like i915, nouveau or the other open source drivers, you don't want nomodeset
02:40 < FreakingOut1987> i'm not sure if there is a better channel to mention this but I have two pretty much identify mailservers (derived from the same script) and when I run spamcheck I get two different scores. The extra penalty is from the following: 1.1 DKIM_ADSP_ALL          No valid author signature, domain signs all mail
02:41 < FreakingOut1987> I've checked the source for the two e-mails sent from two different domains and have gone line by line and they're the same :|
02:41 < dviola> screen detection and all that is done in the kernel with modesetting, so nomodeset is telling the kernel don't do any of that, just give me a plain old tty, if I remember correctly
02:41 < FreakingOut1987> what gives?
02:47 < dviola> Brewster: hopefully you learned something :P
02:49 < Brewster> I did learn something :P
02:55 < dviola> good
02:58 < NIkoObso_> Hi. got question to medusa: Medusa stops working after reading first password from the file (-P option), it should check all passwords in a file, what
02:59 < NIkoObso_> what's wrong* with that
03:26 < NIkoObso_> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/50430906/medusa-brute-force-stops-after-checking-1st-password-from-the-file
03:27 < NIkoObso_> Help please
03:33 < eletious> um... knowing nothing about medusa, i'll throw this out there - what are you using as a delimiter?  newlines, commas?
03:33 < NIkoObso_> syntax is correct for 100% bro
03:33 < NIkoObso_> cos it reads 1st pass
03:33 < eletious> yeah, but if it reaches unexpected input after first password then it'll exit
03:33 < NIkoObso_> and file is downloaded from git, so it has new lines correctly
03:33 < eletious> hmm
03:34 < NIkoObso_> As a curiosity,
03:34 < NIkoObso_> same file with pass WORKS for FTP
03:34 < NIkoObso_> but not for form some reason
03:35 < testerbeta> Hi
03:35 < testerbeta> who had issuse
03:35 < NIkoObso_> me
03:35 < testerbeta> with linux417
03:35 < NIkoObso_> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/50430906/medusa-brute-force-stops-after-checking-1st-password-from-the-file
03:35 < NIkoObso_> not me
03:35 < testerbeta> and chromium based browsers?
03:35 < NIkoObso_> that's not me
03:35 < testerbeta> [18797.419115] 26228 (chromium-beta): Uhuuh, elf segment at 0000564cd7991000 requested but the memory is mapped already
03:35 < testerbeta> [18918.278077] 26331 (chromium-dev): Uhuuh, elf segment at 00005623ea3c6000 requested but the memory is mapped already
03:35 < testerbeta> these browsers works really fine
03:36 < testerbeta> at linux 416.9
03:36 < HappyHobo> My internal modem is dying and won't stay connected so I bought an external thumbie and I don't know how to set it up.
03:37 < dviola> it should work out of the box
03:38 < dviola> if it doesn't, throw it away
03:38 < HappyHobo> it's conflicting with the internal and throwing away a 40 dollar piece of equipment is not an option.
03:39 < dviola> linux already includes most drivers in the kernel, the first thing you should do when getting new hardware is check that the drivers already exist in the kernel
03:40 < dviola> anything else is a waste of time, IMHO
03:41 < z3t0> hey all I am trying to figure out how to fix broken packages on centos
03:41 < dviola> HappyHobo: how is it conflicting? I would disable the internal one then
03:41 < z3t0> I had run a yum update -y which froze and I had to use C-c force kill it
03:41 < dviola> HappyHobo: check your bios or something
03:41 < z3t0> How would I go about fixing these broken packages? I tried using yum history redo but that still shows broken packages
03:45 < dviola> HappyHobo: when you plug the one one, do check dmesg to see what the kernel says about the new device
03:46 < HappyHobo> It says it's there.
03:46 < dviola> by "throw it away" I don't mean it in the literal sense, but if you can, consider exchanging it for a new one that doesn't give you that much trouble
03:47 < dviola> HappyHobo: is it usb?
03:48 < HappyHobo> yes and I just went into the bios and disabled the internal
03:50 < dviola> try just try using it, I guess it should work
03:50 < dviola> :P
03:50 < HappyHobo> it doesn't show up.
03:51 < dviola> if you do `lsusb' do you see it?
03:52 < dviola> I haven't used modems in years
03:53 < pankaj_> join #english
03:54 < HappyHobo> I can't get usbswitch and usbswitch-data, wdial and all of that.
03:55 < dviola> HappyHobo: can you pastebin the dmesg part when you connect the device?
03:55 < dviola> I'll try to look it up
03:56 < dviola> I tend to buy hardware without checking if drivers exist, like gamepads, but I make sure not to spend a lot of money on hardware when I know it's not going to work
03:57 < dviola> most things tend to just work these days though
04:00 < dviola> when I don't know if it's going to work*
04:01 < dviola> HappyHobo: what's the model for this device?
04:02 < HappyHobo> It's a an asus c1200
04:03 < HappyHobo> AC1200
04:03 < dviola> this is a router
04:03 < HappyHobo> usb modem
04:03 < Tech_8> dial up?
04:04 < HappyHobo> wireless
04:04 < Tech_8> so cable modem?
04:05 < HappyHobo> yep
04:05 < Tech_8> and whats the problem?
04:05 < HappyHobo> It won't find it at all
04:05 < HappyHobo> I disabled the internal hardware modem.
04:05 < Tech_8> wifi or cable connection?
04:06 < dviola> I got confused, I thought you were talking about one of those thumb devices to connect through 4G via pppd
04:06 < HappyHobo> wifi
04:06 < HappyHobo> no 2.4 or 5 g wireless
04:06 < Prof_Birch> Are there certain directories that are created by the kernel (such as proc)?
04:07 < HappyHobo> brb
04:07 < NIkoObso_> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/50430906/medusa-brute-force-stops-after-checking-1st-password-from-the-file
04:09  * jml2 https://www.linuxjournal.com/content/purisms-new-purekey-openpgp-security-token-windows-10-now-includes-openssh-vim-81-released
04:09 < jml2> windows 10 incluse "ssh" hahaha
04:18 < HappyHobo> I'm back.
04:19 < dviola> wb
04:19 < HappyHobo> It should just be plug and play.
04:20 < HappyHobo> This is such a crock of shit.  I can't remember who but someone told me to just stick it in, start the computer and bam it's on put in your name and password and you're on the net.
04:23 < HappyHobo> Hi [R]
04:27 < batteronizer> Hi, yesterday someone suggested this to me, "try unset CC and then call make with a target set to $(CC) --version"
04:27 < batteronizer> how do I set that as a target in a makefile?
04:28 < [R]> batteronizer: i'll take "things taht need more context for $500 alex"
04:29 < kurahaupo> Prof_Birch: /proc is mounted like any other file system - by the mount command invoking the kernel call -- but underneath that, it's a synthetic filesystem that doesn't store information. /dev may work either way - with devfs, or with a regular file system that's populated by the udevd daemon
04:29 < batteronizer> [R]: haha, well the person apparently wanted me to set `$(CC) --version` as a target in a makefile after unsetting the CC environment variable in bash
04:29 < [R]> yes... thats what you just said...
04:30 < [R]> kurahaupo: you're a synthetic file system
04:30 < kurahaupo> batteronizer: no, that's not a target, that's a command that's run for a target; you choose a random name for the target
04:30 < kurahaupo> [R]: indeed I am.
04:31 < [R]> kurahaupo: and devfs hasn't exited for like 50 years
04:31 < HappyHobo> https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2028061   the code doesn't work in the 2nd step
04:31 < batteronizer> kurahaupo: Yup, that's what I thought. Setting it as a target didn't make sense.
04:31 < kurahaupo> [R]: that's a million% exaggeration
04:32 < kurahaupo> batteronizer: the precise wording was "set a target to"
04:32 < [R]> HappyHobo: that seems unfortunate?
04:33 < batteronizer> kurahaupo: I'll ask them about it when they're online
04:33 < kurahaupo> Like "set a lawnmower to 'cut'"
04:33 < batteronizer> Ah gotcha
04:33 < [R]> kurahaupo: or telling the weapons officer "prepare to fire".... he should always be prepared!
04:33 < HappyHobo> I just bought this usb wireless dongle and it's not plug and play, it's a bloody nightmare [R]
04:33 < [R]> HappyHobo: QUITE unfortunate
04:34 < HappyHobo> Can you help?
04:35 < Pentode> what chipset is it?
04:35 < HappyHobo> Realtek I think
04:35 < batteronizer> HappyHobo: The guide is from 2012, likely not very useful today. Which dongle is it and which distro are you running?
04:35 < [R]> HappyHobo: you havne't expressed a problem yet... just "waa waa it doesnt work"
04:35 < Pentode> realtek devices are pretty well supported.
04:36 < HappyHobo> linux mint 18.3 and I hope to switch back to Antergos which requires an internet connection to install.
04:36 < Pentode> does it list a device when you run iwconfig?
04:36 < [R]> EXTREME antergos
04:36 < HappyHobo> It says no wireless connections on lo and eno1
04:37 < batteronizer> Dongle make?
04:37 < HappyHobo> Asus AC55
04:37 < turkeyhand> I'm trying to set up printing, I installed CUPS and print manager, and the printer driver from the AUR, the printer is there with lsusb, but the gnome settings panel says no printing services
04:37 < turkeyhand> with arch linux I should add
04:38  * [R] giggles
04:38 < [R]> "i installed cups" and "arch"...
04:38 < [R]> lol
04:38 < HappyHobo> batteronizer:  I disabled the internal wireless using the bios
04:39 < turkeyhand> !ops [R] doing nothing but trolling
04:39 < [R]> lol
04:43 < Bocaneri> [R], are we being an ass again?
04:43 < [R]> no...
04:43 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: did you start the cups daemon
04:43 < [R]> turkeyhand is jut a little too sensitive
04:44 < jml2> HappyHobo, you want wifi on "lo" ? XDXD
04:44 < jml2> HappyHobo, lolo
04:44 < turkeyhand> Prof_Birch, yeah I ran the command to start the cups daemon
04:44 < HappyHobo> No, I want wifi on my dongle, lo is there because it's local
04:45 < turkeyhand> bu it won't come up in the settings
04:45 < turkeyhand> as having printing enabled
04:45 < jml2> HappyHobo, dmesg |grep -i wifi or |grep -i ath
04:45 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: give me a second, I run arch and had this same issue. Let me try to remember what I did
04:45 < jml2> HappyHobo, lsusb -nn , can show the vendorid:deviceid
04:45 < turkeyhand> I found a "solution" that was guaranteed but it didn't work
04:45 < jml2> HappyHobo, typo, you dont need -nn
04:46 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: are you trying to print to pdf or an actual printer
04:46 < HappyHobo> both dmesg returned nothing
04:46 < jml2> HappyHobo, then there's a real problem
04:46 < jml2> HappyHobo, lsusb returns nothing too?
04:47 < HappyHobo> I have the vendorid and device id.
04:47 < jml2> HappyHobo, what does it say for that ath chip?
04:48 < jml2> HappyHobo, (gimme the vendorid:deviceid!)
04:48 < HappyHobo> 0b05:184c
04:48 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: and have you set up cups with it's web interface (http://localhost:631/)
04:49 < HappyHobo> there is also a broadcom5800
04:50 < jml2> HappyHobo, i cant see its device id https://wikidevi.com/wiki/List_of_Wi-Fi_Device_IDs_in_Linux
04:50 < jml2> HappyHobo, just a sec, it's on another page https://wikidevi.com/wiki/Realtek
04:51 < turkeyhand> Prof_Birch, I don't think so?
04:51 < jml2> i think..
04:51 < turkeyhand> Prof_Birch, trying to print to printer. I installed the driver from the AUR
04:51 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: Use the web interface (http://localhost:631/) It should let you set up the printers you have attached.
04:51 < turkeyhand> or from github
04:52 < turkeyhand> the printer shows up in lsusb
04:52 < turkeyhand> I can't access that webpage
04:53 < turkeyhand> maybe CUPS isn't running
04:53 < Prof_Birch> are you sure the daemon is running?
04:53 < turkeyhand> I WAS sure
04:53 < turkeyhand> how do I run it?
04:53 < HappyHobo> Is it there jml2
04:53 < Prof_Birch> systemctl start orgs.cups.cupsd.service
04:53 < Prof_Birch> Don't forget to enable it as well
04:54 < turkeyhand> Failed to start orgs.cups.cupsd.service: Unit orgs.cups.cupsd.service not found.
04:54 < turkeyhand> enable it before or after that happened
04:54 < saberu> hi could someone please help me with this certbot error? The requested apache2 plugin does not appear to be installed I've tried installing  python3-certbot-apache but it's already installed
04:55 < Prof_Birch> * org.cups.cupsd.service
04:55 < Prof_Birch> I added an s on org. my bad
04:55 < jml2> HappyHobo, i cant tell yet im reading this -- rtl8192ce
04:55 < jml2> HappyHobo, i mean -- https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2367097&page=3
04:55 < saberu> nm it magically worked now :/
04:56 < jml2> HappyHobo, perhaps there is a support for it if you try the latest bleeding kernel -- or if you try a modprobe with one of the drivers listed on the forum
04:56 < batteronizer> kurahaupo: I tried the experiment that they suggested: unset CC in bash and then printed ${CC} --version through make and it printed the version of gcc installed on my system
04:56 < turkeyhand> I Didn't catch that, it's daylight already
04:56 < turkeyhand> Prof_Birch, same thing but with enable instead of start?
04:57 < Prof_Birch> use start to ensure its running, then run the same command with enable instead of start, to be sure it starts on boot
04:57 < batteronizer> Which is 7.3.0. But if I don't unset CC, it is set to gcc-4.9 which is not present on my system. I'm not able to figure out where CC is being set to a value not present on my system.
04:57 < batteronizer> I've checked bashrc, bash_aliases, profile, bash_profile and their counterparts in /etc, but didn't find $CC
04:58 < jml2> HappyHobo, according to a user who has the module on 4.4 , they got it working
04:58 < jml2> HappyHobo, see if you can "modprobe 88x2bu" , then ip -d link show
04:58 < [R]> batteronizer: well, echo CC... what is it?
04:58 < jml2> HappyHobo, or "ifconfig -a"
04:58 < HappyHobo> I can't figure out what to modprobe
04:59 < jml2> HappyHobo, title is called "solved" -- so this user was having the same problem, https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2362669&page=2
04:59 < jml2> HappyHobo, modprobe that driver I gave
04:59 < batteronizer> [R]: echo CC prints CC lol
04:59 < jml2> HappyHobo, (up above)
04:59 < [R]> batteronizer: the variable...
04:59 < batteronizer> [R]: echo $CC gives gcc-4.9
04:59 < muffindrake> Greetings, is there a markdown/commonmark to nroff translator I should know?
04:59 < turkeyhand> Prof_Birch, where did you find this?
04:59 < [R]> batteronizer: and what does 'type gcc-4.9' say?
04:59 < Prof_Birch> the Arch wiki
04:59 < turkeyhand> I searched a bit and I didn't find any... ok I maybe didn't search enough
05:00 < turkeyhand> do I have to reboot before I can print?
05:00 < Prof_Birch> It can be a lot of information, so its easy to miss something
05:00 < Prof_Birch> No you shouldn't need to
05:00 < Prof_Birch> were you able to access the web interface
05:00 < batteronizer> [R]: "bash: type: gcc-4.9: not found"
05:00 < HappyHobo> modprobe didn't work it was fatal
05:00 < jml2> HappyHobo, it should be possible to use it, the only thing you have to do is to the rest of the homework :)
05:00 < [R]> well, grep all of everything for 'gcc-4.9'
05:00 < jml2> HappyHobo, it's all in your hands from here-on ... but your chipset should be possible to load with a driver
05:01 < batteronizer> [R]: lol okay
05:01 < turkeyhand> Prof_Birch, cool, it has "no printers" intead of the last message
05:01 < turkeyhand> looks lke I can add printers now, thanks!
05:01 < jml2> HappyHobo, (try latest kernel, and if you need to download/compile that driver if it not in your kernel package)
05:01 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: No problem! Glad I could help
05:02 < jml2> HappyHobo, other users were getting problems of the driver loading on earlier kernels... so you need to upgrade to most recent kernels for it to be effective
05:04 < HappyHobo> ok this model goes back to the store
05:04 < HappyHobo> I just tried with antergos live and it didn't find it.
05:07 < phinxy> I run dpkg-buildbackage and it complains libvulkan-dev is missing.  Fine because I dont need it.  After adding --disable-video-vulkan it should not require that dependency, no?  But it still errors.
05:08 < phinxy> It is SDL2.  Inside the debian/rules I add the --disable flag..  Perhaps its not read?
05:08 < phinxy> Ubuntu 18 might use something else?
05:08 < jml2> HappyHobo, plugable.com focuses effort on linux-compatible products
05:09 < [R]> phinxy: what is complaining?
05:10 < phinxy> dpkg-checkbuilddeps
05:10 < phinxy> unmet dependencies: libvulkan
05:11 < [R]> phinxy: the debian control files are calling it out
05:11 < [R]> you need to remove it
05:12 < phinxy> Whats a debian/control file?
05:13 < [R]> the debian directory coontains files tthat explain how the package is built
05:13 < jim> jml2, hi... we still need tl talk; I didn't feel even like we got started
05:14 < phinxy> Why would SDL2 depend on libmircclient ?
05:15 < [R]> you'll have to ask the sdl2 devs and/or the debain pacakgers
05:18 < jim> phinxy, that's a good question... in which dist?
05:19 < jml2> jim, well you can fuck off then jim
05:19 < jml2> lol
05:19 < jml2> jim, you ban me then ban me
05:19 < jml2> jim, :)
05:19 < jml2> jim, not like im going to miss this place anyways.
05:20 < jim> umm you really don't want to do that, that's one thing... and, it seems like you're getting defensive, and we should talk about it elsewhere
05:20 < jml2> jim, so do something about it
05:20 < jim> jml2, I didn't say I was going to ban you
05:20 < jml2> jim, afaik your pre-op Psi-Jack is a problem. XD
05:21 < jml2> HappyHobo, was I helpful?
05:21 < jim> I don't want to discuss that here
05:21 < jml2> HappyHobo, an op here hates me to lol and I still help you.
05:21 < HappyHobo> very much so
05:21 < jml2> yes I laugh.. so I make a joke but I help the user. don't be a dick jim
05:21 < phinxy> SDL2 compilation said it found support for EGL and OpelGL, Does this mean every program using this library will have GPU acceleration?
05:21 < phinxy> Opel..
05:21 < [R]> phinxy: you'll have to consult the source code and/or developers
05:22 < Bocaneri> Neither do I. jml2, take a break.
05:22 < jim> HappyHobo, that's good to know, and not altogether surprising... he is helpful when he's relaxed
05:23 < HappyHobo> Now I'm searching for a linux compatible plug n play usb wireless modem
05:23 < jml2> HappyHobo, that site I gave -- all the products they sell are linux-compatible (you can trust  me)
05:23 < jml2> HappyHobo, they test their products with linux to make sure it works with it..
05:24 < jml2> HappyHobo, but the product you bought can work, it's just that you have to finnick around with the latest drivers and may even have to compile something
05:24 < jim> Bocaneri, before taking action, give me a chance to talk to him
05:24 < phinxy> Find me a GPM compatible USB mouse jml2
05:24 < jml2> Bocaneri, take action wuss
05:24 < jml2> Bocaneri, you woman
05:24 < jml2> Bocaneri, you're a big guy.
05:24 < jml2> lol
05:24 < HappyHobo> I need it to work as soon as I plug it in so I can get back on Antergos,
05:24 < jml2> Bocaneri, like I'm a real problem because you don't have a life
05:25 < jml2> lol
05:25 < HappyHobo> Antergos wont install without the internet.
05:26 < HappyHobo> jim will any of them work right as they boot up on a livecd?
05:26 < jim> wow :(
05:26 < Bocaneri> Can't let that kind of thing go on.
05:26 < HappyHobo> What kind of thing?
05:27 < Bocaneri> What jml2 was doing.
05:27 < jim> well two things are very clear, he's defensive and he's jumping way ahead
05:28 < kurahaupo> batteronizer: CC is a Makefile parameter, not an environment variable. It's probably the template makefile that comes with make.
05:28 < phinxy> Ops, if CFLAGS is -O2 -O3, which one is in effect?
05:29 < batteronizer> kurahaupo: I wrote the makefile myself
05:29 < kurahaupo> batteronizer: there's a large set of default rules that's loaded before your Makefile
05:30 < [R]> phinxy: the last one seen is used
05:30 < kurahaupo> However I don't off hand know where they are
05:31 < jim> he's showing the chip on his shoulder, knocking it off himself, and even if he finds it at his feet, he'll think we took it
05:31 < pnbeast> You took his chip?
05:31 < jim> I only saw it for an instant
05:31 < rascul> i did, and i ate it
05:31 < Bocaneri> Don't know what the deal is, and can't really afford to care. When he behaves, he stays. When he doesn't, he goes byebye. It's not the person who gets banned (in concept), it's the behaviour.
05:32 < batteronizer> "${CC} --version" in my makefile prints https://pastebin.com/BdAfDUYa if I don't unset $CC in bash
05:32 < HappyHobo> jim  I'm not trolling but you never answered sir do any of the wireless dongles work right off the bat on a live cd
05:32 < batteronizer> After I unset CC in bash and run make, it prints the installed version of gcc and compiles correctly
05:33 < batteronizer> kurahaupo:
05:33 < [R]> pnbeast: potato or nacho?
05:33 < jim> I don't know the answer to that... and, generally, you'd need a driver for the chipset and the firmware it needs
05:33 < batteronizer> [R]: potacho
05:33 < [R]> batteronizer: sounds gross
05:34 < Bocaneri> And it probably varies by distro, HappyHobo. :\
05:34 < jim> siracha potacho
05:34 < batteronizer> [R]: "Nature's most exquisitely crafted camping food." says UD
05:34 < HappyHobo> I couldn't figure it out.  I want to get this one working and I've read all the stuff and it either doesn't work or just doesn't make sense to my pitiful mind.
05:34 < pnbeast> [R], b0b came out of his little box.  Why are you still in yours?
05:34 < Bocaneri> Mmm... sriracha... now I'm hungry.
05:34 < ||JD||> dude don't talk about food, I'm starving
05:35 < [R]> pnbeast: lol
05:35 < jim> ||JD||, then eat something or drink some water... or something
05:35 < HappyHobo> If you can get it to work I'll stick with linux mint 18.3 jim
05:37 < ||JD||> jim: can't right now, I'm stuck fixing some SQL that doesn't want to work
05:37 < jim> HappyHobo, mint is (as you know) derived from debian... what debian does for kernel image packages, is it compiles every module (driver or otherwise) possible, and the kernel image packages comes with the kernel and all those modules
05:38 < jim> what db engine?
05:38 < HappyHobo> jml gave me the module number and I modprobed it but it didn't work
05:38 < ||JD||> MySQL
05:38 < jim> maybe mysql has explain analyse (put query here)
05:40 < HappyHobo> jim I'm going to have to take the laptop apart and replace the internal card aren't I?
05:41 < jim> HappyHobo, wait, I thought you were going to get a gondle
05:41 < jim> err dongle
05:41 < jim> do you already have one?
05:42 < HappyHobo> I have a dongle but I can't get it to work and I modprobed what was supposed to be the driver and it said Fatal
05:42 < ||JD||> jim: it's a really complicated one with multiple JOINs, I think I almost have it anyway
05:42 < jim> separate em out and add em back one by one
05:43 < jim> HappyHobo, ok, let's find out
05:44 < jim> do you know which chipset it is?
05:44 < HappyHobo> I believe it's a realtek i
05:45 < jim> lemme check something
05:45 < HappyHobo> 0b05:184c
05:50 < Prof_Birch> Are coreutils all that different than busybox
05:51 < jim> HappyHobo, do you find anything interesting in dmesg?
05:54 < HappyHobo> just it's description
05:54 < Prof_Birch> and is there any particular advantage to gnulibc vs bionic
05:55 < jim> ok... does the machine have net some other way? alternatively, can you somehow transfer small text files to a machine that does have net?
05:55 < HappyHobo> one second this time there is and there are 5 or 6 pages
05:56 < HappyHobo> the internal modem was working then it's down again
05:56 < jim> so it's not that it doesn't work, it's just that it loses connection/
05:56 < jim> ?
05:56 < HappyHobo> it says iwlwifi
05:57 < jim> intel wireless
05:57 < HappyHobo> It says request scan called when driver not ready.
05:58 < jim> so, the driver must be present, agreed?
05:58 < Prof_Birch> HappyHobo: Are you using a surface?
05:58 < HappyHobo> for the internal yes
05:58 < HappyHobo> Not sure about the dongle, I think I need the dongle.
05:59 < jim> is there an internal wireless?
05:59 < HappyHobo> yes, that's the one that goes in and out
06:00 < jim> HappyHobo, I didn't know I was solving a problem when I was upgrading my net to gigabit...
06:00 < jim> but when I replaced my wireless access point, from then on my connection was rock solid
06:01 < jim> I replaced it with a much newer device
06:01 < HappyHobo> well the internal wouldn't start ever with ubuntu or zorin, antergos it used to be solid for a while, linux mint 18.3 it works for 2 minutes then I have to restart then after doing that about four times I have to reboot the unit.
06:02 < jim> HappyHobo, do you know which kernel and driver version was on each?
06:02 < HappyHobo> no sir, I don't.
06:03 < jim> ok, do you know which version of the OS you had in each case?
06:04 < jim> (and did you build your own kernel in any of these cases?)_
06:04 < HappyHobo> ubuntu 18.04, the latest Zorin, the latest Gecko(I forgot that one), Antergos 18.5
06:04 < HappyHobo> I never have any luck rolling my own kernel
06:04 < jim> ok, so can we assume that's a no?
06:04 < HappyHobo> Yes sir.
06:05 < jim> so most likely in each case it was the default kernel for the version of the OS you had installed?
06:05 < HappyHobo> yes sir.
06:06 < jim> could you remind me which ones worked and which didn't?
06:06 < NIkoObso_> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/50430906/medusa-brute-force-stops-after-checking-1st-password-from-the-file
06:08 < HappyHobo> I switched from Antergos thinking it was something to do with the current kernel it had then from there it just got worse with each distribution.  Antergos worked the best.  Ubuntu and Gecko wouldn't connect at all.  Zorin came up for a few seconds then fought to get back up.  Mint works for half a minute maybe two
06:08 < jim> so really, angergos worked when you first installed it?
06:09 < jim> antergos
06:09 < HappyHobo> I figured the internal was dying so I bought this Asus 55C usb wireless dongle.Antergos stayed up the longest but still had to fight with it constantly.
06:09 < Psi-Jack> Antergos is pretty decent. It's primarily based on Arch with some overlays they maintain, plus an installer.
06:10 < HappyHobo> Antergos is amazing imho
06:10 < HappyHobo> I can't go back to Antergos
06:10 < jim> so you were fighting with it from the first time you installed it?
06:11 < jim> what were the symptoms them?
06:11 < HappyHobo> It used to work well then it started to drop all the time.
06:11 < Psi-Jack> "drop?"
06:11 < [R]> drop it like it's hot
06:12 < HappyHobo> lose connection and have to be restarted then it stopped restarting
06:12 < jim> do you remember what you did around the time it started to drop?
06:12 < HappyHobo> probably on the web looking at stuff
06:12 < HappyHobo> facebook
06:12 < first-order> IIRC Antergos falls under the same category as Bridge and Archbang: literally prepackaged Arch.
06:12 < jim> like: any new networking hardware, or upgrade anything?
06:13 < HappyHobo> just the internal intel wireless, now was hoping to go with a usb dongle
06:13 < first-order> Manjaro's pretty much the Arch distro line's Ubuntu.
06:13 < Psi-Jack> Manjaro is way different. A total fork.
06:14 < first-order> 'The Arch distro line's Ubuntu,' so yeah, a total fork.
06:14 < Psi-Jack> Yeah.. Umm, sure...
06:14 < Psi-Jack> "Fork" is more direct. :p
06:15 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: Sounds a lot like hardware problems.
06:15 < first-order> Although Ubuntu seems to be implemented a tad better from my understanding.
06:15 < HappyHobo> jim if I could get this dongle to work as soon as it starts or modprobe a driver when it first starts I can reinstall antergos and have a solid computer again
06:16 < jim> Psi-Jack, unless the hardware actually failed somewhere along the way, I'm suspecting driver versions
06:16  * first-order considers RHEL or CentOS to be the only forks that actually have anything to gain over their upstream.
06:16 < jim> and I'm also suspecting the WAP
06:16 < HappyHobo> It seems that way Psi-Jack.  I'm an old school shadetree mechanic.  I'm used to repairs by replacement little bits at a time.
06:17 < first-order> 10-year support lifecycle and absolute stability over the upstream - Fedora - in this case.
06:17 < HappyHobo> This computer is on that router so is my buddy's and my cellphone and they never drop get slow sometime but never drop
06:18 < Psi-Jack> Well, Intel WNIC is generally pretty reliable. I will say though, I've had a lot of WAPs in my day, and most of them are simply crap that you get for home use.
06:18 < Psi-Jack> Until I replaced my WAP/Router with the dedicated UniFI WAP, I always had some level of connectivity issues wirelessly.
06:19 < Psi-Jack> And dongle. Wifi USB device?
06:20 < HappyHobo> Yes sir
06:21 < HappyHobo> I figured being asus it would work right out of the box.
06:21 < Psi-Jack> Gotcha. So, yeah, internal WiFi must be some PITA WiFi.
06:21 < jim> well he also has an internal
06:21 < jim> do you remember the internal chipset?
06:21 < Psi-Jack> The only decent WiFi comes from Intel or Atheros, pretty much.
06:21 < HappyHobo> n4400 I think
06:22 < Psi-Jack> Realtek, RaLinkTech, Broadcom == trouble.
06:22 < jim> and atheros is starting to turn their back on linux
06:22 < s0k_iT> I hate Realtek
06:22 < Psi-Jack> jim: Not quite.
06:22 < turkeyhand> I didn't think intel made good wifi until... I found out it's pretty good
06:23 < HappyHobo> is there a way to disable the internal and make this dongle functional
06:23 < turkeyhand> Psi-Jack, were you the person who told me about boot-repair?
06:23 < Psi-Jack> jim: Due to the FCC regulations as of late, they've had to close-source some aspects of their WiFi.
06:23 < Psi-Jack> turkeyhand: No
06:23 < jim> well people say ath9 might be ok, but 10 is bad
06:23 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: You don't need to "disable" it, just don't use it.
06:23  * HappyHobo is confused.
06:23 < Psi-Jack> jim: Sometimes Atheros is behind, but they'll catch back up.
06:24 < turkeyhand> I was told that "boot-repair" would repair this win10 / arch install, is that likely?
06:24 < first-order> I got no real issues with the Intel adapter I currently use.
06:24 < first-order> Of course running a generally stable distro might help a tad, I dunno.
06:25 < jim> same here
06:25 < jim> maybe we should do a small experiment
06:25 < first-order> Don't have any real issues with Arch, but Debian Stable kicks ass as far as being low-maintenance in comparison goes.
06:25 < jim> see if a debian netinstall with firmware sees the net reliably
06:26 < HappyHobo> How do I use this dongle?
06:26 < first-order> I'm running a Debian netinstall right now.
06:26 < jim> you're installing debian?
06:26 < first-order> Installed. A few months or so ago.
06:27 < HappyHobo> I'll just take it apart and buy a factory replacement.  Sorry for bothering y'all.
06:27 < Psi-Jack> Heh. Debian would be the last distro I would test for wifi. :p
06:27 < first-order> Just needed to download the Intel firmware blob and it detected it on external media fine.
06:27 < HappyHobo> motherfuck
06:27 < Psi-Jack> Especially now, with most if not all already wifi having to have binary blobs to interface with them.
06:27 < first-order> Ironically Ubuntu 16.04 was a bit more difficult.
06:28 < rud0lf> how should i mask 10.8.xxxx subnet?
06:28 < rud0lf> 10.8.0.0/16 ?
06:28 < jim> HappyHobo, truck. please.
06:28 < HappyHobo> motherfuckingtruck
06:28 < [R]> rud0lf: however you want...
06:28 < rud0lf> :)
06:28 < [R]> do you need a /16? go for it
06:28 < rud0lf> i mean, 10.8.x.x is private address pool, right?
06:28 < rud0lf> i don't know its size
06:28 < jim> what's wrong?
06:28 < [R]> 10.x.x.x is private
06:28 < [R]> you can use whatever size you want
06:28 < rud0lf> hm so 16 is okk
06:28 < rud0lf> thanks
06:29 < jim> some ISPs use 10.* as its ips
06:29 < HappyHobo> we went round and round and round again and we never established how to use this dongle jim  sorry so very sorry for being a PITA sorry for the language
06:29 < first-order> Psi-Jack, Well, I've been running it for a month or maybe a bit over, from a netinstall, without issues in that area, with no intent to go back to Arch.
06:30 < first-order> (I can dig what Arch is trying for, but you tend to spend more time working on it than using and enjoying it, Debian is the other way around)
06:30 < jim> HappyHobo, I'm postulating there's nothing wrong with either the internal or the dongle
06:30 < HappyHobo> the dongle is new so I'm sure it's fine but I don't know how to get it to hook up
06:31 < Psi-Jack> first-order: Hmm.. Some people say that, but you know.. I don't find that to be the case. Once setup, it's been pretty solid. Especially with my AUR build setup I did to make a repo for other systems .
06:31 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: Just because its "new" doesn't make it "fine"
06:31 < jim> do you have a separate machine?
06:31 < HappyHobo> I know I need to do a modprobe and a usbswitch and all of that but I can't get the right driver for it
06:31 < HappyHobo> I don't know how to do the rest of it
06:31 < HappyHobo> supposedly once you modprobed the right driver it will work automatically
06:31 < HappyHobo> supposedly you have to go through a long list of steps
06:32 < jim> HappyHobo, you're ircing with us and your connection seems solid... care to comment?:)
06:32 < Psi-Jack> What is this USB? Brand, model, etc?
06:32 < first-order> Constantly running updates, fixing breakages, even reinstalling the whole thing if it's a fatal breakage.....
06:32 < HappyHobo> I'm on my Dell 2120 netbook, the one with the issue is my Dell 6520
06:32 < HappyHobo> Psi-Jack:  Asus 55C
06:33 < first-order> Can you swap the wireless adapter out?
06:33 < Psi-Jack> first-order: I update like. once, maybe twice a week. Minor conflicts that were easily solved every time. And I keep nightly borgbackup backups so I never re-install anything.
06:33 < jim> and the dell 2120 is using a wireless connection?
06:34 < first-order> If what I'm thinking is correct, that E6520 should be as easy to get under the hood on as my E6440 is/
06:34 < HappyHobo> Yes the 2120 is using a wireless connection from the townhouse next door
06:34 < jim> HappyHobo, if you want us to help you have to focus on the conversation
06:34 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: That is an incorrect model.
06:35 < first-order> And in my case, it's just removing one big bottom panel and I'm in.
06:35 < Psi-Jack> AC55?
06:35 < jim> HappyHobo, perfect... can you try the townhouse next door on the machine that's flaking out?
06:35 < HappyHobo> usb-ac55
06:35 < Psi-Jack> There we go.
06:35 < HappyHobo> Yes, that's where my internet comes from.
06:36 < HappyHobo> I give my buddy 25 bucks a month and he gives me the net
06:36 < HappyHobo> I prefer the 6520 but the 2120 is my little rock.
06:36 < Psi-Jack> Ugh. MediaTek
06:36 < jim> what is your 6520 trying to connect to?
06:36 < Psi-Jack> Utter garbage.
06:36  * first-order is running an Intel 6235 for his wireless.
06:37 < HappyHobo> the same router
06:37 < jim> ok, I thought you said before it was connecting to something different?
06:38 < HappyHobo> It's about 50 foot to my friend's bedroom from mine.  No, it's connecting different, it's steady, it's solid.
06:38 < Psi-Jack> Heh. USB-AC55 has MediaTek (horrible), while the USB-AC55 B1 has Realtek (less horrible, surprisingly)
06:38 < HappyHobo> should I get a different one then try Psi-Jack?
06:39 < first-order> Prior to that, I was running an Iogear dongle that had a Realtek chip (thought it had an Atheros at first) that worked reasonably enough.
06:39 < Psi-Jack> You'd be better off trying to find a USB WNIC that actually has Atheros, if you can find one.
06:39 < jim> you don't have your own internet connection at all?
06:39 < Psi-Jack> USB ones are a bit difficult to find in the mess of Realcrap ones.
06:39 < HappyHobo> No sir.
06:39 < HappyHobo> How about a linksys?
06:39 < Psi-Jack> Linkcrap no.
06:40 < HappyHobo> That's what they have at best buy.
06:40 < jim> and both machines are trying to connect to the same router (your buddy's next door)? the essid is the same on both machines?
06:40 < first-order> Psi-Jack, It worked for what it was, but the Intel is a bit better, at least for the 6235 in this laptop, haven't tried 7260 yet.
06:41 < Psi-Jack> I know of 0 USB based Intel WNICs
06:41 < PoopyScrotum> greetings, all
06:41 < HappyHobo> Yes sir
06:41 < PoopyScrotum> Heil Hitler!
06:42 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: You would need to get every model number of every device sold in the store for USB WiFi, and look them up individually to determine if they even have a chance to have a nice Atheros chipset.
06:42 < PoopyScrotum> wow sigyn is a bitch now, sieg heil
06:42 < PoopyScrotum> hi jim
06:42 < PoopyScrotum> blow me
06:42 < PoopyScrotum> ops dont scare me
06:42 < PoopyScrotum> i just evaded a kline
06:43 <@jim> you didn't avoid me :P
06:43 < first-order> Or swap out the internal wireless card with a 6235 if he has the '6520' I think he has.
06:43 < Psi-Jack> I don't know what actual device he has.
06:43 < HappyHobo> https://www.bestbuy.com/site/linksys-next-gen-ac-dual-band-wireless-ac600-usb-network-adapter-black/5174100.p?skuId=5174100
06:43 < Psi-Jack> I seem to recall a "Surface" in the discussion?
06:44 < jim> so do I, what happened to that?
06:44 < first-order> I don't think there's a Surface 6520 that I know of.
06:44  * first-order is thinking of a Latitude E6520 mainly.
06:45 < HappyHobo> That's it
06:45 < first-order> And the 6-series from experience is easy as fuck to get inside.
06:45 < jim> so it's not a surface, and you don't have one?
06:45  * first-order owns a 6-series.....
06:45 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: If that's it, it actually has Atheros.
06:46 < HappyHobo> No I have a latitude e6520
06:46 < Psi-Jack> https://wikidevi.com/wiki/Linksys_WUSB6100M
06:46 < Psi-Jack> Oh, laptop?
06:46 < first-order> If my assumptions are correct, the E6520 should just need the removal of one big bottom panel to get to the innards on.
06:46 < first-order> Just like my E6440.
06:47 < Psi-Jack> Yeah, it's usually better to replace the mPCIe WiFi when you can.
06:47 < HappyHobo> It doesn't have a panel.
06:47 < Psi-Jack> Question is, is it dual-band WiFi/BT, or just WiFi?
06:48 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: It does. :)
06:48 < HappyHobo> I just looked
06:48 < Psi-Jack> That or maybe remove the keyboard, sometimes.
06:48 < first-order> Oh yes it does, one big bottom panel and you're in.
06:49 < HappyHobo> is the whole bottom the panel?
06:49 < first-order> Yes.
06:50 < first-order> IIRC the E6x20, E6x30, and E6x40 have that as a common feature.
06:50 < HappyHobo> Oh yes this dongle is going back to staples.  I'll order one and just deal with the micromachine for a while
06:50 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: Yeah, he's talking about the whole pannel: https://ssli.ebayimg.com/images/g/EbcAAOSw1MBZ3DUc/s-l1600.jpg
06:50 < first-order> Under-hood access is ridiculously easy on these machines.
06:51 < first-order> I own one, and I upgraded the RAM on here shortly after getting it, I should know what the -record scratch- I'm talking about.
06:51 < Psi-Jack> I'd definitely recommend looking into that. Check if if your current mPCIe does just WiFi, or WiFi+BT (do you even use BT?) and I can make amazon recommendations for a replacement mPCIe.
06:52 < first-order> I'll recommend the Intel 6235 off the bat out of experience.
06:52 < Psi-Jack> Sounds like a good recommendation. :)
06:53 < first-order> Both the wifi and BT work great on it, both in Windows and in Linux.
06:53 < first-order> But no, the Latitude 6-series is one of the easiest laptops to get under the hood on.
06:53 < Psi-Jack> And $15 off Amazon, cheaper and better than your hack job USB dongles.
06:54 < first-order> A few screws and you have access to pretty much the whole thing.
06:55 < first-order> Very easy if you want to upgrade the RAM, for example.
06:55 < pnbeast> [R], you're gonna let that one go?
06:55 < first-order> Or even upgrade the CPU.
06:56 < first-order> Which the next step up from my i5-4310m is an i7-4610m, so not really worth it.
06:56 < HappyHobo> OK so how do I know if I'm getting a good card.
06:56 < first-order> If it works right.
06:56 < first-order> In both platforms.
06:57 < first-order> Which I know the Intel 7260 is flawless in Windows so far, but I have not tried it in Linux.
06:57 < [R]> pnbeast: LET IT GO... LET IT GO...
06:57 < first-order> 6235 I know for a fact is flawless in both.
06:58  * first-order ran it in both.
06:59 < jim> there won't be an answer... let it go...
06:59 < first-order> Thing came in with a W7 installation, then I ran W10 on it for a while, before ultimately running Linux on it.
07:00 < first-order> No trouble in either case.
07:00 < first-order> So yeah, 6235 is a good card.
07:01 < HappyHobo> I'm confused.
07:01 < first-order> Actually, threw W10 on here initially when I stuffed an SSD in here.
07:01 < Psi-Jack> HappyHobo: https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Delectronics&field-keywords=Intel+6235
07:02 < first-order> (which IIRC fast boot in EFI mode on an SSD is one of W10's biggest pluses)
07:03 < first-order> As in booted pretty much immediately off POST.
07:04 < HappyHobo> thanks Psi-Jack
07:05 < first-order> Linux distros also boot pretty quick, but there's a noticeable difference in boot speed vs. a W10 installation.
07:06 < first-order> And that's on a 2.5" SATA SSD.
07:07 < m1KeY_> for some reason i can receive files on my vbox with netcat but i can't send files. i can't send over this rsa key.
07:08 < m1KeY_> would anyone know why?
07:10 < pnbeast> m1KeY_, I have no idea, but you know about ssh-copy-id?
07:11 < m1KeY_> oh no?
07:11 < m1KeY_> does that transfer over keys?
07:11 < luke-jr> m1KeY_: might help to use a tool actually designed for sendign files
07:11 < m1KeY_> ^^
07:12 < m1KeY_> was just weird. netcat works either way with arch but not ubuntu server.
07:15 < well_laid_lawn> does the ubuntu have a firewall running m1KeY_ ?
07:16 < m1KeY_> i turned off ufw. not sure what else is on it. i just installed it.
07:17 < oerheks> sudo ufw allow 22/tcp
07:39 < folorn> list
07:39 < Bocaneri> What list are you looking for?
07:42 < likcoras> I assume the list of irc channels...?
07:51 < jim> likcoras, long time ago, listing out irc channels on big nets was found to be problematic.... instead, there is a bot, alis, that can assist you in looking for channels on the Freenode irc net. To start, /msg alis help
07:57 < meretrix> If I run a long-running command remotely like "ssh user@host cmd" that prints 1 line to stdout every 100ms, is it likely that stdout buffer back-pressure will slow the execution of the command?
07:58 < meretrix> Am I correct in assuming that there should be no slow-down until 64KB of output is buffered?
07:58 < meretrix> And at that point, execution will pause until room is made in the stdout buffer?
07:59 < ziggylazer> That doesnt sound like a good plan at all
08:00 < ziggylazer> Writing code like that is like asking for problems. The inherent design of the code is flawed
08:01 < ziggylazer> What is Memory Overflow
08:01 < ziggylazer> 1. The phenomenon of writing beyond the boundaries of a destination buffer in memory. Learn more in: Memory Corruption Attacks, Defenses, and Evasions
08:01 < tcpdump> whats the correct way to leave a process running and free up my cli?
08:02 < ziggylazer> like gedit &
08:02 < tcpdump> Im trying to use my pi to display live video on an rtsp stream on the 7" display that i bought.  I can get it to work using omxplayer when I run the following in the foreground: omxplayer --avdict rtsp_transport:tcp --win \"0 0 960 540\" rtsp://admin:password@10.100.10.140/streaming/channels/101/ --live -n -1
08:02 < tcpdump> when I add a  & to fork it then it doesnt show on the display, but does show in the process list.   Any thoughts on the right way to do it?
08:02 < meretrix> tcpdump: There's no "right" way to do it.
08:02 < meretrix> Forking to the background works.
08:03 < meretrix> But you might want a terminal multiplexer like screen or tmux for a nicer user interface.
08:03 < ziggylazer> Always a plus
08:07 < ziggylazer> Saw someone brushed this topic earlier and wanted to follow up. I got a windows machine that needs to stay windows. Running linux in VM. And that has some major issues. So now I am thinking of going to old dual boot on a separate disk. But is things like GRUB even around anymore=
08:09 < meretrix>  /join #rust
08:09 < Bocaneri> ziggylazer, I dualboot all my brand-new machines. Grub is certainly still around.
08:09 < ziggylazer> Bocaneri, a nice. No issues?
08:09 < Bocaneri> I've not run into any, but be advised I only do this once every two or three years.
08:10 < ziggylazer> Sound great. I'll go with that then. VM has its place but so many limitations also
08:10 < Bocaneri> Like whaty?
08:11 < ziggylazer> Networking can be tricky
08:11 < ziggylazer> Working with security issues especially
08:13 < PerseusPlease> hi
08:14 < SuperSeriousCat> GRUB is not going anywhere anytime soon, ziggylazer
08:31 < Tech_8> good morning
08:33 < tcpdump> Is there a way to chain linux commands, one after the other?
08:33 < SuperSeriousCat> With "&&"
08:33 < SuperSeriousCat> Like "apt get update && apt-get upgrade -y"
08:41 < Tech_8> hi
08:41 < Tech_8> anyone here
08:42 < SuperSeriousCat> Probably. But guess they hide now that the troll is back
08:43 < tcpdump> Tech_8: nope
08:43 < tcpdump> Also, screen worked well.
08:43 < jim> Tech_8, hi
08:44 < jim> SuperSeriousCat, please don't do that, he hasn't trolled this time yet
08:45 < jim> maybe he will, maybe he won't... if he doesn't, there's no need to tense up
08:46 < jim> Tech_8, did you need something specific?
08:49 < Tech_8> nope
08:49 < jim> heym0e, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lm6F5-qYONo&list=RDEcd9dPO8BhE&index=2
09:14 < phinxy> dpkg-buildpackage failed at some late stage with dpkg-shlibdeps.  Now, after setting the --ignore-missing-info flag... How can I re-run the thing without a complete re-build?
09:20 < jim> phinxy, is it your package? either way, does it use make?
09:21 < phinxy> Yes, and a debian/rules
09:22 < phinxy> first step: back-up
09:23 < jim> yeah, I'd say so... well how long should the build take
09:23 < jim> ?
09:25 < phinxy> scummvm, It was only 300MB but took 2 hours or so
09:25 < phinxy> Many .c files
09:26 < zer0downtime> does anyone use irssi?
09:29 < Bocaneri> zer0downtime, what's up?
09:31 < LeelooMinai> I look for humans. Can anyone help me?  I am not a troll. This is a serious question.
09:31 < Bocaneri> Ain't nobody here but us wood sprites.
09:32 < LeelooMinai> I feel alone. Have been looking for humans for a long time and I am getting very sad and tired.
09:32 < LeelooMinai> Bocaneri: Are you human?
09:32 < Bocaneri> That partially depends on your willingness to acknowledge and observe the channel's topic.
09:33 < zer0downtime> Bocaneri: i'm just trying it out and am wondering on how to go about making irssi display window number that corresponds to particular channel by which i mean
09:33 < LeelooMinai> Bocaneri: You know it doesn't.  I need help.
09:33 < Bocaneri> LeelooMinai, if it isn't help with GNU/Linux, look elsewhere.
09:34 < zer0downtime> i get at all times somewhere whole mapping so i can know which number to pick when alt+window_number
09:34 < LeelooMinai> I need one human. There's either one or none.
09:34 < LeelooMinai> THere's nothing in between and everything in between.
09:35 < Bocaneri> Guessing I'm not humanm, after all.
09:35 < Bocaneri> zer0downtime, I'm not expert with irssi. Have you tried asking in #irssi? (and no, I'm NOT saying "get lost")/.
09:36 < zer0downtime> xD
09:36 < zer0downtime> this guy is freakin genius
09:36 < zer0downtime> moving on to irssi ;p
09:36 < luke-jr> zer0downtime: did you try /join #channel?
09:37 < zer0downtime> luke-jr: yeah, the thing is the keyboard shortcut is faster :P
09:37 < Bocaneri> The /join #channelname thing is what I do in both irssi and weechat because I can never remember what the damn window or buffer numbers are.
09:37 < pingfloyd> weechat and irssi are very similar
09:37 < luke-jr> I like how Quassel lets you assign the window shortcut-key numbers
09:37 < pingfloyd> I like weechat a little better though with how it formats output
09:38 < zer0downtime> pingfloyd: but you also have alot of options in irssi just pick themes made by its users
09:38 < pingfloyd> you can do m-a to cycle through all windows with any activity
09:39 < pingfloyd> zer0downtime: I used to use irssi
09:39 < pingfloyd> zer0downtime: for a time I was on the fence between it and weechat, but weechat won out in the long run for me
09:39 < zer0downtime>  pingfloyd: i'm gonna try out weechat and decide which is best for mysel
09:39 < zer0downtime> f
09:40 < iodev> zer0downtime: I'm using weechat
09:40 < iodev> it's pretty nice
09:40 < pingfloyd> zer0downtime: yeah, you should
09:40 < iodev> if you had irssi, then you will like it
09:40 < pingfloyd> they're pretty much the best 2 irc clients imo
09:40 < zer0downtime> we are talking that it's easier to setup or functionality?
09:40 < longxia> zer0downtime: does "/window list" help you somewhat?
09:40 < Bocaneri> I tried looking at their respective scripting interfaces. As I remember it, irssi's was confusing and Weechat's scripting documentation is mostly for python (which I DON'T do).
09:40 < MrElendig> irssi still doesn't deal with long messages correctly out of the box
09:41 < zer0downtime> i also don't want to spend whole lot of time on configuration
09:41 < pingfloyd> weechat deals nicely with long urls (alt+l)
09:41 < MrElendig> Bocaneri: the official docs covers all the languages in equal amounts
09:41 < pingfloyd> that puts the display into a very raw format without columns so the url will work
09:42 < MrElendig> the weechat one, sadly, is just a really thin layer over the C api
09:42 < pingfloyd> zer0downtime: I think weechat has a nicer ootb config between the 2
09:42 < Bocaneri> That's not necessarily an evil thing, actually.
09:42 < pingfloyd> when I used to use irssi, I had tweaked it pretty good
09:43 < zer0downtime> longxia: not really ;/ i get nothing
09:44 < longxia> zer0downtime: you need to look in the #1 window to see its output
09:44 < pingfloyd> i.e., the command window
09:44 < pingfloyd> or 'server window'
09:45 < zer0downtime> pingfloyd: i don't suppose you still have your config? :P
09:45 < zer0downtime> anyways thanks guys per your suggestion i'm gonna look into weechat
09:46 < MrElendig> zer0downtime: make sure to install a up to date version, most distroes ships ancient versions of it
09:46 < zer0downtime> MrElendig: no worry about that, i use archlinux
09:49 < Psi-Jack> I'm still surprised vim 8.1 isn't in arch yet. heh
09:51 < MrElendig> it is holiday time, all the devs are drunk
09:52 < luke-jr> most people don't celebrate Pentecost O.o
09:52 < MrElendig> 8.0.1838 isn't that far behind 8.1 either
09:52 < iflema> well get em a coffee... black
09:56 < Psi-Jack> Holiday? What holiday?
09:56 < MrElendig> some silly christian thing that no one knows what is about anymore
09:57 < MrElendig> but still gets you some days off to go drinking
09:57 < MrElendig> pentecost or whatever it is called in english
10:00 < seveneleven> if i detach a non persistent disk in opennebula and then reattach it, does this imply my data will be loss?
10:00 < MrElendig> "non persistent"
10:01 < pingfloyd> 7th Day Adventist?
10:01 < MrElendig> easy to test yourself
10:02 < seveneleven> MrElendig, there's no option to select persistent on my vps provider, this implies just a power loss would result in data loss
10:02 < luke-jr> about Pentecost, which is off-topic here: http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/15614b.htm
10:03 < MrElendig> why would you use a vps that doesn't provide any persistent storage?
10:04 < seveneleven> MrElendig, good question, it never came to my mind they use non persistent disks until i found out the hard way
10:04 < pingfloyd> luke-jr: so I guessed right
10:04 < seveneleven> the question is rather, why would a vps provider doesnt offer persistent storage
10:04 < seveneleven> not*
10:05 < seveneleven> that's what i see in opennebula "0	sda	Ubuntu 16.04	76.5GB/200GB	NO	Detach  "
10:05 < seveneleven> "NO" is for the persistent
10:05 < luke-jr> pingfloyd: no
10:06 < rcf> pingfloyd: newadvent is actually catholic, despite the name.
10:06 < MrElendig> seveneleven: hey, there are people who are interested in that kind of things, like Ross Ulbricht
10:06 < luke-jr> well, the website isn't Catholic, but it hosts a lot of Catholic content
10:08 < Hooloovo0> I'm looking at a netbooted box right now, and am trying to get networkmanager to take over dhcp
10:09 < Hooloovo0> currently, I think, the kernel is doing dhcp automatically because I supplied ip=dhcp to the command line
10:10 < Hooloovo0> well, it's definitely getting dhcp, but I'm not sure what has control of the ethernet device when it's booted and stable
10:11 < rcf> MrElendig: are they really going to just assume it's non-persistent, though? I mean unless they want to get to meet him in prison....
10:11 < Hooloovo0> sometimes, you don't need persistent storage
10:12 < seveneleven> MrElendig, that might explain why my VM didn't work anymore when I rebooted it ... I guess this is what results when trying to save $2/mo on hosting :\
10:12 < Hooloovo0> for example, if you just need it to do a computation, then you can do it and be done
10:12 < MrElendig> seveneleven: you can get a vps for 2usd/month
10:13 < Hooloovo0> I signed up for a company with moderately cheap arm servers so I can compile gentoo on a native arm machine
10:13 < seveneleven> MrElendig, i payed $4/mo for that one, but it also comes with 200GB storage
10:13 < MrElendig> https://lowendbox.com/tag/kvm/ :p
10:13 < seveneleven> yeah I found it on lowendbox
10:13 < Hooloovo0> I don't really care if it's persistent: I just copy over my current gentoo tar and chroot in every time
10:16 < rcf> Hooloovo0: for netboot you're getting the IP from the BIOS. Nothing actually owns it, but I'm not sure how to get networkmanager to accept an interface that's still up.
10:17 < Hooloovo0> no, the linux kernel does it's own dhcp when it gains control of the ethernet card
10:17 < Hooloovo0> it doesn't care about the bios
10:18 < Hooloovo0> for example, I could load a kernel from a flash drive, and give it "ip=dhcp root=/dev/nfs nfsroot=10.0.0.3:/root-path/" and it would boot happily
10:19  * rcf did not know this....
10:21 < Hooloovo0> it will be the same ip, almost always, since dhcp servers generally assign the same ip to the same mac address
10:21 < Hooloovo0> but it's not guaranteed because of nasal demons
10:21 < seveneleven> MrElendig, okay i see what my provider is doing, they're saving the image before deattaching the non persistent disk, then they reattach the saved image
10:23 < dongbag> Hi guys
10:23 < dongbag> I have a stupid irratating problem, I'm trying to  serial into a beaglebone... everything is going fine
10:23 < dongbag> but... for some reason neither screen or putty are getting the newline character
10:24 < dongbag> so if I have to write something long it just wraps over on the same line
10:25 < iflema> poor fing
10:25 < rcf> Hooloovo0: well, thank you for giving me another part of the kernel to read over that I've never thought about before
10:25  * iflema bash subsystem... lol
10:31 < seveneleven> im back in my VM! first thing im doing now is backups
10:31 < seveneleven> cheers
10:34 < uberwag> hi, anyone having knowledge about creating a custom live iso? i am trying to find a good article on this, the livecd-tools are a bit outdated i think? anyone can help on this topic?
10:39 < bla> Can someone suggest a simple Iaas with less moving parts than OpenStack? For private use? Something a bit better than virt-manager.
10:40 < Linnak> Hi, Does anyone uses HP Elitebook 820 G1 with slim docking station?
10:41 < Linnak> Is everything working good?
10:41 < TwistedFate> hello
10:41 < TwistedFate> can i catch a ip camera stream with mpv?
10:42 < Hooloovo0> Linnak, is something not working for you, or are you researching before you buy?
10:42 < Hooloovo0> what do you mean by catch, TwistedFate
10:42 < Hooloovo0> *?
10:42 < TwistedFate> Hooloovo0: i want to watch a stream from my phone that's streaming it's camera over ip
10:42 < Linnak> Hooloovo0: Just researching befor buying
10:43 < Hooloovo0> I'm nearly positive that you can, but I haven't done it myself
10:43 < bazhang> https://superuser.com/questions/766437/capture-rtsp-stream-from-ip-camera-and-store TwistedFate
10:43 < bazhang> can do
10:43 < Hooloovo0> no experience with that specific machine Linnak :(
10:46 < bla> Linnak: hp zbook14 with radeon + nvidia had much problems with displayports on docking station.
10:46 < bla> Linnak: because of requiring MST support. It might've gotten a bit better recently.
10:47 < bla> Linnak: I also use an ACPI-hack to disable radeon to get some useful battery on this HP.
10:47 < bla> Linnak: if this model has only Intel video this might be simpler.
10:47 < zer0downtime> weechat is awsum
10:47 < Linnak> This has only intel
10:48 < Linnak> As already bought the docking station there are two options for me. 820 G1 or Folio 1040 G1.
10:49 < Linnak> Maybe an X230 thinkpad. Portability, ,backlit keyboard and IPS screen is a must for me.
10:49 < Linnak> No plastic toys
10:50 < bla> I had folio once. And like this series anyway. Would stay away from double graphic solutions for now.
10:51 < bla> + fullHD screen to your requirements.
10:51 < j0seph> I've been using an HP 250 G6 for some time now
10:51 < bla> Thinkpad is widely appreciated; never had one. It's keyboard scares me.
10:51 < Linnak> I'm a bit confused with one thing. Screen resolution. I like 1368x768 besause I can see everything. (font resizing, non native resolution doesn't look good at all) but some says they wouldn't buy anything else than FullHD
10:52 < j0seph> I've had more or less zero problems with my 250 G6.
10:52 < bla> j0seph: nice. I'll have to change laptop in some time so I aggregate info like that.
10:52 < bla> Linnak: It's a matter of setting DPI and using apps which can scale font.
10:52 < j0seph> Aside from the odd keyboard, given that the keys have the american shapes in spite of the UK layout.
10:53 < j0seph> So if you're American unlike me, it should be a wonderful thing.
10:53 < j0seph> I will admit that the casing does feel a bit flimsy around the screen, but that's really it.
10:54 < Linnak> I like Thinkpad's long way keyboard much better, than HP's short movement without curvature
10:54 < bla> Nah. Europe. This exact model would be a bit too big for me.
10:54 < j0seph> bla: Which one?
10:55 < Linnak> I'm afraid I have to buy them all and sell which I dond't like
10:55 < luke-jr> Linnak: screen resolution deals with quality of the screen, not sizes
10:55 < bla> Linnak: I dislike Fn at the edge instead of control.
10:55 < bla> j0seph: 250 g6 - it's 15'', isn't it?
10:56 < j0seph> bla: Ah, sure is. You're looking for a 13'' maybe?
10:56 < Linnak> luke-jr: Quality and size
10:56 < oiaohm> j0seph: keyboard shape and country chars on them have no direct link.
10:56 < j0seph> oiaohm: i didn't imply otherwise
10:57 < bla> j0seph: I'm at 14'' currently and it a bit too heavy *sometimes*.
10:57 < Linnak> luke-jr: Everithing looks smaller on a high resolution display, and the problem is if you want to make them look more visible it will look worse
10:58 < oiaohm> j0seph:  given that the keys have the american shapes << There is not really a American shape.   All the common keyboard designs back in history to typewriters designed and made in the EU/UK.
10:58 < bla> Linnak: try experimenting with xrandr --dpi X (110 maybe?) and restarting the apps.
10:59 < j0seph> bla: you may like a 13'' maybe. I'll have a look around and see.
10:59 < Linnak> If you change the font size the whole look of the font will look like a different font type. Sometimes on websites the text doesn't fit in their boxes and so on. Or if you change the sesolution of the display it will be blurry.
10:59 < Linnak> Screen scaling is still not a solved problem on any OS
11:00 < Linnak> DPI same story
11:00 < luke-jr> Linnak: only if your software is of poor quality
11:00 < j0seph> oiaohm: the shape of such keys i'm talking about are ones I've only seen on laptops distributed within america as opposed to all others i've seen outside. that is where my naming thereof came from.
11:01 < Linnak> luke-jr: Sorry I don't uderstand what software poor quality means to you
11:01 < bla> With gnome-terminal, firefox and Emacs I mostly believe the scalling problem to be solved. But there might be some other software with problems. ;)
11:01 < luke-jr> using bitmaps instead of vector text/graphics
11:01 < Linnak> I see. űi think most of software uses still pitmap
11:02 < Linnak> But Just think on my experience
11:02 < bla> j0seph: I'll have to dive in some deeper research eventually. Starting with HP/Dell/Thinkpad brands, then going to specific model.
11:02 < bla> j0seph: last time I wanted all-in-one laptop with i7, 16GB RAM, etc. Currently I'm mostly on my desktop with laptop serving as a terminal + something more occasionally.
11:04 < bla> j0seph: Still I like my terminals FullHD + IPS with a mechanical keyboard. :P
11:04 < j0seph> bla: those are the manufacturers i would trust. dell is a bit on the expensive side but mind you their products are pretty good. i've heard a good portion of them if not all of them run most linux distros with no problems. haha, your specs were more demanding than mine! i wanted an i5 with 8gb ram and a 256GB SSD, which landed me at the HP 250 G6
11:05 < bla> j0seph: Yeah. I wanted a portable device with openable and replaceable insides. Hence zbook 14. I even have two batteries and can replace them on the go.
11:05 < luke-jr> j0seph: trust in what sense? O.o
11:06 < bla> j0seph: at the same time it was almost light and almost thin.
11:06 < j0seph> luke-jr: with my child, obviously
11:06 < luke-jr> x86 stuff is all backdoored
11:07 < j0seph> bla: sounds like something a Thinkpad might offer you if you don't mind the chunky blocky appearance that a lot of people seem to be fond of
11:07 < luke-jr> if I wanted a trustworthy laptop, I'd probably go for a Novena
11:08 < j0seph> luke-jr: on a more serious note, i mean trust in the sense of them delivering a decent product that i can expect will work to an acceptable degree.
11:09 < luke-jr> I see
11:09 < oiaohm> j0seph: what is most getting you is the UK keyboard for type writers had two layouts.     USA keyboard layout is 1 key less than the UK layout with the most keys.   But the same number as the portable.  So USA keyboard matches 1 of the 2 UK keyboards.
11:10 < oiaohm> j0seph: so the USA keyboard shape and size comes from a UK keyboard before they added a extra key.
11:10 < bla> Heh I mostly look at the keyboard and want to have \ above 1-line enter and control on the edge.
11:11 < bla> Don't need numpad. Want capslock for another control. And like my F1-F12 row normal, but meh. Don't use it anyway
11:13 < Linnak> luke-jr: better a used x200
11:13 < j0seph> oiaohm: this is interesting but unfortunately i don't really have much care nor time to delve that far into such things. maybe it would be a good thing to familiarise myself with when i've time.
11:14 < luke-jr> Linnak: better how?
11:14 < j0seph> bla: ah well, i can say that the 250 G6 has a one-line enter and a CTRL in a corner. I can vouch for that much
11:14 < oiaohm> bla: US International keyboard layout .   Is the one with the \ above the enter.   Its also the one designed to type all the accented chars of all EU languages.
11:15 < Linnak> cheaper, and with libreboot you will have only free software
11:15 < edd_lc> where is the wheel group defined to be able to use sudo? sudoers file is empty, except for root. `grep wheel /etc/pam.d/*` yields nothing. yet, a new user cannot use sudo unless I add him to the group wheel. how does this work?
11:15 < luke-jr> Linnak: but you have a CPU with exploits; what good is removing the Intel/NSA backdoors, if you're vulnerable to *anyone*?
11:17 < zer0downtime> thanks, weechat is great
11:17 < zer0downtime> configuration is also straightforward
11:18 < nolanv> ziggylazer: If you're using an older (pre-GUID partitioning) system, and want to multiboot Linux (or FreeBSD, for that matter) with Windows, an alternative to GRUB is BootIt BareMetal, by Terrabyte Software (I'm not them). It's cheap and works well.
11:22 < MrGrz> p
11:22 < MrGrz> hi
11:23 < MrGrz> hi
11:24 < edd_lc> nevermind, found the line in /etc/sudoers.d
11:24 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> p
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < MrGrz> hi
11:25 < RayTracer> !op MrGrz spam
11:26 < MrGrz> sorry
11:26 < Bocaneri> That'll be enough of that, thanks.
11:26 < j0seph> RayTracer: did you mean !ops or does !op work too?
11:26 < RayTracer> j0seph: the former
11:26 < faLUCE> hello. is there a newsreader with GUI that allows to send control messages to a newsgroup ?
11:27 < Bocaneri> "control messages"?
11:27 < RayTracer> j0seph: apparently it worked anyways ;)
11:27 < j0seph> RayTracer: haha :D not bad
11:28 < faLUCE> Bocaneri: yes, like cancel messages
11:29 < Bocaneri> I use usenet but am not aware of these "control messages"; do they differ from ordinary posts?
11:29 < faLUCE> Bocaneri: yes, they are commands sent to the server.
11:30 < RayTracer> Bocaneri: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Control_message
11:30 < MrGrz> i like this channel
11:31  * Bocaneri fires up his newsreader to see
11:32 < MrGrz> hi .... what time is it now?
11:32 < Bocaneri> faLUCE, the newsreader called 'pan' has a field in the "post" dialog box called "extra headers" - could that be useful?
11:34 < RayTracer> MrGrz: your shell can answer that with the command "date"
11:34 < faLUCE> Bocaneri: unfortunately pan doesn't work on my distro. it's very buggy
11:34 < faLUCE> I wonder if I can modify extra headers with thunderbird
11:35 < Bocaneri> faLUCE, what's your distro?
11:35 < faLUCE> Bocaneri:  lubuntu
11:35 < faLUCE> Bocaneri: I can install any other client
11:35 < RayTracer> faLUCE: thunderbird can at least send cancel
11:36 < faLUCE> RayTracer: I can't find how
11:36 < MrGrz> sorryhi raytracer .... i come from indonesia
11:37 < RayTracer> faLUCE: I don't have newsgroups configured here so I can't check right now, but I believe it's in a message specific menu option via top menu
11:38 < RayTracer> MrGrz: so the web tells me it's somewhere between 16:38 and 18:38
11:38 < faLUCE> RayTracer: I checked and could not find any option for that
11:40 < Bocaneri> Heh... I do a search on "newsgroup" and "usenet" in Ubuntu repos and come up with basically nothing interesting.
11:40 < Bocaneri> Interest in usenet appears to be essentially dead.
11:40 < MrGrz> i'm back
11:41 < raxbg> Hi I  am not able to load a CPU governor, what might be the reason? CPU is Ryzen 1700 and kernel version is 4.16.
11:44 < hexnewbie> raxbg: What does not able mean?
11:48 < pingfloyd> Kane?
11:48 < MrGrz> mata kane
11:48 < hexnewbie> Is that a porn star name?
11:49 < MrGrz> hexnesbie: yes
11:49 < MrGrz> fvck
11:49 < j0seph> fail
11:50 < MrGrz> i quit....bye
11:50 < j0seph> what an interesting character
11:50 < TwistedFate> is there a network cable test software?
11:51 < pingfloyd> use a fox and hound
11:51 < hexnewbie> TwistedFate: ping -f? I would suggest getting hardware, the cheap ones will measure individual wires, the expensive ones frequency characteristics and conformance to standards.
11:52 < hexnewbie> And things like cable length if you can't read the numbers written on the cable ;)
11:52 < RayTracer> TwistedFate: I'm not aware of one, but some BIOS show cable length.. I think you're too high in the stack of pure software to be of use
11:52 < TwistedFate> hexnewbie: at work, we are able to do cable test from a terminal when logged on a cisco switch
11:52 < TwistedFate> it shows cable/wire pairs
11:52 < TwistedFate> and if they are ok
11:52 < hexnewbie> TwistedFate: That was hardware doing it, as it was supported by the Cisco switch.
11:53 < pingfloyd> built in cable tester
11:53 < pingfloyd> with proprietary software to use it
11:53 < TwistedFate> pingfloyd: hexnewbie ah, so no libre alternative :( shame
11:54 < RayTracer> if the bios can do it, it could probably expose an interface to it, but I think nobody did that
11:54 < pingfloyd> it's a hardware issue
11:55 < hexnewbie> TwistedFate: If the hardware lacks testing capabilities, you can't fix that with software. It's got nothing to do with libre or not.
11:55 < TwistedFate> i see
11:57 < pingfloyd> foss isn't in the business of pushing snake oil products
11:57 < RayTracer> most cheap rj45 crimp kits include hardware testers so it's a question of ~$20
11:58 < hexnewbie> TwistedFate: Upper management shut us down on an fancy tester, so we do use ping -f and regular ping and stuff like that. It doesn't tell you much, but it does detect some of the more common failures. Hardware testers aren't cheap, but aren't too expensive either, though so you can buy one.
11:59 < pingfloyd> typical management
11:59 < pingfloyd> penny-wish and pound foolish
12:06 < hexnewbie> Given that the critical cabling we use are short pre-made cables with redundancy links and a quarter of it are non-UTP, they may have been right. It's still a PITA when you have to pass a cable across the building for someone's pet project and the link doesn't work, though.
12:26 < Umeaboy> Is this a false positive error?
12:26 < Umeaboy> https://hastebin.com/ulidanuvux.tex
12:27 < nicholasBPM> In my logfile I find lots of 54.36.148.193 - - [20/May/2018:12:02:29 +0200] "GET /manual/fr/mod/mod_logio.html HTTP/1.1" 404 3773 "-" "Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; AhrefsBot/5.2; +http://ahrefs.com/robot/)"
12:27 < nicholasBPM>  whats this?
12:29 < revel> Umeaboy: It's saying "it'd be better if you did that, but what you did works too", I think. i.e a warning, not an error.
12:30 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: i mean, have you looked at that http url in the UA?
12:30 < revel> nicholasBPM: If you have a website, then you're going to get hundreds bots scanning your server to find obvious vulns in whatever it's running.
12:30 < revel> s/hundreds/hundreds of/
12:31 < nicholasBPM> BCMM, yeah but the url do not work
12:31 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: uh, works for me
12:31 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: there's a section entitled "What is AhrefsBot?" on the page
12:31 < nicholasBPM> revel, thanks, so i guess its normal
12:31 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: did you visit "http://ahrefs.com/robot/", or "http://ahrefs.com/robot/)"?
12:32 < revel> It's not desirable, but more or less normal.
12:32 < revel> Not all of the bots are malicious, but a large amount of them are.
12:32 < nicholasBPM> BCMM, 54.36.148.193 is not my ip
12:32 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: i've got to ask; what do you think that logfile is for?
12:33 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: you're looking at a log of requests made to your website. the ip address is the address of the client that made the request
12:34 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: the last part of the log line is the "user agent" of the client that made the request - are you familiar with the UA header?
12:34 < revel> (user agent)
12:36 < BCMM> nicholasBPM: in any case, read http://ahrefs.com/robot/ for an explanation of what this particular bot was doing. google "robots.txt" if you want to make it stop.
13:18 < dreadkopp> hey guys. is there any mssql alternative. Need to use a software that only supports mssql databases currently running sqlexpress, however 10GB DB size / 1GB memory limit will become a problem in near future. Is there any alternative besides paying M$ a truckload of money?
13:18 < dreadkopp> (and using an alternative software in the first place)
13:19 < gloomy> Hi :)
13:19 < pingfloyd> fell for the old MS bait and switch?
13:19 < luke-jr> dreadkopp: MySQL, PostgreSQL, …
13:20 < gloomy> Anyone knows of a (cli?) utility that can display detailed info on a given file?
13:20 < luke-jr> gloomy: less
13:20 < pingfloyd> can you convert it to a non-proprietary db?
13:20 < gloomy> luke-jr uh... that's a pager?
13:20 < hexnewbie> gloomy: mc, press F3 on file
13:20 < dreadkopp> luke-jr: PostgreSQL has full support for MSSQL syntax ? since MySQL doesn't
13:20 < gloomy> hexnewbie mc?
13:20 < luke-jr> gloomy: it translates non-text files too
13:20 < luke-jr> dreadkopp: doubt it
13:21 < pingfloyd> gloomy: file
13:21 < hexnewbie> gloomy: yeah, if you install all dependencies the viewer will call the respective conversion or info tool for a wide number of file types
13:21 < pingfloyd> also stat
13:22 < oiaohm> dreadkopp: postgresql syntax is closer to orcale db.
13:22 < dreadkopp> luke-jr: yeah, then those won't help me :/  i guess there isn't some middleware that translates mssql requests to mysql syntax, eh ?
13:22 < gloomy> hexnewbie ah, midnight commander :0 never used it, seems a bit overkill
13:22 < hexnewbie> gloomy: e.g. 'identify' for images, antiword for .doc, pdf2txt for pdf, mpg321 for .mp3, ogginfo for .ogg
13:23 < gloomy> pingfloyd file seems like what I was looking for :)
13:23 < gloomy> thanks
13:23 < pingfloyd> dreadkopp: https://www.easyfrom.net/articles/mssql_to_mariadb/
13:23 < pingfloyd> yw
13:24 < oiaohm> dreadkopp: https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/Converting_from_other_Databases_to_PostgreSQL#Microsoft_SQL_Server  there are a stack of conversion tools.  Most are not on fly.
13:24 < dreadkopp> pingfloyd: thanks, that looks like a start. i however still need some live-parsing-middleware ...
13:25 < dreadkopp> hmmm.... guess i need to track all the queries used by that crap software and write some parser myself. hurray :/
13:25 < pingfloyd> probably
13:26 < pingfloyd> I think any middleware is going to be expensive
13:26 < oiaohm> pingfloyd: its normally not done.
13:26 < dreadkopp> mssql license is effin expensive as well :P
13:26 < BluesKaj> Howdy folks
13:26 < oiaohm> dreadkopp: the problem with doing on fly conversion between databases is the overhead.
13:26 < pingfloyd> all part of the "value added" racket
13:27 < dreadkopp> and every windows server i can shut down is a good windows server
13:27 < hexnewbie> dreadkopp: It doesn't sound like something that's realistically possible.
13:27 < pingfloyd> dreadkopp: it will be worth it in the long run
13:28 < oiaohm> dreadkopp: Only on the fly I have seen work was a wrapper from orcale db to postgresql db.  But those databases have direct simplarities.
13:29 < pingfloyd> dreadkopp: this is how proprietary software works https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F1Juq2WXOMA
13:30 < dreadkopp> oiaohm okay. i was thinking some small service listening the port the mssql would have been with a dictionary to translate the queries. but i guess i would need to parse the results as well because M$ :/
13:31 < oiaohm> dreadkopp: https://www.enterprisedb.com/database-compatibility-technology-oracle with orcale on postgresql it required plugin in another sql query language into the database so it could perform.
13:32 < luke-jr> dreadkopp: it's probably possible, but you may end up needing to pay someone to write it
13:32 < oiaohm> dreadkopp: that the problem converting from one sql langauge to another with the differences on fly turns into a total living nightmare consuming cpu time like the plague.
13:33 < dreadkopp> oiaohm well since i am currently sitting on 7/8 cores unused because mssql express that wouldn't be the problem.... but yeah... guess a bloody expensive m$ license it is :/
13:35 < hexnewbie> Providing the results will be easy, the TDS foreign data wrapper does, well, the opposite. Translating the queries is anywhere from very hard to unsolvable, though. Simple selects and inserts will probably need minor adjustments, but anything unusual will be nightmare.
13:36 < luke-jr> hexnewbie: for this kind of use case, you could probably just hard-map the queries
13:36 < oiaohm> hexnewbie: you are forgotting how broken MSSQL syntax is.
13:36 < hexnewbie> oiaohm: I have not actually used it (or used it like once), so I don't really know :)
13:37 < pingfloyd> do they bastardize SQL?
13:37 < oiaohm> pingfloyd: nice things like limit and offset don't exist in MS sql langauge.
13:37 < luke-jr> pingfloyd: MS stands for Microsoft..
13:38 < hexnewbie> pingfloyd: Microsoft bastardises everything. And everyone bastardises SQL. So it would be damn unusual if they didn't.
13:38 < oiaohm> pingfloyd: and a few things are bastardized
13:38 < pingfloyd> luke-jr: I know
13:38 < pingfloyd> luke-jr: I know what mssql is
13:38 < pingfloyd> I've had to work on it before
13:38 < luke-jr> pingfloyd: I was hinting at what hexnewbie said
13:38 < pingfloyd> oh
13:38 < pingfloyd> that's their MO
13:39 < pingfloyd> that's why to me the priority should be moving away from it
13:39 < pingfloyd> so you can take back what is yours
13:39 < oiaohm> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/603724/how-to-implement-limit-with-microsoft-sql-server  << How you do limit in mssql server turns into to server abuse on everything else.
13:39 < pingfloyd> nobody extorting you
13:40 < oiaohm> Some how mssql manages to optimize hack around misisng limit feature and having insanely long sql that you can do in short line on everything else.
13:40 < pingfloyd> express is a good example:  most users/companies/orgs won't worry about the artificially imposed limitations until their backs are up against the wall and they're painted into a corner.  MS knows this and exploiting it is in their DNA.
13:41 < phogg> oiaohm: that's the SQL standard way
13:41 < pingfloyd> they know the almost all of those users will bite the bullet and buy a license
13:41 < pingfloyd> until they run into the next imposed wall and upgrade the license and so on
13:42 < phogg> in the end the standard didn't go for limit, they created windowing functions. Using row_number() over (order by whatever) you can get the same result as limit: a post-sort offset into the result set at good speed.
13:43 < oiaohm> phogg: https://www.postgresql.org/docs/9.1/static/tutorial-window.html  The current standard says cursers or window features todo.
13:43 < phogg> the MS SQL way is the 'top' keyword, which is similar to limit and row_number over order by only less powerful, except that it allows allows e.g. 'top 10%' which is both something the others do not support and not too useful
13:44 < oiaohm> phogg: and of course MSSQL does not support those correctly.
13:44 < phogg> oiaohm: the current standard isn't defined in the postgres 9.1 docs
13:45 < oiaohm> phogg:  ISO SQL:2003  tells you to use windowing functions defineed by the database you are using.
13:45 < oiaohm> phogg: nice for a super vague standard for you.
13:45 < phogg> oiaohm: a better reference is http://troels.arvin.dk/db/rdbms/
13:45 < nicholasBPM> I use namespace together with multiple openvpn, if one openvpn connection gets stuck what is the command to restart that process? (sorry for my bad english)
13:46 < phogg> oiaohm: ISO SQL absolutely does define both common table expressions AND windowing functions, including row_number()
13:47 < phogg> oiaohm: while I agree that the mysql/postgres 'limit' keyword is appealingly simple the standard way is most certainly more powerful, if more counterintuitive, and the outcome of taking a step back and thinking about what more powerful primitives would look like.
13:55 < oiaohm> phogg: its the limit and offset combination is nice.   https://www.postgresql.org/docs/8.4/static/sql-select.html#SQL-LIMIT  In 2008 standard this comes implement under the complete set of FETCH and OFFSET
13:56 < phogg> oiaohm: Yes. The standard is considerably more verbose.
13:57 < phogg> I would not, however, give up windowing functions for the world. 'row_number() over (order by foo)' is okay, but 'rank() over (partition by x, order by y)' is awesome sauce
13:57 < phogg> and don't get me started on CTEs. You can do all kinds of crazy stuff with CTEs, especially in Postgres and T-SQL.
13:59 < phogg> the fact that mysql doesn't support windowing functions is a source of frequent irritation for me
14:00 < phogg> The SQL standard is frequently more verbose. For example, there is no standard isnull() function, but there is coalesce() which is API compatible and has a superset of features. Notice a pattern here?
14:01 < oiaohm> phogg: the most evil thing about postgresql is the ablity to write a stored procedure in C and you hope the person who does that really knows how to audit code well.
14:05 < phogg> oiaohm: With posgrees you can write stored procedures in most languages. For SQL Server you can use a handful, including C#. For Oracle Java is most common. All of them are somewhat problematic.
14:05 < phogg> I've done postgres procedures using Perl. There's not often a good reason to since their procedural dialect is powerful enough for most uses
14:07 < oiaohm> phogg: in C with it running in the core database engine process if you stuff it up kiss good by to everything.
14:08 < oiaohm> phogg: fairly much any that postgresql support bar C is safer.
14:09 < ic2000> what is a well supported linux distro that ships with kde?
14:10 < badsekter> ic2000: there's kubuntu
14:10 < dgurney> opensuse, kubuntu, fedora's kde spin, ...
14:12 < ic2000> dgurney, how does one decide which one to pick lol
14:13 < fendur> read some of the google results.
14:13 < dgurney> ic2000, reading up-to-date reviews is a good start, but the best way is to try them all and see which one you like the most
14:13 < dgurney> there's really no way around it
14:17 < ic2000> is kde neon any good
14:25 < jack_rip_vim> anyone who has been having fun with ARM9?
14:26 < jack_rip_vim> I got a NUVOTON ARM9 chipset, and I am quite confused with the SDRAM part manual.
14:34 < jonan> are there any bar replacements that support png or jpg images as the actual bar instead of 1 color and fonts?
14:38 < jack_rip_vim> jonan: bar background pic?
14:38 < jonan> jack_rip_vim: yes
14:38 < jack_rip_vim> jonan: xfce?
14:40 < jonan> jack_rip_vim: hm i'm not sure if i can use the xfce bar with i3, i should have prefaced saying that tbh
14:41 < jack_rip_vim> jonan: you want to find some bar for i3?
14:41 < jonan> jack_rip_vim: yes, in particular some that would support a background image for a bar, though i'm not sure how many of those exist. ideally i'd love to stick with polybar but as it doesn't support this i'm willing to experiment a bit
14:43 < jack_rip_vim> jonan: you can try docky, and it allows you to change it style, it can be like a bar. :)
14:45 < jonan> jack_rip_vim: thanks mate i'll take a look!
14:45 < jack_rip_vim> jonan: :)
14:50 < V7> Hey all
14:51 < jack_rip_vim> hey V7
14:51 < V7> Can't get why lighttpd doesn't show a page when I'm adding a line "server.errorlog   = "/var/log/lighttpd/error.log"" in lighttpd.conf file, but without it all works
14:52 < V7> Do I need to add this line in a specific section ?
14:52 < kurahaupo> V7: can the server write to that file? Owner & permissions?
14:52 < V7> Hm
14:52 < V7> kurahaupo: I'll check
14:53 < V7> kurahaupo: Yes
14:53 < V7> It has a permission
14:54 < V7> drwxr-xr-x 1 lighttpd lighttpd     80 Jan 29  2017 lighttpd
14:54 < kurahaupo> Well that eliminates one obvious problem.
14:54 < V7> -rw-rw-rw- 1 lighttpd lighttpd 0 Jan 29  2017 error.log
14:54 < V7> Also as you can see no modification was made to this file since 2017
14:55 < jack_rip_vim> V7, does the line has been supported on lighttpd?
14:55 < V7> jack_rip_vim: What do you mean ?
14:55 < jack_rip_vim> server.errorlog   =
14:55 < jack_rip_vim>             "/var/log/lighttpd/error.log"
14:55 < jack_rip_vim> try remove the "
14:56 < V7> Oh, I've copied this line from their manual site
14:56 < V7> on archwiki
14:56 < V7> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/lighttpd
14:56 < V7> "Basic logging" section
14:57 < kurahaupo> Does the manual version match your installed version of lighttpd?
14:57 < jack_rip_vim> V7, do you add the server.module?
14:58 < V7> kurahaupo: I don't see anything about version on manual page, but on local it says: ">lighttpd/1.4.45 (ssl) (Jan 29 2017 02:47:01) - a light and fast webserver"
14:58 < nicholasBPM> I run my openvpn connection using namespace, if my openvpn connection gets stuck is kill -HUP PID a good way to go?
14:58 < V7> jack_rip_vim: Yes
14:58 < kurahaupo> V7: does it pass the -tt pre-test?
14:59 < V7> kurahaupo: 2018-05-20 12:58:47: (server.c.824) No configuration available. Try using -f option
15:00 < kurahaupo> V7: as per the page you just sent me
15:02 < V7> Oh
15:02 < V7> You mean start in console with -ttt
15:03 < V7> -tt *
15:09 < V7> Thank you very much kurahaupo
15:09 < V7> And jack_rip_vim
15:09 < V7> :)
15:09 < jack_rip_vim> V7,you are welcome!
15:13 < kurahaupo> V7: so did that show the problem?
15:13 < V7> Yup, syntax error in config file was
15:15 < mawk> nicholasBPM: SIGTERM would be better
15:16 < mawk> also, you're having success with using network namespaces nicholasBPM ?
15:18 < nicholasBPM> mawk, yeah thanks! It works perfekt running single applications.
15:19 < nicholasBPM> mawk, thank you I will google SIGTERM. The vpn works fine but i know my vpn provider isnt that stable.
15:20 < mawk> stability of vpn provider shouldn't make your own local openvpn instance crash, yes ?
15:21 < BluesKaj> normally I just use sudo killall openvpn..works well
15:21 < mawk> can't you rather tweak some keepalive settings in openvpn ?
15:21 < mawk> yeah that sends SIGTERM afaik BluesKaj
15:21 < mawk> but that will kill every openvpn instance, wherare nicholasBPM wants to kill a particular instance
15:22 < nicholasBPM> mawk, ah did not think about that, i have the default keepalive settings
15:22 < BluesKaj> ok mawk , thanks for the tip....din't know that
15:22 < mawk> he has several instances running in parallel in different network namespaces
15:23 < memcorrupt> hello everyone, how can I escape characters like space or " of grep's result? if awk, then what expression?
15:23 < memcorrupt> idk awk's syntax actually
15:23 < mawk> you're doing something dirty it seems memcorrupt
15:23 < mawk> but you can simply ask for bash to escape
15:23 < mawk> A=$(something); echo "${A@Q}"
15:24 < mawk> with a recent enough version
15:25 < memcorrupt> mawk, even multiple lines?
15:26 < mawk> probably
15:27 < mawk> it will output a thing that bash can parse to recreate the text
15:27 < mawk> for instance $'a\nb' for a multiline string
15:28 < memcorrupt> my problem is that I want to use every line as a value in an array, but I get every word instead :/
15:28 < mawk> ah
15:28 < memcorrupt> I've got bash v4.3
15:28 < mawk> then do IFS=$'\n'
15:28 < mawk> no need to escape anything
15:28 < memcorrupt> aw
15:28 < jack_rip_vim> hi BluesKaj
15:28 < memcorrupt> thanks mawk
15:28 < mawk> put IFS back to old value after the array assignment
15:28 < memcorrupt> alright
15:29 < mawk> old value is something like IFS=$' \n\t\v'
15:37 < uberwag> im trying to create a custom centos livecd with xfce desktop, is there someone that can help me? i found a fedora iso with xfce and copied the anaconda.cfg for use with kickstart file, but that also implies that i have a source of centos with xfce and this is not shipped in the default centos repository.. how would i approach this, anyone can help??? thanks
15:41 < jack_rip_vim> uberwag: some manual on the web, http://www.zerodev.it/automating-centos-netinstall-with-kickstart-and-remastering.html
15:41 < BluesKaj> hi jack_rip_vim
15:41 < jack_rip_vim> hi BluesKaj
15:41 < uberwag> jack_rip_vim: ok will have a read tehre
15:43 < saltlake> Hi, i have a question about ssh-keygen
15:43 < saltlake> ssh-keygen asks to type passphrase, do I have to type my user account's password here?
15:44 < ayecee> no
15:44 < jack_rip_vim> saltlake: for git, I think no
15:44 < saltlake> What is passphrase?
15:44 < saltlake> It's for ssh to remote pc
15:44 < noodlepie> saltlake, its so you can encrypt your key, put a pass phrase in rather than your user password
15:44 < ayecee> passphrase is something you'd enter to use the key that ssh-keygen generates
15:45 < saltlake> Where would I use the passphrase during ssh to remote login?
15:45 < ayecee> same place you'd use a password if you weren't using a key
15:45 < noodlepie> wen it tries to decrypt your key to connect with
15:46 < ayecee> people often don't put a passphrase on keys intended for automatic logins
15:47 < tds> ^ if you're doing that, it may also be worth restricting the specific key to running certain commands
15:47 < saltlake> Will it ask me to type password during ssh to remote login?
15:47 < noodlepie> the passphrase is for locally encrypting your key, its not the remote user password
15:47 < saltlake> Will it ask me to type passphrase during ssh to remote login?
15:47 < ayecee> yes
15:48 < saltlake> When I ssh to remote pc, it asks me to type remote computer's password, not the passphrase I typed during ssh-keygen -t rsa
15:49 < phogg> then your setup isn't working correctly
15:49 < ayecee> then you're not logging in using the key from ssh-keygen
15:49 < revel> Probably since you aren't using pubkey auth.
15:51 < nicholasBPM> saltlake: maybe this will help you: http://www.linuxproblem.org/art_9.html
15:53 < rypervenche> Although "ssh-copy-id" does all of that for you, including the permission changes.
15:55 < nicholasBPM> I added iptables -A INPUT \! -i vpn0 -s 10.200.200.0/24 -j DROP and iptables -t nat -A POSTROUTING -s 10.200.200.0/24 -o eth0 -j MASQUERADE, but now i am worried that anybody could connect through my server, how can i check if its just for localhost or everybody on the net?
15:57 < rypervenche> nicholasBPM: What VPN software are you using?
15:58 < nicholasBPM> rypervenche, openvpn
15:59 < nicholasBPM> rypervenche, I use namespace to force my apps to use my multiple openvpn connections
16:12 < saltlake> revel: In public key auth, you have to type the password of remote computer, right?
16:12 < revel> No, you should have to type the password of your private key.
16:12 < revel> Assuming you don't have it cached in ssh-agent or something.
16:12 < saltlake> revel: What is the password of private key?
16:13 < revel> The one you entered when you created it, usually.
16:14 < saltlake> I tried to ssh from same computer
16:14 < saltlake> It works with the password of this computer's user-account
16:14 < saltlake> not the passphrase i gave to create id_rsa.pub
16:15 < Sitri> saltlake: then it's not using the key
16:15 < saltlake> Oh, i have to put that id_rsa.pub to authorised_keys, i forgot that
16:15 < Sitri> id_rsa.pub has to be added to .ssh/authorized_keys on the server
16:15 < revel> Its contents.
16:16 < Sitri> Right
16:16 < Sitri> If you don't have ssh-copy-id: ssh HOSTSTRING cat '>>' .ssh/authorized_keys < .ssh/id_rsa.pub
16:17 < saltlake> I put the id_rsa.pub in .ssh/authorized_keys/ of same computer
16:17 < saltlake> but it works for user-account's password, not with the passphrase I gave to create id_rsa.pub
16:18 < Sitri> authorized_keys is a file, not a directory
16:18 < zebmccorkle> authorized_keys is a file; you have to append the content of id_rsa.pub to it
16:19 < Sitri> ssh-copy-id is your friend if you have it
16:20 < saltlake> sign_and_send_pubkey: signing failed: agent refused operation
16:20 < mawk> fire him
16:21 < saltlake> cp id_rsa.pub authorized_keys , will it do?
16:22 < atmx> man cp
16:23 < saltlake> I did: cp -rf id_rsa.pub authorized_keys
16:24 < Sitri> You wanted to do: cat id_rsa.pub >> authorized_keys
16:24 < Sitri> Anything that was in authorized_keys before is lost now
16:25 < Sitri> However, you need to have authorized_keys contain the public key on the /remote/ host.
16:26 < Sitri> That'll only work if local and remote are the same
16:29 < saltlake> sign_and_send_pubkey: signing failed: agent refused operation , why this error?
16:33 < Sitri> Paste the full output please
16:34 < Sitri> To something like termbin
16:35 < saltlake> ssh user1@1.2.3.4
16:35 < saltlake> sign_and_send_pubkey: signing failed: agent refused operation , why this error?
16:35 < saltlake> user1@1.2.3.4 password:
16:37 < mrig_> saltlake, sounds like your ssh agent has not accepted the address as being a trusted address.
16:38 < saltlake> mrig_: What is ssh agent here?
16:42 < mrig_> saltlake, the ssh agent is the process that deals with your ssh keys on your local machine.
16:43 < mrig_> It requests your permission before establishing a connection with a remote server, whether or not you trust that address. I may be mistaken, I am still learning this myself.
16:48 < tds> if configured to do so, the agent will request permission before allowing an application to make use of your ssh keys, but afaik it has no awareness of the remote server you're connecting to
16:48 < tds> requesting first is especially useful if you forward the socket out to another machine in order to ssh from there instead, since you don't want an unauthorised user on that machine to be able to use your keys
16:51 < jim> saltlake, try something like this: ssh -v user1@1.2.3.4 | tee log
16:52 < jim> then, (importaint!!) look at the file 'log' yourself! if there is no sensitive data, then and only then, cat log | nc termbin.com 9999
16:53 < saltlake> I had to do: ssh-add first, it works now
16:54 < jim> saltlake, so then, that error must have meant: I couldn't find anything applicable in your ssh-agent
16:55 < mrig_> saltlake, oh to add your key.
16:55 < jim> because when you did ssh-add, you added something to your agent
16:56 < jim> saltlake, did you ever run ssh-agent?
16:57 < alexandre9099> hi, i forwarded port 9 udp on my router, how can i send (and recieve) a test WOL packet?
16:58 < saltlake> I deleted all keys, and recreated again, still same problemsign_and_send_pubkey: signing failed: agent refused operation
16:58 < saltlake> I did ssh-add too
16:59 < jim> how do you mean you deleted the keys?
16:59 < saltlake> rm -rf .ssh/*
16:59 < jim> ugh :)
16:59 < saltlake> then ssh-keygen -t rsa
17:01 < jim> you then need to append the content of id_rsa.pub to the remote's .ssh/authorized_keys
17:01 < saltlake> It works now
17:02 < saltlake> ssh-add asks to type the passphrase,
17:02 < saltlake> then it's added
17:02 < saltlake> Now it works
17:02 < RayTracer> saltlake: are you trying the ssh from the same shell or different one? ssh needs a hint to where it should connect to the agent (SSH_AUTH_SOCK variable) so it can't connect if it's not set to the socket where the (or "an") agent listens and provides the private key it should use
17:02 < saltlake> I don't have to type the user-account's password or the passphrase to ssh to remote login now
17:03 < jim> you realize that's temporary until the local agent stops having keys (is somehow emptied of its keys)
17:04  * Pentode gives up on getting this i5s integrated gpu to work properly 
17:04 < J-JITO> Hi
17:04 < Pentode> it performs almost as bad as my thinkpad t43, lol...
17:04 < jim> hi
17:04 < J-JITO> Hi jim
17:04 < J-JITO> I have a dumb question
17:04 < jim> ask away
17:05 < saltlake> Is it necessary to ForwardAgent yes in /etc/ssh/ssh_config ?
17:05 < J-JITO> I have a file with word
17:05 < J-JITO> with words
17:05 < jim> ok
17:05 < J-JITO> every word is below the the other one
17:06 < jim> how do you mean "below"?
17:06 < rumpel> J-JITO, a list?
17:06 < J-JITO> rumpel: Exactly
17:06 < RayTracer> saltlake: you shouln't need that besides for ssh hop host constellations, you should set it only per connection
17:06 < J-JITO> Like a PIP req file
17:07 < J-JITO> I wonder how to transform the list into this: (word word1 word2...)
17:07 < J-JITO> insted of (word\n word1\n ...)
17:07 < jim> I wonder if saltlake's ssh-agent is the one branden robinson arranged to run x servers under
17:07 < J-JITO> my list have 7000 word
17:08 < J-JITO> Here's my context:
17:08 < jim> (in which case saltlake's running a debian deriv)
17:08 < uplime> tr '\n' ' ' < file > newfile
17:09 < jim> J-JITO, so you want the 7000 words on one huge text line instead of on 7000 lines?
17:10 < J-JITO> jim: exactly, my context is to generate my installed packages into a apt install "list of packages"
17:11 < uplime> J-JITO ► tr '\n' ' ' < file > newfile
17:11 < rumpel> J-JITO, that already exists: dpkg --get-selections (I think)
17:12 < J-JITO> rumpel: Yes, but as I mentionned, the list is like "word\n word2\n ..."
17:12 < rumpel> J-JITO, why does that matter?
17:13 < J-JITO> rumpel: Because I don't know if I cant do apt install "list" ?
17:13 < rumpel> J-JITO, have a look: https://wiki.debian.org/ListInstalledPackages
17:14 < jim> J-JITO, there are a couple of other ways to do that... mess around with this: cat theListFile | xargs apt install
17:14 < uplime> jim ► uuoc of cat
17:15 < uplime> xargs apt install < file
17:15 < jim> not useless, easier to type :)
17:15 < uplime> we'll have to agree to disagree :)
17:15 < jim> but, the command line might be too long
17:15 < uplime> definitely useless to the shell :)
17:16 < uplime> cat file | is longer than < file though
17:16 < J-JITO> jim: OR uplime
17:17 < jim> we should probabl;y patent cat | cat | cat | xargs echo :)
17:17 < J-JITO> whats the easiest way
17:17 < uplime> J-JITO ► why don't you listen to rumpel
17:17 < J-JITO> uplime: I did
17:17 < jim> because I always wanted three cats
17:17 < uplime> they seem to have a pretty good handle on the proper way to do this with apt
17:17 < uplime> jim ► me too ;-;
17:20 < jim> it might be easier to understand when the command line itself is pretty long
17:21 < candidat> hi jim
17:22 < jim> hi candidat :)
17:22 < candidat> :-D good day
17:22 < jim> thanks :)
17:23 < candidat> your welcome :)
17:23 < Penguin> candidat: you're
17:23 < candidat> Penguin yes ?
17:24 < jim> he;s offering you a point of grammar
17:24 < candidat> oooOOh
17:24 < candidat> you're welcome ! :)
17:24 < candidat> thanks Penguin !
17:27 < jim> "your welcome" translates to "the welcome that belongs to you"
17:28 < ayecee> possessive's 101
17:28 < jim> the 101 that belongs to possessive :)
17:29 < ayecee> the possessive is in fact 101
17:29 < jim> oh, that too. that's old...
17:29 < ayecee> i'll take ambiguous apostrophes for $100, alex
17:30 < Prof_Birch> ps doesn't show any running processes besides sudo and ps
17:30 < Prof_Birch> why
17:30 < jim> I'll take "things nobody knows" for $1000
17:30 < Prof_Birch> Sounds good to me
17:30 < oxagast> proc is mounted as hidepid
17:31 < noodlepie> so things start to move together when they get a message? This seems more far fetched than the reaction being an immediate intrinsic one
17:32 < oxagast> mount /proc -o remount,hidepid=0  <--- that should make ps show everyone's stuff
17:32 < longxia> Prof_Birch: did you try ps -e ?
17:32 < jim> oxagast, sounds extreme to me :)
17:33 < Prof_Birch> Ah, no. I'm retarted
17:33 < Prof_Birch> I keep thinking it's ps -a
17:33 < Prof_Birch> guess I should RTFM before I ask a questionb
17:33 < noodlepie> That's called "Omnipotency" @:P-~
17:33 < kurahaupo> Prof_Birch: by default ps will show processes with the same controlling terminal (tty)
17:33 < jim> Prof_Birch, we don't really require that
17:33 < Prof_Birch> thanks
17:33 < Prof_Birch> jim: I am used to the Arch way
17:35 < oxagast> i usually do ps aux
17:36 < revel> ps -eF
17:37 < jim> under the archway,down by the sea...
17:38 < oxagast> i usually keep hidepid set to 2 as a security measure on multiuser systems
17:38 < oxagast> which makes ps only show the current user's stuf
17:38 < oxagast> f
17:45 < Drakonan> easiest way to find without all the access denied messages from standard crap like proc?
17:46 < Prof_Birch> *sigh* maybe I should just virtualize Android on a Linux machine, or vice versa
17:49 < FRWB> is there a good channel to ask powerpoint 2016 questions?
17:50 < Drakonan> yes #ihavebeenPwnedbythejavascript2016
17:50 < FRWB> believe it or not someone is paying me to teach them about powerpoint haha
17:51 < FRWB> would love to show them js
17:51 < revel> FRWB: ##windows
17:51 < revel> Probably.
17:51 < Drakonan> i hate this modem...  i have to reboot it any time i want to get access to it
17:52 < Drakonan> whether its ssh or web gui
17:52 < FRWB> yea that's what i figured, hopefully not too dead in there
17:52 < bitSt0rm> Trying to setup dual-boot of two linux distros and I am using LVM on same harddrive. grub bootscreen is messed up, it mixes the distro names and kernel-images. Can anyone help point me towards a solution? I've tried update-grub but to no avail, only further adds issues (more entries *confused). I'm having a seperate partiton for /boot if this matters somehow.
17:52 < Drakonan> wish there was a cheap bonded dsl nic
17:54 < bitSt0rm> I asked my question in #grub instead - didn't think of that channel.
17:54 < bitSt0rm> Nevermind my question.
17:54 < J-JITO> jim: Thanx for the help ^^
17:54 < J-JITO> I found how to do it
17:54 < tds> Drakonan: you can get SFP modules that do adsl/vdsl, I think they're rather expensive and power hungry though
17:54 < J-JITO> apt install $(cat package-selections | awk '{print $1}')
17:56 < jim> bitSt0rm, in general... there is a bot, alis, that can assist you in looking for channels on the Freenode irc net. To start, /msg alis help
17:56 < Drakonan> losing 5ms to router too so crappy
17:57 < Drakonan> well 3 ms with spikes maybe it's bad
17:57 < bitSt0rm> jim, thanks! Didn't know that
17:58 < jim> welcome
17:58 < Drakonan> need to put it in bridge mode maybe that'll help
18:01 < MrGrz> hi
18:02 < MrGrz> hi....i from indonesia
18:02 < pankaj> MrGrz: Hello from India
18:02 < pankaj> MrGrz: Are you new?
18:03 < MrGrz> pankaj: yes i new
18:04 < jim> MrGrz, hi
18:05 < MrGrz> is here a gathering place for hackers?
18:05 < pankaj> MrGrz: Tell something about your linux experience.
18:06 < afidegnum> what's the performance difference on deploying web applications on docker vs bare server ?
18:06 < revel> Do you actually have a bare-metal server? You probably have a VPS.
18:07 < voidcrafted> Same difference
18:07 < voidcrafted> afidegnum: Not too much difference
18:07 < voidcrafted> In my purely practical experience
18:07 < MrGrz> pankaj: I use linux yesterday .... I am here to find experience and knowledge here
18:07 < revel> Yeah, shouldn't be much of a difference. The usage of kernel namespaces makes them pretty efficient.
18:08 < revel> MrGrz: You won't randomly get experience by talking about it, you get it by using it.
18:09 < MrPockets> Hey crew
18:09 < NerdyPepper> o/
18:10 < MrGrz> pankaj: I did not know how to use it
18:11 < MrGrz> revel: rGrz: You won't randomly get                   experience by talking about it,                 you get it by using it.
18:11 < MrGrz> up
18:11 < revel> up
18:11 < MrGrz> sorry....i use translet
18:12 < MrGrz> revel: where are you from?
18:12 < revel> Eastern Europe.
18:14 < MrGrz> revel: what country are you?
18:14 < revel> Estonia.
18:14 < MrGrz> revel: what country are you?
18:14 < NerdyPepper> MrGrz, its just a place to discuss linux, fossware, opensource
18:15 < MrGrz> revel: ok
18:15 < ibttis> is RHCSA respected?
18:15 < MrGrz> nerdypepper: ok...sorry
18:16 < mawk> up
18:17 < NerdyPepper> what are you sorry about :D, tinkering with software and getting to know its internals /is/ hacking
18:17 < revel> mawk: No, next up was down
18:17 < mawk> :(
18:17 < revel> Then down,  then left.
18:17 < revel> You get the idea.
18:18 < MrGrz> i newbie
18:19 < jim> MrGrz, do you have a linux running on your computer?
18:19 < NerdyPepper> MrGrz, thats alright my dude. did you pop in here to ask a question?
18:20 < MrGrz> jim: i use android
18:21 < jim> yes me too, and I'm going to do something with that :)
18:21 < MrGrz> nerdypepper: no .... i want to study here
18:22 < MrGrz> jim: ok
18:22 < jim> MrGrz, perfectly ok. ]
18:22 < revel> Experience is a good teacher.
18:22 < jim> do you have a laptop or desktop computer?
18:23 < MrGrz> jim: ok
18:24 < MrGrz> jim: not .... my age is 14 years
18:25 < jim> oh ok... there is a program called termux that might work for practicing terminal stuff
18:26 < MrGrz> jim: yes
18:26 < jim> MrGrz, how did you become interested in linux?
18:27  * jim will be in and out for the next few minutesx
18:27 < MrGrz> jim: i want to be a programmer
18:29 < MrGrz> I want to sleep .... good night
18:32 < Prof_Birch> Ugh! Theres a FOSS Linux project for mobile I can join, but I fear that will end my Android dev skills
18:36 < Umeaboy> Prof_Birch: And why would that be so wrong?
18:36 < Umeaboy> I help develop Sailfish OS myself. :)
18:36 < Umeaboy> Not through coding, but through translating.
18:42 < Obsdark> buenas
18:42 < Obsdark> Hiho
18:43 < jim> hi
18:43 < Obsdark> a question, if i want to create a package repository than works with Debian, what exactly i'm creating?
18:43 < Obsdark> i mean, i know is a server
18:43 < Obsdark> but i need a little orientation to start google it
18:43 < luke-jr> a package repository?
18:43 < jim> it's mostly a set of directories on a web site
18:43 < Prof_Birch> Umeaboy: one part "sunken cost" (I already learned it), another is a bit of a gamble. Android dev could be useful in the future, but I don't know that I would do it anymore if I focused on Linux mobile
18:44 < Obsdark> jim can you develop a little bit?
18:44 < Obsdark> it's just a website with some format?
18:44 < Obsdark> it's published for an specific software?
18:44 < Obsdark> how exactly works?
18:44 < jim> then, there's the programs dpkg-scanpackages and dpkg-scansources
18:45 < Obsdark> So, if i install those, i can make a computer a package repository?
18:45 < jim> Obsdark, these programs look at the packages you want to put in the repo, and from information stored in the packages, it makes appropriate files that go there
18:46 < Obsdark> Great, thanks a lot jim
18:47 < jim> Obsdark, let me get you some stuff to read
18:48 < Obsdark> Thanks jim
18:49 < jim> before I do that, is it that you want to create actual packages?
18:51 < jim> Obsdark, before I do that, is it that you want to create actual packages?
18:52 < Obsdark> A repository, more than anything, a place from where i can in my network using "apt-get install" install something in my computer
18:52 < Prof_Birch> Do you think Linux will eventually come to fill a mobile niche the same way it has on desktop? By that I mean a core group of users who maintain it, and it offers competitive if not better results than mainstream options
18:52 < Obsdark> A repository, more than anything, a place from where i can in my network using "apt-get install" install something in my computer, but of course i want control over what exactly get in that repository specificaly jim, am i asking correctly?
18:52 < jim> Prof_Birch, it already has, with android
18:53 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: kinda doubt it tbh
18:53 < luke-jr> jim: Android isn't Linux
18:53 < revel> luke-jr: It's not GNU/Linux, but it's Linux.
18:53 < jim> does android now use a different kernel?
18:53 < luke-jr> revel: no, its kernel is derived from Linux, but it's incompatible
18:54 < revel> "incompatible"?
18:54 < luke-jr> you can't use a kernel.org Linux kernel with an Android system or vice-versa
18:54 < Prof_Birch> You can use an Android kernel for a standard linux system
18:54 < revel> luke-jr: Have you verified this?
18:55 < jim> can you get the sources for the differences?
18:55 < luke-jr> revel: not recently, but at some point in the past
18:55 < dgurney> afaik the real issue with using mainline kernels on Android devices are non-upstreamed drivers
18:55 < Prof_Birch> yeah, it's just a driver issue
18:55 < MrPockets> Word
18:55 < revel> luke-jr: So a lot of IoT devices aren't Linux then?
18:56 < Prof_Birch> I see projects like Plasma mobile, that look to bring the full Linux experience to mobile, but I just wonder if I will be wasting valuable Android dev skills
18:56 < MrPockets> Anyone play with Xibo?
18:56 < revel> Prof_Birch: Does Plasma mobile even support Android apps? I thought it didn't.
18:56 < luke-jr> revel: dunno, perhaps not
18:56 < Prof_Birch> revel: it doesn't thats my concern. To switch to Plasma mobile I won't do anything at all with Android, leaving my skills to get rusty
18:57 < jim> MrPockets, heh, have you?
18:57 < dgurney> Prof_Birch, so use both android and plasma mobile
18:57 < Prof_Birch> dgurney: That's a lot of time to invest developing for, when I could just focus on making a better product for one or the other
18:57 < luke-jr> Android has a good security model
18:57 < luke-jr> much better than POSIX's
18:57 < MrPockets> jim, not yet!  I'd like to build a info-board / digital signage project at home.  Google calendar, weather, english and spanish word of the day
18:58 < dgurney> Prof_Birch, well if you want to keep your skills from becoming rusty, there's no other alternative
18:59 < Prof_Birch> I can try to continue working against the grain by hacking Android into submission, which (for now) gives it the largest mass market appeal
18:59 < Prof_Birch> Or I could work with a GNU/Linux distro outright, which gives maximum freedom, but I doubt your average user would ever use it
18:59 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: perhaps a good middle-ground would be to work on Plasma mobile, making it able to run Android apps?
18:59 < Prof_Birch> I've considered the thought, they said that is an eventual goal
18:59 < luke-jr> perhaps even bring Android's security model to non-Java stuff
19:01 < Prof_Birch> I guess the real decision is about mass market appeal
19:02 < veverak> Hi folks, any tips for doc for 'SCSI client'?
19:02 < luke-jr> mobile Linux stuff has been a WIP for over a decade with no real progress; I doubt it will get to mass market any time soon, at least
19:02 < Umeaboy> Prof_Birch: Why hack it when you have Sailfish OS to run on any device that currently runs Android? :)
19:02 < veverak> I would like to write a code for a PCIe device that needs some storage
19:02 < Prof_Birch> I mean, Linux still isn't mass market for desktop users
19:03 < veverak> we thought it would be nice to implement the driver as SCSI client
19:03 < Umeaboy> Prof_Birch: Wrong½!
19:03 < Umeaboy> Ever heard of Java?
19:03 < Prof_Birch> umeaboy: Of course, Android is practically written in Java
19:04 < ||JD||> that explains why it sucks so bad
19:04 < Umeaboy> I was talking about you claiming that Linux isn't a mass market when it has been one of the biggest a long time.
19:04 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: desktop users is a dying niche in itself
19:05 < Prof_Birch> luke-jr: Yeah, I guess that's pretty true.
19:05 < Prof_Birch> Umeaboy: I'm referring to the userspace and a standard distro, not just the kernel
19:07 < Drakonan> i got a question... why is bsd so popular for simple stuff like nas/router/pfsense/ stuff like that?
19:07 < Prof_Birch> I have to say, I don't know much about sailfish, but I keep hearing about it
19:09 < Umeaboy> Prof_Birch: Unlike Android it's a fully working operating system with true multitasking.
19:09 < Water_27300935_> Hi, my android 's shell is mksh, can I install bash ?
19:09 < turkeyhand> hey I have printing apparently working in arch, but I installed the exact printer driver from github, canon mx495, and hte one found via usb is "pixma mx490 series" which there is no package for in the aur
19:09 < jim> Obsdark, take a look at this: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianRepository/Setup?action=show&redirect=HowToSetupADebianRepository
19:09 < Prof_Birch> Umeaboy: Is it linux?
19:09 < turkeyhand> there's the exact package for this printer in the aur which I already installed
19:10 < Umeaboy> Prof_Birch: Yes.
19:10 < luke-jr> Umeaboy: Android has true multitasking..
19:10 < Umeaboy> Nope.
19:10 < Drakonan> anyone know if there is a way to have 50 dollar pfsense router?
19:10 < Obsdark> Thank you jim, i'll take a look :D
19:10 < turkeyhand> but it refuses to recognise the printer via usb for some reason when adding a printer in the gnome settings page
19:10 < Prof_Birch> Umeaboy: Android does multitasking as of 7.0
19:11 < Prof_Birch> What's this whole "regional licensing" thing
19:11 < turkeyhand> I dunno but it sounds terrible
19:11 < Prof_Birch> Yeah
19:11 < Umeaboy> luke-jr and Prof_Birch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qA9imU7yy0
19:11 < turkeyhand> lsusb lists this dumb printer
19:11 < Umeaboy> Can you do that?
19:11 < turkeyhand> but it can't find a driver for it, I installed the driver for this precise printer
19:11 < Umeaboy> Have six windows open at the same time on the screen?
19:12 < luke-jr> Umeaboy: in theory, although I don't know how with the default UI
19:12 < jim> Obsdark, welcome\
19:12 < Umeaboy> Sailfish already has it in the defult UI. :)
19:12 < luke-jr> the real question is why would you want to?
19:12 < Prof_Birch> What's "sailfish OS's licensing.
19:12 < luke-jr> phones have small screens, and you're not typically using more than one app at a time
19:13 < Umeaboy> https://jolla.com/sailfish-eula/
19:13 < Umeaboy> https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Open_Source
19:15 < tds> Drakonan: I saw they were planning to support espressobin, I don't know if that ever got released?
19:15 < turkeyhand> does sailfish work yet?
19:16 < Umeaboy> turkeyhand: Yes, it does.
19:16 < Umeaboy> turkeyhand: https://wiki.merproject.org/wiki/Adaptations/libhybris
19:16 < tds> Drakonan: also, seeing as pfsense isn't linux, that kind of question might be more suited for ##networking
19:16 < Prof_Birch> I dunno. i don't really like the license. I think that's what has swayed me from the project before
19:17 < turkeyhand> for making calls and shit like that?
19:18 < sbrothy> Hi! Is "ldconfig" alwys installed on ny distro? Here the other night I was under the whether with a virus nd tired. I seem to remember having to install it directly after having installed Debian 9....
19:19 < luke-jr> ldconfig is a standard *nix tool for reloading shared library caches; it shouldn't normally be running in the background, and as with any software could be replaced by malware if your system is compromised
19:19 < Drakonan> tds: hmm it looks interesting
19:19 < ayecee> sbrothy: it wouldn't be required
19:20 < sbrothy> Well, it isn't running in the background. I just have a script that depends on it being there...
19:20 < ayjay_t> so what do you guys think the best way to make a portable terminal program is
19:20 < ayjay_t> lets say light-medium complexity
19:20 < ayjay_t> is ncurses still a thing?
19:21 < luke-jr> ayjay_t: curses is a standard API; ncurses is one implementation
19:21 < killown> anyone recommend me a stable distro whichs is not archlinux based
19:21 < luke-jr> killown: Devuan?
19:21 < killown> after update manjaro I got this same issue https://forum.manjaro.org/t/stuck-at-started-tlp-system-startup-shutdown/29894
19:21 < turkeyhand> who was the sailfish guy
19:21 < turkeyhand> thanks for hte info
19:21 < turkeyhand> I might try it on my nexus 5
19:22 < killown> archlinux and its based distros are worse than windows
19:22 < turkeyhand> does it have google maps and shit or just linux stuff?
19:22 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: just a person on the channel. I am trying to make mobile dev developments
19:22 < turkeyhand> for what
19:22 < Prof_Birch> killown: Arch linux is best linux
19:22 < killown> worse linux ever made
19:22 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: pls
19:22 < turkeyhand> arch linux is the least restrictive linux but hte most annoying
19:22 < turkeyhand> I hate most linuxes equally
19:22 < Prof_Birch> Oh man, I love arch.
19:23 < killown> ignored!
19:23 < ayecee> get a room!
19:23 < turkeyhand> I mean I like that there is basically no restriction
19:23 < luke-jr> least restrictive is LFS ;P
19:23 < turkeyhand> arch is what I settled on
19:23 < killown> linux mint is good
19:23 < turkeyhand> rolling is great
19:23 < killown> ?
19:23 < turkeyhand> the aur seems to have a lot of stuff
19:23 < Prof_Birch> LFS has terrible package management lol
19:23 < killown> dude I use linux since 1998 I am tired of errors and breaking stuff
19:23 < turkeyhand> bascially everything from github
19:23 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: then Gentoo
19:23 < turkeyhand> but I still can't print from arch linux
19:23 < luke-jr> killown: well, that's the norm on Linux these days
19:23 < Prof_Birch> Gentoo forces me to compile. at least with Arch I have a choice
19:24 < turkeyhand> and I can't boot windows 10
19:24 < killown> pacman -Syu breaks the boot then its worse than windows 10
19:24 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: get a modern PC
19:24 < Prof_Birch> luke-jr: I use a surface pro
19:24 < luke-jr> turkeyhand: Windows isn't Linux
19:24 < turkeyhand> oh it isn't?
19:24 < turkeyhand> fuckhead?
19:24 < killown> luke-jr, I will use linux in virtual machines and windows as default desktop, after 20 years...
19:24 < storge_> wow
19:25 < luke-jr> killown: the other way around would make a lot more sense..
19:25 < storge_> ^
19:25 < Prof_Birch> arch as a daily driver
19:25 < killown> no, the other way around causes a lot of issues
19:25 < storge> what issues
19:25 < killown> I don[ t have time to waste with linux boring breaking stuff
19:25 < storge> i do it constantly, no issues
19:25 < rypervenche> killown: Why not just use Windows exclusively then?
19:25 < ayecee> turkeyhand: mind the language please
19:26 < luke-jr> killown: maybe you should try Android
19:26 < storge> i've been running the same XP and 7 vm's across like 5 laptops in 10 years, no problems
19:26 < phogg> killown: you could use something that is not arch
19:26 < luke-jr> storge: XP is not maintained and should be banned from the internet
19:26 < storge> shared data drives, ntfs-3g, what's the problem
19:26 < Prof_Birch> I want to love Android: it just sucks at the system level. Might as well be windows
19:26 < killown> storge, yeah I have a windows 7 installation through 3 years and no problems and while that I reinstalled linux zillions of times
19:27 < storge> killown: sounds like your problem
19:27 < killown> pacman -Syu is a problem
19:27 < sbrothy> I didn't really get an answer people. Is it concievable that there are distros out there where "ldconfig" isn't installed per default?
19:27 < storge> i have had stable /home partitions across dozens of installs, and none of those were because of problems but because i was trying different distros
19:27 < ayecee> sbrothy: yes
19:27 < killown> I dont touch any conf, I just use the system and update it
19:27 < Prof_Birch> killown: just keep an eye on what's updating and roll it back if you need to
19:28 < luke-jr> sbrothy: yes
19:28 < luke-jr> sbrothy: automake and such exist to handle this stuff automagically
19:28 < storge> killown: pacman... what distro are you using that gives you all these problems? if you say arch, i'm going to laugh, because that's all on you
19:28 < phogg> killown: *arch* is a problem.
19:28 < Prof_Birch> arch works fine for tons of people
19:28 < storge> pick a stable distro and stop complaining, or use windows and stop complaining
19:28 < phogg> arch is not stable; that's by design. If your complaint is "It's not stable" just stop using arch.
19:28 < sbrothy> Awww crud. Thanks though.
19:29 < Prof_Birch> just use the LTS kernel and more stable repositories.
19:29 < killown> tried archlinux and had some GPU glitches, antergos the same, manjaro now gave me this stuck at Started TLP system startup/shutdown during the boot
19:29 < killown> installed a new kernel through chroot and didn[ t solve
19:29 < luke-jr> ugh, don't get me started on GPU issues..
19:29 < killown> but I am tired of fixing linux crap
19:29 < Prof_Birch> if you don't like linux, why are you on the channel
19:29 < storge> Prof_Birch: it does, but if i had to go on what i have seen here in the years, arch has been more a problem for people than any other distro but maybe kali--and then mostly because wannabe crackers don't know what they're doing
19:29 < dgurney> if you don't like it, don't use it
19:29 < CrazyTux> is Lxqt completely stable for end users? is it suitable for beginners?
19:29 < dgurney> simple
19:30 < dgurney> nothing is completely stable
19:30 < jubalh> CrazyTux: how about trying if its okay for you?
19:30 < phogg> CrazyTux: I can't comment on stability, but it seems to be just as good as the gtk version in terms of usability.
19:30 < killown> dgurney, at leat the kernel must be almost stable
19:30 < Prof_Birch> storage: I agree Arch can cause issues, since there's so much DIY. But I wouldn't say that it's hard to avoid many of the issues if you read, and keep track of your system changes
19:30 < killown> archlinux kernel is super unstable
19:30 < Prof_Birch> killown: just use the lts kernel
19:30 < storge> killown: if you're having to install a kernal in a chroot, things have gone way too far down the bad road
19:31 < Psi-Jack> jubalh: But, he's always asking is this, is that. Before doing. Kinda crazy that guy. :)
19:31 < dgurney> killown, it's not any more or less unstable than the latest stable kernel.org release
19:31 < Prof_Birch> literally pacman -Syu linux-lts
19:31 < Gasoline> I've tried many distros but I always come back to debian and lubuntu
19:31 < storge> Prof_Birch: you're right again, but apparently not for killown
19:31  * luke-jr checks if 4.17 is out yet
19:31 < dgurney> LTS kernels are for when you need any further "stability"
19:31 < storge> Gasoline: same here with debian
19:31 < dgurney> luke-jr, no
19:31 < luke-jr> aww
19:31 < dgurney> luke-jr, you could subscribe to the kernel announce mailing list
19:31 < killown> I am using 4.14 lts and 4.15
19:32 < luke-jr> dgurney: too much activity
19:32 < CrazyTux> Gasoline, Lubuntu is going to make lxqt as its default DE. Isn't it?
19:32 < Gasoline> yeah I think so
19:32 < Gasoline> still lxde atm
19:32 < CrazyTux> ok
19:32 < turkeyhand> printing on linux is STILL NOT WORKING
19:32 < CrazyTux> does lxqt has any advantage over lxde?
19:32 < Psi-Jack> turkeyhand: Works just fine.
19:33 < CrazyTux> from technical perspective?
19:33 < luke-jr> turkeyhand: it's gotten worse over the years, thanks to printer manufacturers
19:33 < dgurney> luke-jr, linux-kernel-announce just announces every single release, no dev discussion whatsoever on it
19:33 < jubalh> CrazyTux: no
19:33 < luke-jr> dgurney: I mainly only care about 4.17 because I want stable VMs
19:33 < Prof_Birch> turkeyhand: is it a driver issue or still an issue with cups
19:33 < luke-jr> at least, I hope 4.17 will make them stable :x
19:33 < CrazyTux> probably lxqt is easier than lxde.
19:33 < jubalh> CrazyTux: no
19:34 < storge> turkeyhand: NOT WORKING is not information useful to us
19:34 < dgurney> luke-jr, I guess in that case you could just read say... phoronix, or subscribe to the linux subreddit
19:34 < dgurney> because I can guarantee both of them will tell you when it's out on the release day
19:35 < luke-jr> dgurney: less effort to just check kernel.org daily
19:35 < dgurney> or that
19:35 < killown> storge what linux distro are you using
19:35 < storge> debian
19:35 < killown> well good
19:35 < jubalh> CrazyTux: Lubuntu is switching to LXQt because the maintainers like it more, thats it
19:35 < Prof_Birch> hooyah debian
19:35  * DanielTheFox uses debian too
19:35 < jubalh> CrazyTux: the Lubuntu maintainers that is
19:35 < CrazyTux> ok
19:35 < storge> when i have problems, they tend to have been caused by my own tinkering
19:35 < storge> and i'm using test branch, and still i rarely have a problem
19:35 < killown> what about linux mint?
19:36 < storge> mint is a cousin of ubuntu which is a cousin of debian. why use mint or ubuntu when i can use debian.
19:36 < luke-jr> isn't that the one which has as its sole distinguishing factor, a bunch of colour schemes and image files?
19:36 < Prof_Birch> debian with cinnamon
19:36 < jubalh> indeed. people should use debian
19:36 < storge> luke-jr: lol
19:37 < storge> Prof_Birch: i haven't tried cinnamon. i've been in blackbox/openbox since 2001
19:37 < dgurney> I think Mint and Ubuntu are simply more accessible for beginners
19:37 < Prof_Birch> Cinnamon is Mints default DE
19:37 < Prof_Birch> Personally I love Gnome 3's looks, it's just way too monolithic
19:37 < Prof_Birch> I use KDE that I set up to look and act like Gnome 3
19:37 < dgurney> debian requires a bit more thinking, and so isn't the best for absolute beginners
19:37  * DanielTheFox sometimes tries Debian without GUI
19:38 < storge> i tend to use older hardware, so i don't like big DE's. and i favor the commandline so i have a lot of terminals around. not too much of a mouse clicker here.
19:38 < storge> basically i'm on an openbox with terminals all over the place :)
19:38 < Prof_Birch> I should switch to a tiling manager (like i3) I am just lazy
19:38 < dgurney> I use Gentoo ~ on nearly everything I run linux on
19:38 < luke-jr> dgurney: same here
19:38 < Prof_Birch> Arch > Gentoo (flame war)
19:38 < luke-jr> well, not ~, but Gentoo
19:39 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: not even comparable
19:39  * DanielTheFox mostly uses the virtual terminals with screen
19:39 < phogg> It's interesting to see the tide of Debian popularity ebb and flow over the years. I remember one point, shortly before Ubuntu, when it was the general consensus that Debian should drop .deb in favor of .rpm and that there was no compelling reason for it to exist.
19:39 < Prof_Birch> I also want to get into ricing, but I would rather spend my downtime learning Linux, Android, and dev
19:39 < luke-jr> phogg: lolwut?
19:39 < storge> phogg: i remember that
19:39 < phogg> consensus from outside commentators that is
19:39 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: "ricing" is just a troll thing
19:40 < storge> remember the funroll-loops website for gentooers? good times.
19:40 < phogg> luke-jr: there was a big fight about .deb, e.g. "Why do you have to be different? Everybody uses rpm but you!"
19:40 < storge> it's still out there i bet
19:40 < Prof_Birch> luke-jr: my understanding is it was just UI tweaks
19:40 < phogg> storge: it is, but even if not there's archive.org
19:40 < luke-jr> Prof_Birch: what was?
19:40 < Prof_Birch> luke-jr: ricing
19:40 < storge> phogg: my one pleasureable experience in rpm was mandrake. I really did like that distro. mandrake 9.1 one of my favorite installs ever.
19:41 < storge> http://funroll-loops.teurasporsaat.org/
19:41 < storge> haha it still lives
19:42  * DanielTheFox just uses normal programs, music and browsing using bash terminal... and rarely web admin stuff
19:42 < dgurney> funroll-loops amuses me too
19:43 < luke-jr> I had to cross-compile my most recent Gentoo system since the stage3s were all obsolete
19:44 < dgurney> luke-jr, yeah, it does puzzle me why there isn't an official system that autobuilds all supported architectures
19:44 < password4> so I'm saving data from an old linux partition , where must i look for files i might want to except for /home/
19:44 < luke-jr> dgurney: there's supposed to be, but it stopped working for ppc64 a year or so ago
19:45 < dgurney> armv7 is also outdated (when I last checked anyway)
19:45 < luke-jr> ouch
19:45 < Prof_Birch> Do you think it is better to work on a platform that meets the technical needs of what you want to do, but isn't adopted. Or is it better to hack the adopted platform, and compromise your vision of the final product
19:45 < prussian> it's all about aarch64 now
19:45 < luke-jr> at least ppc64 is modern enough I could tolerate a few full rebuilds :x
19:45 < dgurney> luke-jr, "stage3-armv7a-20161129.tar.bz2" ;/
19:46 < dgurney> same date for hardfp as well
19:46  * DanielTheFox considers hardware never outdates as long it still /works/
19:46 < prussian> it becomes outdated when firmware bugs and no updates make it insecure or unreliable
19:48 < jim> password4, do you have a different linux running now?
19:48 < password4> nope
19:48 < password4> windont
19:48 < password4> D:
19:48 < password4> i jsut nuked the root partition
19:49 < jim> so you're reinstalling?
19:49 < password4> i already did
19:49 < password4> I'm grabbing my old files now
19:49 < luke-jr> prussian: so every x86 system is outdated? :P
19:49 < jim> ok, so other than home and other than / then, right?
19:49 < prussian> sure
19:50 < password4> well there was only / and /home/
19:50 < password4> now there is only /home/
19:50 < prussian> rip
19:50 < jim> sooo... there are no other files then?
19:50 < password4> not anymore
19:50 < password4> when i asked the question / was still there
19:50 < jim> oh ok
19:51 < jim> did you actually want to reinstll?
19:51 < password4> nah
19:51 < luke-jr> I would have saved /etc
19:51 < password4> i ust want my personal files
19:51 < password4> luke-jr, you were too late to answer
19:51 < jim> I think that mostly, you got em
19:51 < password4> what would be useful in /etc?
19:51 < DanielTheFox> who here runs internet-accessible web servers?
19:52 < jim> too late to answer? we didn't know that :)
19:52 < luke-jr> password4: that's system configuration files
19:52 < password4> -___-
19:52 < luke-jr> often cryptographic keys and passwords too
19:52 < password4> how can i not have enough free space to delte a partition?
19:52 < DanielTheFox> haha
19:52 < password4> my passwords are algorithmic
19:53 < luke-jr> password4: that's not usually a good idea
19:53 < jim> so is al gore
19:53 < password4> luke-jr, its awesome
19:53 < password4> now , it does not seem i can merge there partitions?
19:54 < jim> it's also not a good idea to say that :)
19:54 < jim> password4, what do mean by merge?
19:54 < jim> you want your /home on your / partition?
19:55 < password4> I'm on windows amte
19:55 < luke-jr> how does one select a good UPS?
19:55 < password4> *mate
19:55 < mooniac> just installed Fedora 28, and for some reason I can't change from gdm to lightdm? I checked, gdm is not running, lightdm is, but when I log in, it still is gdm
19:55 < Psi-Jack> luke-jr: Always APC. :)
19:55 < password4> now i have 62gig unallocated , 100mb system and tehn C drive partiiton
19:55 < luke-jr> Psi-Jack: doesn't APC require non-standard interfaces for monitoring?
19:56 < Psi-Jack> luke-jr: Seeings that Nut supports it, no.
19:56 < luke-jr> NUT didn't support my last APC
19:56 < jim> password4, it's -possible- you might want to explore lvm
19:57 < password4> lvm?
19:57 < Psi-Jack> luke-jr: That is... unusual.
19:57 < luke-jr> Psi-Jack: it was admittedly a few decades ago
19:57 < Psi-Jack> 20 years ago?
19:57 < Psi-Jack> 30?
19:57 < luke-jr> not sure
19:57 < password4> jim , i'm not on linux anymore
19:58 < luke-jr> I think I got them after 2005, but used
19:58 < password4> rip debian , I'll miss you
19:58 < Psi-Jack> That's not a few decades!
19:59 < Psi-Jack> luke-jr: Heh, I have a bunch of APCs here, the tower-style that I run on my servers, desktops, and entertainment center.
19:59 < Psi-Jack> I use NUT to interface them via the USB.
20:00 < luke-jr> I'm not sure what wattage I need. I would think 1000 is plenty, but they advertise only like 4 minutes runtime :/
20:01 < luke-jr> at least 15 minutes would be nice so if it's the middle of the night I have time to wake up and start the generator
20:04 < SuperSeriousCat> If its at home its probably not critical. Id go with auto shutdown instead of bothering with starting a generator in the middle of the night
20:06 < qman__> I've got automatic generators and transfer switches, the best solution
20:07 < qman__> Not that expensive either, if you've got any income to support it
20:07 < SuperSeriousCat> Nothing really is under those conditions :p
20:08 < SuperSeriousCat> Do the power go out often as you have to invest and maintain that?
20:08 < qman__> Yes, at least a dozen times a year
20:08 < qman__> Sometimes for over a week
20:08 < luke-jr> qman__: does it automatically start if you're away?
20:09 < qman__> Yep
20:09 < SuperSeriousCat> Only lost power for seconds max 3 times since I moved to this place. Most times the light barely manage to get dark before its back. 2011 or something I think
20:09 < luke-jr> qman__: that sounds ideal
20:09 < qman__> Power goes out and within five minutes it fires up and flips the transfer switch automatically
20:10 < qman__> Maintenance is pretty simple too, change the oil after X hours
20:10 < luke-jr> qman__: is it portable?
20:10 < dongbag> hi - I had  a file I could not edit unless I first typed sudo -s
20:10 < dongbag> why is this?
20:10 < qman__> They automatically run periodically even without an outage to keep themselves working
20:10 < dongbag> man sudo -s is not helpful
20:11 < qman__> No, permanent installation
20:11 < luke-jr> qman__: so I should probably get a UPS until I build a new house
20:11 < luke-jr> dongbag: sudo elevates your access
20:11 < dongbag> sudo did not work - why did sudo -s?
20:11 < dongbag> what dose the -s mean?
20:11 < luke-jr> maybe you only have permissions for -s?
20:11 < qman__> Yes, i use UPSes anyway, but i don't need as much runtime and the batteries last longer
20:12 < dongbag> what does that mean
20:12 < SuperSeriousCat> man sudo -> "/" to search -> --shell
20:12 < luke-jr> man sudo is helpful for knowing what -s means
20:12 < dongbag> I read that - stil drawing a blank
20:13 < qman__> I recommend used APC SmartUPS 1400/1500 towers
20:13 < qman__> $100-150 on ebay, new batteries are under $100
20:13 < luke-jr> hmm
20:13 < longxia> dongbag: what was the error message when you used sudo without the -s option?
20:13 < dongbag> file was READonly
20:13 < dongbag> but i did chmod 777 on said file
20:14 < alexandre9099> is there any similar software to teamviewer (i know that teamviewer has beta or alpha support on linux) that does remote control + no need to forward ports? i would like to help someone trough the internet
20:14 < luke-jr> dongbag: … don't do that
20:14 < qman__> Batteries usually last about 3 years, unless you cook them
20:14 < luke-jr> alexandre9099: VNC has a reverse-connect option
20:14 < dongbag> it's fine, it's a tiny embedded device, brute force is ok here haha
20:15 < LtL> dongbag: -s means use the shell set in the current environment, i doubt you need any flags, sudo command runs as superuser
20:15 < alexandre9099> luke-jr, is it easy to setup the client? the client is not that tech savvy :)
20:15 < LtL> dongbag: provided youre in sudoers
20:15 < luke-jr> why do UPS product searches only have VA instead of watts? -.-
20:16 < Psi-Jack> luke-jr: ##hardware?
20:16 < dongbag> maybe their power-factor is not 1
20:16 < LtL> dongbag: you probably need chown not just chmod.
20:16 < dongbag> i'll try again
20:17 < qman__> luke-jr: marketing, the VA number is bigger
20:17 < dongbag> VA > W usually, since the current and voltage are not always 100% locked
20:17 < qman__> The APCs i suggested are 950w
20:18 < dongbag> google "VA Watts beer" =)
20:18 < alexandre9099> luke-jr, hmm reverse connect is also not an option because of the need to forward the ports
20:19 < luke-jr> alexandre9099: only on your end, and presumably you're competent enough for that
20:21 < qman__> The VA number is also easier to lie about
20:21 < qman__> So cheap junk will list high VA numbers that they don't actually do
20:23 < qman__> Those old APCs are a known quantity, built like tanks, I've yet to see an actual unit failure, just replace the batteries
20:23 < strixdio> anyone good with regex able to help me figure out some logic? I know very little but need to figure out how to do something
20:23 < doug16k> luke-jr, devices may be an inductive load, which causes current to lag behind voltage. because of this, the peak of the voltage and the peak of the current aren't aligned, so the actual power factor is less than one.
20:23 < hexnewbie> Brace for impact?
20:23 < notmike> https://powerquality.eaton.com/sea/thoughtleadership/power-protection/va-vs-watts.asp?act=smtc&id=&key=&Quest_user_id=&leadg_Q_QRequired=&site=&menu=&cx=3&x=15&y=9
20:24 < notmike> Lol
20:24 < notmike> FBI is at the door, excuse me
20:24 < dongbag> I would imagine older UPS have gigantic transforms connected directoy to mains to give 12V output casuing a lowering of the power factor
20:24 < dongbag> newer ones probably have switched tolopogies
20:27 < doug16k> luke-jr, VA accounts for the lag. naively measuring the current and multiplying by the voltage gives an incorrect result, which would be stated in watts.
20:27 < phogg> surf's up
20:37 < liveuser1> wow this channel looks more populated than debian on oftc
20:39  * liveuser1 clears throat
20:39 < rypervenche> lol
20:39 < liveuser1> u play rypervenche ?
20:40 < noodlepie> I've got it! Linux is an appointer! Cool term! hehe
20:42 < liveuser1> what is the problem with the system running things in the background and I wakeup and feel like in a prism of lies
20:42 < liveuser1> why was tumblerd running"
20:43 < liveuser1> as that bob again
20:43 < liveuser1> and the ru devs running manchurian curve algorythims
20:43 < Umeaboy> I'm thinking about http://buildbot.net/
20:44 < liveuser1> yeah?
20:47 < liveuser1> _systemd_is_evil: how remove systemd
20:48 < revel> Install a different init system, obviously.
20:48 < quul> systemd isn't just an init system
20:48 < Bocaneri> So move to something that doesn't use systemd, such as devuan.
20:49 < revel> Well, it's systemd that starts all the rest of the services that make up systemd.
20:49 < Dagmar> There's the biggest problem with it, right there.
20:49 < revel> I guess you'd probably want replacements for all of those, like eudev and cron and whatever else it ate up.
20:51 < triceratux> liveuser1: https://mxlinux.org/products
20:53 < liveuser1> triceratux: heh "upstream"
20:54 < liveuser1> yeah if systemd is evil what is the basis for the claim, if it is what I'd guess so is xfce4
20:54 < liveuser1> or xorg in general
20:55 < quul> because it hijacked core system services
20:56 < Namll> if you have a bash scrip that does one command after another, does it wait for the previous command to be done? I have a script that runs fine when only dealing with one loop, but if I have multiple loops they pile up and get processing errors. If it doesn't wait, what is the best way to tell if a process is still running and to wait until it finishes? sleep does not work in this case.
20:56 < quul> xorg just hijacked xfree86
20:57 < liveuser1> I was guessing it is starting aide and tumblerd
20:57 < revel> Namll: It will wait for the previous commands to finish unless you specifically do anything for it not to.
20:58 < liveuser1> xorg is sub7 legends?
20:58 < revel> If you're calling said script multiple times, though, as I understand, things won't be as simple?
20:58 < liveuser1> huh?
21:00 < Namll> revel: its just one script, it might have something to do with my while loop, ill tinker more.
21:02 < longxia> Namll: you say "they pile up". What does they refer to?
21:03 < sbrothy> Hi again. OK. If "ldconfig" isn't necessarily always there, is /etc/ld.so.cache then?
21:03 < ayecee> no
21:03 < Prof_Birch> Can the Linux kernel make a decent real time kernel
21:03 < nekoseam> test
21:04 < ayecee> Prof_Birch: soft realtime, sure
21:04 < Prof_Birch> not sure I know the difference
21:04 < ayecee> probably not all that useful to ask the question then
21:05 < Prof_Birch> I'm contemplating the Zircon kernel with Google Fuchsia, and how it will fit into the Linux world
21:05 < ayecee> neat
21:06 < Prof_Birch> There's speculation that since it's a real time kernel, it will offer performance improvements over a traditional kernel. I know you can make Linux work with a round-robin schedule, but I can't put my finger on any performance differences
21:06 < liveuser1> there is a saying dream awake and then there's wake in dream, one cant really tell the difference and on either side there are accusers
21:06 < revel> Prof_Birch: I don't think real time == performance.
21:07 < Bocaneri> Prof_Birch, I remember reading around that realtime kernels would actually *degrade* overall performance to a degree.
21:07 < ayecee> they'd pretty much have to
21:07 < turkeyhand> how do I rebuild grub to find windows
21:07 < turkeyhand> in arch
21:07 < liveuser1> those who attak because " he don't think like us"
21:07 < liveuser1> the problem of C
21:07 < ayecee> liveuser1 doesn't like the drugs, but the drugs like him
21:08 < Bocaneri> And the abyss is staring at him most intently.
21:08 < Pentode> lol
21:08 < Prof_Birch> it does, for standard user systems. but it's crucial for hard-deadline systems, such as AR or something like a self driving vehicle, where the computer needs to make a decision
21:08 < Bocaneri> Prof_Birch, yes, which is why RT kernels exist. That doesn't make them performant for average desktop use.
21:09 < Prof_Birch> Fuchsia is meant for desktop and mobile, using a RT kernel
21:09 < ayecee> mostly reduces scheduling latency for high-priority tasks
21:09 < liveuser1> Bocaneri: yeah what is the intent?
21:09 < Bocaneri> liveuser1, to reduce line noise in the channel.
21:11 < SuperSeriousCat> turkeyhand, you need os-prober for it to find Windows. And NTFS support
21:11 < turkeyhand> ntfs support where
21:11 < liveuser1> Bocaneri: that reminds me it's been awhile since installing a RTK there was some post about no longer needing it
21:12 < ayecee> someone said something on the internet. news at 11.
21:12 < ayecee> eh. time to play video games.
21:12 < liveuser1> Bocaneri: do the newer linux kernels run realtime
21:12 < turkeyhand> how do I use os-prober to find windows and add that to grub
21:12 < SuperSeriousCat> Probably just need to install ntfs-3g
21:12 < turkeyhand> done
21:13 < Bocaneri> I'm not aware of any distro that supplies an RT kernel by default.
21:13 < sklv> linucvnv
21:13 < sklv> linuxcnc*
21:13 < Prof_Birch> Bocaneri: Fuchsia is an OS in current development by Google
21:14 < liveuser1> after first install of real time kernel internet mounts your skull catalouges your memories and recreates them?
21:14 < SuperSeriousCat> No idea if Arch use some kind of script. But the normal command is "grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg
21:14 < Prof_Birch> Boncaneri: Part of it's main source code has been ported to Android, and their is speculation it will be a replacement OS, that will work across all of their devices
21:14 < liveuser1> is that how linux works?
21:14 < Bocaneri> liveuser1, forgot to take some pills this morning, did we?
21:15 < Prof_Birch> Bocaneri: The belief is the use of a RT kernel is meant to heavily integrate AR features into the core OS
21:15 < Bocaneri> What's AR?
21:15 < sklv> artificial reality, presumably
21:15 < Prof_Birch> Augmented reality
21:15 < ayecee> augmented reality
21:15 < ayecee> like a more fancy HUD
21:15 < Prof_Birch> It's like when you have a virtual image overlayed on a real image
21:16 < liveuser1> can you afford them Bocaneri ?
21:16 < Bocaneri> liveuser1, take it somewhere else.
21:16 < liveuser1> take it to ##programming
21:18 < turkeyhand> I can't find how to use osprober to find the operating systems again and rebuild grub
21:18 < turkeyhand> archwiki says nothing about win10
21:18 < Prof_Birch> Hmmmm, should I just all in with Linux?
21:18 < liveuser1> Bocaneri: at least you are a higher echelon
21:19 < Pentode> Prof_Birch, of course.
21:19 < turkeyhand> I can't get this stupid printer working in linux and I need windows for a couple of things, plus it's taking up half my SSD
21:19 < SuperSeriousCat> Have you tried grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg?
21:20 < Prof_Birch> I've been thinking about Android/Linux/Android wear, but now I'm thinking Linux/Plasma OS/AsteroidOS
21:20 < turkeyhand> does that include osprober in anyway?
21:20 < SuperSeriousCat> You dont touch os-prober. Grub do it under the hood
21:20 < turkeyhand> this is arch I should add
21:21 < turkeyhand> and windows is the first partition
21:21 < SuperSeriousCat> Backup old grub.cfg if you are scared. Its still Linux and GRUB so it will work
21:22 < turkeyhand> um
21:22 < turkeyhand> where do I paste
21:22 < turkeyhand> it says it found windows and it says it's done
21:22 < turkeyhand> I suppose I restart and see
21:22 < turkeyhand> Generating grub configuration file ...
21:22 < turkeyhand> Found linux image: /boot/vmlinuz-linux-hardened
21:22 < turkeyhand> Found initrd image: /boot/intel-ucode.img /boot/initramfs-linux-hardened.img
21:22 < turkeyhand> Found fallback initrd image(s) in /boot: initramfs-linux-hardened-fallback.img
21:22 < turkeyhand> Found Windows 10 on /dev/sdb1
21:22 < turkeyhand> done
21:22 < SuperSeriousCat> If it wound Windows and Arch you are all set
21:22 < turkeyhand> shit sorry
21:22 < revel> sdb1?
21:23 < turkeyhand> yeah it's an internal ssd
21:23 < turkeyhand> first drive is the physical one
21:23 < revel> "physical"?
21:23 < turkeyhand> I modified this thinkpad
21:23 < revel> So the SSD is "virtual"?
21:23 < turkeyhand> physical, mechanical, whatever
21:23 < turkeyhand> thanks SuperSeriousCat
21:23 < turkeyhand> I'll see if it worked
21:23 < SuperSeriousCat> np
21:23 < turkeyhand> I didn't back anything up before running that
21:23 < turkeyhand> :/
21:23 < revel> Shouldn't matter.
21:24 < turkeyhand> it will still load linux at minimum?
21:24 < turkeyhand> or hopefully both
21:24 < SuperSeriousCat> You will get a menu and a few seconds to change to Windows before it autostart Arch
21:24 < turkeyhand> I hope this works!
21:24 < revel> I'm more optimistic about it loading Linux, though chainloading the Windows bootloader or whatever it does should also work.
21:24 < revel> And yeah, you'll get a menu.
21:26 < Prof_Birch> I need to ask myself if I just find Android daunting, or if Linux is really the right tool for the job
21:30 < MrPockets> Fucking hell PM2
21:30 < Psi-Jack> Ahem!
21:31 < quul> wtf happened MrPockets ?
21:32 < MrPockets> I am not by any shot able to get PM2 to STOP starting this flipp'n process
21:33 < quul> start it manually lol
21:33 < MrPockets> thats the problem. PM2 is starting  old_process automatically at boot
21:33 < MrPockets> and I want to run new_process
21:33 < Namll> anyone have experence with ffmpeg? my audio has a chirp in the begging I want to remove. so I want to trim from 00:00:01 to end of the song, but it seems like I cannot just speccify -ss 1 without a end, but each some has a different length. How can I do something like -ss 1: leaving it open so it only trims the first second.
21:34 < Namll> each song*
21:34 < quul> try searching for fade in/out
21:34 < quul> options
21:36 < Namll> quul: that might work, cheers
21:51 < thadtheman> If I have an existing shell, I add the user of that shell to a group, how do I update the shell to show that I am in that group?
21:52 < revel> Restart.
21:53 < revel> If I'm understanding you correctly.
21:55 < well_laid_lawn> to update groups the user must logout and login
21:57 < quul> aparrently theres a newgrp command, not sure how standard that is, i don't have it so it's not in coreutils
22:01 < Dagmar> There's sh
22:01 < Dagmar> er sg
22:03 < thadtheman> Why can't I just start a new shell?
22:04 < sklv> thadtheman: the group check happens independently of the shell and you shouldn't need to do anything
22:04 < sklv> run cat /etc/group before and after making your group membership change and look the file change
22:05 < quul> you have to --enable-newgrp for util-linux when you compile, it's not enabled by default i guess
22:05 < sklv> you may need to spawn a new shell for your shell's environment to be able to account for the new group membership though
22:06 < Dagmar> You can start a new shell.  New sessions will have hte group permissions relevant to the account when they're created
22:12 < phinxy> What kind of file is a /dev/input/mouse?
22:12 < quul> stat /dev/input/mouse : character special file
22:12 < mawk> a device file phinxy
22:13 < mawk> it has a major and minor number
22:13 < mawk> that links it to a kernel module
22:13 < turkeyhand> SuperSeriousCat, it totally worked, thanks
22:13 < SuperSeriousCat> np
22:13 < mawk> phinxy: whenever you open()/close()/write()/read()/poll()/ioctl()/flock()/..., a function is called in the kernel module
22:13 < turkeyhand> what was the command again?
22:14 < SuperSeriousCat> grub-mkconfig -o /boot/grub/grub.cfg
22:14 < turkeyhand> -o to probe for os?
22:14 < azarus> How does 9p compare to NFS?
22:14 < SuperSeriousCat> -o for overwrite
22:15 < turkeyhand> oh no shit, becuase I tried rebuilding grub several times and that's what must have been the fault
22:16 < revel> SuperSeriousCat: No, -o for output.
22:16 < revel> It'll write to stdout by default.
22:16 < SuperSeriousCat> Ah
22:17 < SuperSeriousCat> No. "man grub-mkconfig" show "-o, --output=FILE"
22:17 < revel> That's what I said?
22:17 < phinxy> Are there ways to create a device special file in Python, without any real kernel module programming?
22:17 < Psi-Jack> azarus: Well, for one, 9p is native and doesn't require any additional setup.
22:18 < revel> Without -o, it'll write to stdout. With -o, it'll write the output to the specified file.
22:18 < SuperSeriousCat> overwrite/output. Semantics :p
22:18 < Li> which user files are being edited while using crontab -e ?
22:18 < revel> phinxy: system("mknod") :D
22:18 < azarus> Psi-Jack: Can the linux implementation also act as a server?
22:18 < revel> Or sys.shell("mknod") or something.
22:19 < Psi-Jack> azarus: https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/filesystems/9p.txt
22:20 < mawk> phinxy: you mean implement it ?
22:20 < phinxy> revel• I might actually be able to fix my mouse then.  It only works in X.
22:20 < azarus> So only client? Aww :(
22:20 < mawk> you'd rather want to see FUSE for that
22:20 < mawk> mknod creates a device file for an existing driver, it doesn't implement the driver
22:20 < mawk> FUSE might be your friend here
22:23 < quul> phinxy: might be a simple permission problem on the file
22:24 < phinxy> quul• What do you mean?
22:24 < phinxy> I have not explained the issue, how would you be able to guess?
22:24 < quul> by default the mode is 0600 on /dev/input/mouse*
22:25 < quul> so only root would be able to read/write to it
22:30 < candidat> windows sux :)
22:36 < glitchd> candidat, duh.
22:36 < revel> Doesn't anybody boot an efistub kernel directly and manage it with efibootmgr? :<
22:36 < dgurney> I used to a while ago
22:36 < revel> dgurney: How'd you add kernel parameters?
22:36 < revel> --unicode on efibootmgr?
22:36 < revel> Or compiled in?
22:36 < dgurney> revel, I just compiled in
22:37 < revel> Aww.
22:37 < dgurney> if I needed to add something temporarily, I used kexec
22:37 < dgurney> I'm sure there's a way to do it with efibootmgr itself though
22:37 < revel> There is, though there seems to be a peculiarity with it, at least on my system.
22:38 < revel> In that you have to prefix the parameters with a space or it won't work. Haven't seen anybody else who uses efistub+efibootmgr+efibootmgr to manage params though.
22:49 < Tech_8> hi
22:49 < stefmorino> howdy
22:49 < Tech_8> how are yuou
22:49 < stefmorino> dead inside
22:49 < stefmorino> so better than usual
22:53 < faLUCE> Hello, do you know any newsreader for linux which can send "cancel messages" ?
22:57 < Psi-Jack> People still use newsgroups?
22:58 < DLange> not everybody has a pornhub account, yet :)
22:59 < Psi-Jack> LOL!
23:03 < Bocaneri> Yeah, usenet these days looks for all the world to me like efnet.
23:03 < Bocaneri> What a wasteland.
23:03 < candidat> do you pay for newsgroups ?
23:04 < Psi-Jack> Hmmmm.. Traefik's ACME/LE support is rather... Unsatisfying.
23:04 < Bocaneri> candidat, never used to, but I think just about every ISP in existence has dropped them.
23:08 < irwiss> i had high hopes for traefik from the presentations, but turns out all the advertised "no configuration files" are still there just shifted into even more annoying docker labels
23:11 < suez> you are in hell.  i am the http://gate.s.lamc.la to freedom, and to heaven.  fromthemachine.org ... and uh, tithehe.lamc.la
23:11 < suez> feel free to suck fat dick btw, freenode ircops--you are banned.
23:12 < [R]> wtf...
23:12 < Bocaneri> Ban that.
23:15 < revel> adam5?
23:17 < hexnewbie> There were 8 beta versions before the final Adam was first released on the planet. Like in Alien Ressurection.
23:17 < hexnewbie> s/ssur/surr/
23:18 < Truxx> what is efnet?
23:19  * Psi-Jack falls out of his chair.
23:19  * DLange tucks Psi-Jack back into his wheelchair
23:20  * Bocaneri looks for his walker
23:20  * luxio yells at children to get off mah lawn
23:20 < Bocaneri> Truxx, EFNET is an IRC net, like Freenode. Very old, I think it was the *first* such net. It's full of tumbleweeds now.
23:21 < Psi-Jack> It wasn't technically the "first", but it was the first most widespread public one.
23:22 < dysfigured> what can i do to make a guest account on my vps that is only allowed to run like 2-3 commands
23:22 < luxio> TIL there's a wikipedia page of this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_kids_get_off_my_lawn!
23:23 < [R]> dysfigured: run how?
23:23 < luxio> dysfigured: why can you only run 2-3 commands
23:23 < Truxx> Bocaneri: I see. Thank you for the explanation.
23:23 < luxio> are you trying to get around restrictions by your provider?
23:23 < luxio> dysfigured: http://xyproblem.info/
23:24 < dysfigured> i'm using wemux, i want to "stream" whatever is happening in my wemux session over ssh via a guest account
23:24 < MrGrz> k
23:24 < MrGrz> p
23:24 < dysfigured> wemux is like a wrapper around tmux https://github.com/zolrath/wemux
23:24 < quul> do you want it to deter 95% of attackers or 99% ?
23:25 < MrGrz> hi
23:25 < [R]> don't be a fool, wrap your tmux
23:25 < hexnewbie> dysfigured: SSH supports forced commands for certain keys, possibly it can be made to support them for a whole account. But that would depend on wemux being secure, which I wouldn't trust it to be.
23:25 < luxio> [R]: "remember to have safe ssh, wrap your tmux"
23:28 < DLange> wrapping a massive beast like tmux makes no sense, security-wise
23:29 < DLange> that's like wrapping emacs and thinking nobody could shell out
23:29 < hexnewbie> I think there would be ways to stream a terminal session remotely without requiring running a command, like a live version of 'script'
23:29 < luxio> DLange: https://github.com/dakrone/eos
23:32 < hexnewbie> Actually, script supports pipes, so you can simply run script to a pipe and cat it from the ‘guest’ end.
23:32 < MrGrz> hi
23:32 < MrGrz> p
23:32 < MrGrz> hi
23:33 < dysfigured> well i also use it for "pair programming"
23:34 < kocak> p
23:34 < jeffree> what happens if I 'sudo apt remove apt'?
23:34 < azarus> jeffree: try it and see?
23:35 < jeffree> I'm scared
23:35 < azarus> start a vm
23:35 < jeffree> it's so tempting
23:35 < jeffree> good idea
23:35 < dysfigured> hexnewbie: i'm using ForceCommand in sshd_config https://gist.github.com/DanielFGray/81430bc8c3d48a0a9932d1bfddacf131
23:36 < dysfigured> i don't really trust wemux to be secure either which is why i wanted to see what i can do about making sure it can't do too much damage if it's not, ideally can't run any other commands besides bash and wemux
23:37 < [R]> chroot
23:37 < nejni-marji> where does encfs actually store the encrypted data?
23:37 < dysfigured> how do i get them to ssh into a chroot
23:37 < [R]> you set up ssh
23:38 < dysfigured> i guess i've only made like entire distro chroots
23:38 < nejni-marji> actually nevermind
23:39 < quul> chroot + make sure anywhere with +w is mounted with noexec  like /home/user /tmp /var/tmp
23:40 < [R]> but then also know that chroot isn't security
23:40 < dysfigured> it'd be cool to set up some kind of monitoring to let me know if command not on a list is ever ran
23:43 < jeffree> interesting, it warns me in a way I've never seen
23:44 < jeffree> in this case 'yes' isn't good enough
23:46 < azarus> jeffree: yes, because it's a system package
23:46 < jeffree> alright, it actually removes apt
--- Log closed Mon May 21 00:00:27 2018