--- Log opened Tue May 29 00:00:36 2018
00:18 < python476> anyone reads pdf in terminal M
00:18 < python476> s/M/?/
00:18 < storge> qrvpzvb: you can do a lot in terminals and framebuffer tho
00:18 < python476> looking for a tiny program to do that
00:19 < phogg> python476: pdf2text?
00:19 < phogg> or rather pdf2ps combined with ps2txt
00:19 < python476> phogg: I shall try
00:19 < python476> I was looking for something not involving temp files
00:20 < [R]> so use pipes
00:20 < storge> [R] knows all about pipes
00:20 < phogg> python476: pdf2ps infile - | ps2txt
00:20 < storge> phogg: nice trick thanks
00:20 < phogg> python476: it may still use temp files internally (probably does)
00:21 < [R]> storge: do you remember the song 'hashpipe by weezer'? on mtv, they used to call it halfpipe on TRL... cuz ya know... drug references
00:21 < python476> yeah, as long as it's transient and os managed
00:21 < python476> thanks^2
00:21 < storge> [R] the only thing i know about drugs is how to take them
00:21 < [R]> lol
00:22 < phogg> [R]: did they really? How amusing
00:22 < phogg> you don't need to know anything about drugs to like weezer's hashpipe
00:22 < phogg> sounds wrong when you say it, though
00:22 < [R]> there was a few times carson daily accidently called it hashpipe, and it was hilarious
00:22 < python476> for some reason I only have ps2ascii
00:22 < phogg> python476: must not be running Debian
00:22 < d1z> is it possible for ssh to allow log in from a kerberos ldap by using the user's keytab as private key?
00:23 < python476> phogg: busted
00:23 < python476> <= arch
00:23 < phogg> python476: Debian has both
00:23 < storge> [R]: more important, there was at least a few times you watched mtv garbage
00:23 < phogg> python476: but they're really the same thing
00:23 < [R]> storge: i loved watching TRL when i was in like middle school
00:24 < storge> [R]: me too when i was in juvi, also later in prison, but i had no choice
00:24 < phogg> python476: it appears that ps2ascii supports pdf natively, so you can just ps2ascii pdf textfile
00:24 < python476> well my first 2 pdfs failed hard
00:24 < python476> ha
00:24 < [R]> storge: lol
00:25 < phogg> storge: MTV was not always garbage.
00:25 < [R]> i miss teen mom
00:25 < python476> phogg: that works beautifully
00:25 < python476> you just rendered web 2.0 obsolete
00:25 < phogg> that's what I do
00:25 < python476> if you live near Paris Ill offer you my gratitude
00:26 < phogg> if you want to show gratitude help somebody else later
00:26 < storge> phogg: true. 120 Minutes back in the day--right after Young Ones--was a good brit window into new alternative musik
00:26 < storge> phogg: are all those tools in pstotext
00:26 < python476> phogg: I pass that buck everyday
00:26 < phogg> storge: I think so
00:26  * storge installs it
00:27  * storge also installs fbi because forgot in this new install
00:27 < python476> sadly ps2ascii doesnt like rustland tutorial pdf
00:27 < python476> alas
00:27 < python476> got to go
00:27 < HumanSheeple> https://imgur.com/a/ZnjZqij
00:27 < HumanSheeple> https://imgur.com/a/UW4AT0w
00:27 < HumanSheeple> I'm trying to do a dual boot, linux works fiune but windows won't boot any ideas how to help?
00:27 < phogg> python476: it probably does not embed actual text. Next option: OCR
00:28 < phogg> HumanSheeple: sounds like you already have the ideal solution
00:28 < python476> phogg: I'd be surprised, it's the kind of github source based pdf
00:28 < python476> but pdf is so large, maybe they exported vectors or jpegs .. yeah
00:29 < HumanSheeple> lol phogg
00:29 < phogg> HumanSheeple: ask #windows. You're getting to windows' bootloader but it's not finding the disk properly. Something like that. Did you repartition anything on the Linux side?
00:30 < phogg> HumanSheeple: used to be you could fix this by fiddling around with the Windows boot params text file, but I don't know what they require any more. All my info is pre-EFI and with older versions of Windows, too.
00:30  * phogg could probably Google up an answer, but that sounds like enabling someone to use Windows.
00:30 < phogg> not part of my agenda
00:33 < rcf> HumanSheeple: what you want is bcdboot -- see https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/manufacture/desktop/bcdboot-command-line-options-techref-di -- but keep in mind people here probably can't help much with that because they're probably not using Windows.
00:34 < HumanSheeple> I do agree with you phogg last week's windows 7 experience I had was PAINFUL, it took 30 seconds for the start menu to pop up, don't even get me started about internet explorer
00:35 < rant> anyone have advice on how to remap buttons on something like this https://i1.rozetka.ua/goods/2146360/21106184_images_2146360322.jpg  so I can use i as a gamepad in xorg? Needs to be fairly RT, map only that device, remap MM keys and mouse butons as thas what most he buttons at the top are.
00:35 < HumanSheeple> It was soooo nice to be back on linux again, but sadly even with the state of hte art Vulkan bleeding edge libraries off github I could only get Far Cry 5 to run and a measly 3 frames per second on arch linux
00:35 < HumanSheeple> antergos is basically arch
00:36 < saltlake> hi
00:36 < HumanSheeple> So I completed Far Cry 5 on windows, unable to boot to linux, then fixed the GPT and the grub in testdisk
00:36 < HumanSheeple> but now linux works and windows doesn't
00:37 < rant> HumanSheeple: I personally love how you can take something like say a simple keyboard/mouse reciever whose driver is installed and working, move it to a different USB port and it'll take 10 minutes for it to search the galaxy for a driver for it.. thats a lovely feauture of windows
00:40 < HumanSheeple> rant, OMG yes Windows is soooooo bad I mean it's great that WINE 3.0 is out so at least all the 2D windows games are very playable on linux now, but I hate the fact that all the big company game devs simply won't port games to linux anymore
00:40 < rant> there is a prety simple way to deal wih issues like that.. stop buying and playing and talking about them.. heh
00:41 < HumanSheeple> Well I actually really enjoy emulating old Amiga games in linux
00:41 < HumanSheeple> I found them to be surprisingly entertaining for 1.1MB
00:41 < Zharf> "anymore"... did they ever?
00:42 < rant> yeah well we got lots of games out there both FOSS and commercial that work on linux and most of em are above amiga quality
00:42 < Zharf> I do have like 390 of my ~1000 games on steam available on linux as well
00:43 < Zharf> most of them are indie stuff I guess
00:43 < HumanSheeple> The indie devs love to port to linux
00:43 < rant> personally I've been able to play games I liked like GTA-SA or such on linux for ages.. and it worked better on linux becaue I didnt have to fight with it to get a playstation or xbox controller to work
00:43 < HumanSheeple> I guess the big companies have microsoft lobbiests to say "don't port to linux to help boost windows sales"
00:43 < HumanSheeple> Anything from pre 2011 will WINE just fine
00:44 < Zharf> it's not that, it's the development cost in general
00:44 < HumanSheeple> Except all the win95 win98 games then you're better off with xp in virtualbox
00:44 < rant> I havent used wine in ages.. I had crossover and it worked well..
00:44 < HumanSheeple> and dos use DOSBOX obviously
00:44 < Zharf> though as more and more engines get better ilnux support then it's not so big of an issue
00:44 < Ben64> got tomb raider recently
00:44 < strive> C&C Red Alert!
00:45 < HumanSheeple> to get the vulkan bleeding edge files to work you have to use command line wine and compile from source
00:45 < rant> I was gonna try that openra but I'm kinda space constrained right now
00:45 < HumanSheeple> which tomb raider? 1996 or 2013?
00:45 < Ben64> 2013
00:45 < rant> I always enjoyed C&C Red Aler
00:45 < strive> Affirmative.
00:45 < HumanSheeple> The one when she's on the japanese island or the one where she's in Russia?
00:45 < Ben64> haven't played that long yet
00:46 < storge> that was poor management that let C&C wither into yesterday
00:46 < Zharf> japanese island was the 2013 one I think, it's pretty good
00:46 < Zharf> considering I hated the previous tomb raiders
00:46 < rant> storge: EA was famous for buying up game companies and ruining them
00:46 < storge> my favorite game nowadays is creeper world 3. i can turtle up and defend and advance, managing resources like starcraft and it's a lot more fun
00:47 < rant> their version of RA the level editor wouldnt work at all
00:47 < storge> and i like that in creeper world 3 i can get a good defense going --essentially a stalemate or slow advance til i make a move-- and let the game play itself for long periods of time
00:48 < HumanSheeple> Come on Nude Raider 2 1998 was a lot of fun
00:48 < HumanSheeple> rant, Disney is famous for buying up franchises and ruining them too
00:48 < HumanSheeple> It's all about the destruction of fan bases
00:48 < rant> one problem with games like that is the AI is so f'n stupid. they wont even use naval/air for example in RA
00:49 < HumanSheeple> Well they might drop parabombs on you
00:50 < rant> which makes no sense to me cause it seems like in that game it all works the same.. hedgewars still doesnt have AI for a lot of the weapons but thas cause their use is complex and drastically different
00:50 < HumanSheeple> Do you remember how bad the AI was in Transport Tycoon 1? They would cut through the mountain, run out of money and go bankrupt
00:50 < HumanSheeple> I would say Half Life probably had the first good AI
00:51 < HumanSheeple> But that was a FPS
00:51 < rant> never played that one.. Played a lot of the Maxis style sims like Sim City, Sim Ciy 2000, Sim Ant, Sim Hospital, Sim Theme Park
00:51 < HumanSheeple> Starcraft 2, grey goo have good AI's but RTS are really kind of well let's just say they've had their day
00:51 < HumanSheeple> I remember SC2K, the one eyed monster lol
00:51 < rant> I enjoyed the theme park games on all plaforms when I was young
00:53 < rant> I saw they got an open engine for System Shock now too
00:54 < HumanSheeple> And an open engine for Thief 1
00:55 < HumanSheeple> Warren Spector is another Great of the Games
00:55 < HumanSheeple> He's up there with Gabe Newell
00:55 < HumanSheeple> He made Thief, System Shock, Deus Ex, Bioshock
00:55 < phogg> an open engine for thief 1? That would be nice
00:55 < rant> with all ethical constraints removed, SHODAN re-examines...  I-I-I- re-examine my priorities. The hackers work is fin-ished but mine is only just b-b-b-b-b-eginning...
00:55 < HumanSheeple> Yeah the graphics are much much better
00:56 < roflsausage> Is it working? Am I heard? :D
00:56 < phogg> roflsausage: no one hears you
00:56 < roflsausage> Can you guys see these messages? IRC noob lol I think I did it
00:56 < [R]> lol
00:57 < rant> *lol*
00:57 < rant>   |/
00:57 < rant>   |
01:00 < HumanSheeple> Aside from burning down Microsoft HQ to ashes, doesn't anyone have a fix for why windows won't boot?
01:00 < [R]> HumanSheeple: yes, stop using it
01:00 < [R]> problems sovled
01:01 < epicmetal> HumanSheeple: /j ##windows
01:01 < HumanSheeple> I went there then they told me to join the grub channel
01:02 < [R]> well this isn't "the grub channel"
01:02 < [R]> so...
01:03 < Mion> HumanSheeple: call MS customer support
01:04 < HumanSheeple> They told me they don't support linux
01:04 < HumanSheeple> On multiple occassions
01:04 < [R]> well that sounds unfortunate for you i suppose
01:04 < HumanSheeple> Their advice was to format the entire hard disk and have ONLY a windows partition
01:05 < HumanSheeple> F**k that!
01:05 < rcf> HumanSheeple: do you have the Windows installation media?
01:05 < [R]> HumanSheeple: things would probably work better if yo uused a major dist
01:05 < rcf> HumanSheeple: if you do, you can fix the windows bootloader without reinstalling everything.
01:06 < rcf> Well, you'll probably have to reconfigure the Linux bootloader but people here could actually help with that.
01:07 < nekoseam> test1
01:07 < nekoseam> it works :D
01:07 < lnnb> congrats, you did it!
01:08 < HumanSheeple> I have an EFI partition and a bios boot partition, the former is 2GB the latter is 200MB
01:08 < HumanSheeple> Should I mount the partitions and have a look at the files?
01:08 < lnnb> is this a multiple choice question?
01:09 < rcf> HumanSheeple: was your Windows install BIOS-based or UEFI?
01:09 < mouses> HumanSheeple: Do you have a handy linux USB/DVD/whatever you can boot live?
01:10 < mouses> HumanSheeple: I'm assuming this drive has multiple partitions, windows + a linux distro?
01:10 < HumanSheeple> yeah loads, arch, antergos live, win PE, gparted boot kali
01:10 < HumanSheeple> yes it does
01:10 < HumanSheeple> https://imgur.com/a/UW4AT0w
01:10 < HumanSheeple> https://imgur.com/a/zVmnD4v
01:10 < mouses> HumanSheeple: Okay!  Well, for this I would recommend something like xubuntu....
01:10 < HumanSheeple> https://imgur.com/a/ZnjZqij
01:10 < mouses> HumanSheeple: check this package out:
01:10 < mouses> HumanSheeple: https://sourceforge.net/p/boot-repair/home/Home/
01:10 < Mion> official grub docs are quite good, read them
01:11 < mouses> HumanSheeple: boot into a live session, install that tool
01:11 < mouses> HumanSheeple: click button
01:11 < mouses> HumanSheeple: get bacon
01:11 < Mion> way better than boot repair
01:11 < mouses> HumanSheeple: it'll automatically look over the drive and deal with things for you.
01:11 < mouses> Mion: sure, one could manually do it with grub as well.
01:12 < mouses> HumanSheeple: i've had great success with boot-repair for the issue you are having
01:12 < Mion> he might actually learn something too, but then again, learning is dangerous, specially to vampires that constantly asks questions in totally unrelated channels to his actual problem *cough*
01:13 < cimmm> Hi, wondering if anyone can help or point me in the right direction for where to ask about this. Ubuntu 16.04 system suffered power failure and won't boot past emergency mode. Most errors in journalctl -xb point to issues with sdb (storage drive) - invalid checksum, error reading journal. fsck tells me metadata_csum is unsupported and ran testdisk analysis overnight. Showing a lot more partitions than the expected 1 and not sure how to 
01:13 < mouses> Mion: I'm not into gatekeeping, just helping.
01:13 < mouses> Mion: he came here for our help, we should be flattered and kind about it.
01:13 < HumanSheeple> mouses: so just download the iso, burn to disk, reboot, boot from cd yes?
01:14 < HumanSheeple> boot-repair-disk-64bit.iso is that the ticket?
01:14 < mouses> yup
01:14 < HumanSheeple> 708MB should fit onto a CD+R
01:14 < [R]> cimmm: well if the kernel won't mount it and fsck wont fix it
01:14 < [R]> not much you can do
01:14 < mouses> HumanSheeple: with any luck it'll take care of your issue, and it's not going to make it worse
01:14 < jonan> attempting to ssh into my other machine just hangs after entering the username@localIP, i have openssh-hpn-git on my other machine, the guest only has openssh, would this cause a conflict?
01:15 < HumanSheeple> Wow thanks mouses!
01:15 < HumanSheeple> I'll give it a go and if I'm stuck well I don't know
01:15 < mouses> HumanSheeple: glad to help, please report back and let me know if it worked - i'd be happy to walk you through doing it manually, but this tool should take care of everything for you.
01:15 < Mion> jonan: -vvv and read the server side logs too
01:15 < mouses> Just use the 'automatic repair' function, HumanSheeple
01:15 < Mion> jonan: wireshark can also be a handy debug tool
01:16 < jonan> Mion: cheers mate, verbose seems to just hang on the connecting bit via a certain port, i suppose it could be a port that's blocked
01:17 < Mion> check if it is filtered or a black hole
01:17 < jnt> I wonder, did anyone else have issues with ethernet not working in linux after booting windows once? It literally doesn't work until i pull the power plug. I don't have any hope to fix this, I seldom boot windows anyway, but I wonder if this is a common thing with intel lan.
01:18 < Mion> laptop?
01:18 < Mion> some e1000e cards are also known to be buggy like that, specially with older kernels/firmware
01:19 < jonan> ah it seems my openssh server daemon is not running on the host
01:20 < lnnb> jnt: i've heard that story before in this channel, except for the power plug bit
01:20 < jnt> Mion: Last time I rebooted and forgot to pull the plug I ran 4.1.4x, but yeah, it's a e1000e one.
01:21 < Mion> sometimes poking it with mii-tools or similar can "unstick" it
01:21 < jnt> lnnb: well, pulling the plug or switching off the powersupply completely is the only way I got it working again after booting windows.
01:23 < jnt> Mion: mii-tool, never heard of that, guess I am gonna try that next time instead of crawling behind my computer under the table.
01:25 < slackin> Anyone have any idea why I would be getting performance like this from a thumb drive? (It happens with other thumb drives too, but when plugged into windows desktop get steady over 100mb/sec) https://pasteboard.co/HnkN75V.png
01:25 < cimmm> [R]: Alright if I can't mount the drive how can I at least get booted again?
01:25 < [R]> cimmm: if you can't mount it... how do yo uthink youre going to boot from it?
01:25 < HumanSheeple> cimmm: you might want to use testdisk then
01:25 < HumanSheeple> the partition is unmountable
01:26 < HumanSheeple> be careful you don't have the D option in testdisk I once accidentally deleted all my files
01:26 < HumanSheeple> It took me days to recover them all
01:26 < cimmm> Again, this is strictly storage. My boot SSD and second storage drive are reading and checking out fine with fsck
01:27 < [R]> oh, just remove it from fstab
01:27 < lnnb> what filesystem is it?
01:27 < Mion> slackin: which fs?
01:28 < cimmm> And I'm not sure what to make of testdisk telling me I have multiple FAT12/NTFS/boot partitions when it was a single ext4
01:29 < HumanSheeple> mouses: ok I'm off wish me luck!
01:29 < [R]> it just looks for signatures in the data
01:32 < cimmm> [R]: So testdisk wouldn't serve to rebuild my table, but I can copy to another disk then start over on the erroring disk?
01:33 < [R]> what?
01:34 < jnt> cimmm: extundelete can do that
01:34 < slackin> Mion, that's the drive itself, no FS
01:35 < cimmm> Well it's reading a screwy table, I assume I can't recover the disk in its previous state, but if I can find files and copy them I can build a new table, format, and copy back from what I understand. Sorry I don't have prior experience with testdisk
01:35 < slackin> Mion, and happens no matter what FS I use one it (NTFS/FAT/EXT4)
01:35 < Mion> slackin: actually that patter is not uncommong with ntfs-3g
01:35 < slackin> Mion, happens with no FS at all, and ext4 as well
01:35 < jnt> ah nah, it hat a different name i think
01:36 < Mion> cimmm: testdisk can only make a educated guess, it doesn't really know which fs it is
01:36 < Mion> cimmm: you might have better luck with gpart btw if it is just the table that is borked
01:42 < jnt> cimmm: What exactly is broken? the partition table or the filesystem? does fdisk/gdisk/whatever still show the correct partition layout?
01:44 < HumanSheeple> hey mouses
01:44 < mouses> HumanSheeple: Hey hey!
01:44 < HumanSheeple> I tried the auto repair but it kept giving me error messages about having to unmount a partition
01:44 < HumanSheeple> still can't boot into windows
01:45 < HumanSheeple> boots into archlinux/antergos fine
01:45 < mouses> HumanSheeple: Try this for me....
01:45 < jonan> if no connection is currently established through SSH, would it show as an active process still on my machine?
01:45 < mouses> HumanSheeple: download a xubuntu iso
01:45 < mouses> HumanSheeple: burn it
01:45 < [R]> jonan: "it"?
01:45 < mouses> HumanSheeple: from it's terminal, sudo apt install boot-repair
01:45 < mouses> HumanSheeple: *assuming it's still in the repos, you might have to get the .deb from sourceforge*
01:46 < jonan> sorry for being vague, i'd like to know if the ssh server is open on my machine, by typing in systemctl status openssh (ssh or whatever other variant) shows i have no service to it
01:46 < [R]> jonan: yes, if sshd is running, it will show up in ps
01:46 < jnt> jonan: one sshd process should always run and wait for connections, when you connect it spawns more processes for each user
01:46 < mouses> HumanSheeple: just add the PPA, actually
01:46 < mouses> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Boot-Repair
01:46 < jonan> or if i want to check open ports using something like netstat -tulpn, i don't see any ssh processes
01:46 < jonan> i dont see the PID for ssh anywhere
01:46 < Styil> its SSHD
01:46 < Styil> I believe
01:46 < [R]> if port 22 isn't show up in netstat
01:46 < [R]> then sshd isn't running
01:47 < jonan> hmm sshd service still not foudn
01:47 < jonan> systemctl start sshd?
01:47 < [R]> then sounds like its not running
01:47 < HumanSheeple> isn't there an arch linux equivalent on package manager or AUR?
01:47 < cimmm> jnt: I just booted again, gparted shows full drive ext4 partition as expected, running check within gives same error as fsck telling me to upgrade e2fsck to support metadata_csum
01:47 < jonan> yeah i have openssh-hpn-git, but i'm not sure hwo to start the daemon for it
01:47 < [R]> no sure wht openssh-hpn-git is
01:47 < [R]> but if you downlaoded some random pacakge
01:48 < [R]> and dont know how to use it
01:48 < [R]> you should consult its dcoumetantion
01:48 < jonan> well it's just a patched version of ssh allegedly
01:48 < [R]> allegedlyl?
01:48 < [R]> you instaleld somethigna nd you dont even know what it is?
01:48 < jnt> cimmm: well, your partition table seems correct then, did you try updating e2fsprogs?
01:49 < jonan> i'm really new at this man, i trusted it since it had a lot of confidence rating int he aur
01:49 < [R]> aur
01:49 < [R]> ROFL
01:49 < [R]> why am i not surprised
01:49 < jonan> i dont get it
01:49 < [R]> person has no clue what they are doing... uses arch, installs random packages wihtout knowing what they are
01:49 < [R]> this isn't going to end poorly...
01:50 < cimmm> jnt: going for that now
01:50 < jonan> i fell for the meme, but it's literally just a forked version of openssh
01:51 < jonan> it doesn't allude to it having any other variant daemon, in particular any naming convention being different
01:52 < jnt> cimmm: which distro do you use?
01:52 < mouses> jonan: did some googling and just not sure about said package, the documentation is hard to track down :(
01:53 < jonan> anyway sshd.socket was what iw as looking for
01:53 < mouses> jonan: is there a man page for it on your system?
01:53 < jnt> cimmm: and which version is e2fsck? run `e2fsck -V`
01:53 < jonan> mouses: it just copies from the ssh man, but i'm a step closer now that i found the right wording to start the daemon :)
01:53 < mouses> jonan: yay!
01:53 < mouses> jonan: good luck :)
01:53 < cimmm> jnt: ubuntu 16.04. after apt-get update and install e2fsprogs it tells me I'm current so I think I'm gonna have to build it
01:55 < jnt> cimmm: it's your best bet to fix this, instead of building it yourself, you could also boot some livedisk which has a newer version
01:56 < jnt> cimmm: ubuntu 18.04 apparently has 1.44.1, so you live boot that and see if e2fsck works.
01:57 < cimmm> jnt: Thanks i'll grab that now
01:57 < jnt> cimm: this seems to be your exact issue: https://askubuntu.com/questions/747656/ext4-broken-file-system-on-ubuntu-14-04-4
02:00 < alexi5> hello ladies and gentlemen
02:02 < nekoseam> alexi5: Hi
02:04 < alexi5> do you guys know of any web app with an editor that allows for creating email messages that can be sent to a  distribution list ?
02:05 < revel> CC lists have existed since forever.
02:05 < revel> Or do you mean like a mailing list?
02:08 < sauvin> It's called "gmail".
02:10 < Mion> or any other web based email
02:15 < cimmm> Aww yes, you guys are too good. the updated e2fsck posted as answer got me going and everything seems fine. For now I'm just gonna upgrade to 18.04 but I'll be looking for another distro this weekend. Really frustrating to use 16.04 claiming LTS EOL in 2021 without updates to give me tools to fix a fs i created using bundled tools...
02:16 < jnt> cimmm: well, LTS usually doesn't update packages, but only patches bugs and security vulnerabilities. Though I really have no idea why that option is enabled, when e2fsck can't fsck it then.
02:17 < Mion> if you never mount it using a newer kernel then it would be no problem
02:17 < jnt> cimmm: Anyway, I am glad I was able to help
02:20 < granttrec> if canopen is a protocal layer is can still accesed the same way, with socket can?
02:21 < granttrec> if canopen is a protocal layer can it still be accesed the same way, with socket can?
02:21 < matsaman> cimmm: LTS is just a mind trick to make people feel good about avoiding updates when they shouldn't be, anyway
02:22 < matsaman> generally the laziest path is a great path, but not in that case
02:22 < ayecee> interesting perspective
02:24 < matsaman> ikr
02:24 < matsaman> five years without updating? So you have a known track record of setting deadlines five years in advance and making them and also somehow have software so crap it isn't worth modifying in five years
02:25 < matsaman> fairly paradoxical situation, IMO
02:26 < nevodka> I'm trying to use pulseaudio over my LAN but noticed on my client machine in paprefs the 'Make discoverable PulseAudio network sound devices available locally' box is greyed out
02:27  * matsaman stopped at 'pulseaudio'
02:27 < matsaman> you're doing it wrong
02:27 < matsaman> and also wrong
02:27 < nevodka> no clue why
02:27 < nevodka> running arch
02:27 < cimmm> jnt: You certainly saved me a lot of extra bs, but after going through this I'm gonna keep my distance from ubuntu. I figured large community and decent support, but #ubuntu wouldn't answer me and without support for their own features and no intent to update I can't use their distro or any future ones with confidence
02:27 < nekoseam> pulseaudio and arch
02:27 < nekoseam> sounds like a perfectly good combo in which everything will function as expected
02:27 < cmj> why the hate for pulseaudio?
02:27 < KirkoBang> asla mxxxier
02:27 < matsaman> cimmm: there is definitely some merit to your conclusions
02:28 < nevodka> and furthermore it allows me to enable this as a server but then greys out 'Allow other machines on the LAN to discover local sonud devices'
02:28 < matsaman> I would say mostly, though, if you willfully let any distro sit for five years, you will have a long update process ahead
02:28 < matsaman> and you'll want to know the update system intimately, or you'll be boned
02:28 < cmj> yeah i can't run debian stable.
02:29 < cmj> aka deadbian
02:29 < nekoseam> I use Debian because I like getting stuff done
02:29 < Mion> nekoseam: I'm old enough to remember the days before pulse, and it was not as rosy red as you think
02:29 < cmj> sid is good but even then i still have to build stuff to stay ahead
02:29 < PowerPCM_> Does anyone know a unix command to move all files of one type into one file?
02:29 < matsaman> stay ahead of what?
02:29 < matsaman> for Debian, testing should be fine
02:30 < Mion> PowerPCM_: cat *.txt > allthethings.txt
02:30 < Mion> actual valid use of cat
02:30 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: what type?
02:30 < nevodka> I just want to stream audio over my LAN
02:30 < cmj> nekoseam: can you not get stuff done whilst things are building in the background?
02:30 < matsaman> nevodka: why?
02:30 < jnt> What alternative to pulse is there even if you want features like per application volume control etc.
02:30 < nevodka> because it's convenient for me
02:30 < PowerPCM_> matsaman: .chm
02:30 < Mion> jnt: in practice none
02:30 < cmj> nothing. we all use pulse now
02:31 < matsaman> jnt: you really only need that if you're an audio producer
02:31 < cmj> hdmi, bluetooth, etc
02:31  * matsaman doesn't use pulse, has no plan to
02:31 < cmj> pulsemixer is great
02:31 < matsaman> and for an audio producer you can probably just use jack, too
02:31 < Mion> matsaman: no, you need per application volume if you are a consumer
02:31 < cmj> yep
02:31 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: I'm not sure CHM as a format allows that without an extra processor
02:31 < PowerPCM_> what
02:31 < matsaman> Mion: I wonder how I've managed without it this whole time, then
02:32 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: you want a bunch of CHMs to be one file that you open and read as if they were all one after the other?
02:32 < Mion> by never listening to more than once thing at a time :p
02:32 < nekoseam> Does anybody here have rkhunter installed? These days with Ubuntu snap malware, the miner the PCLOS community found, ect.
02:32 < matsaman> Mion: like what? Listening to music while you watch a film?
02:32 < cmj> pulsemixer does have multichannel support
02:32 < PowerPCM_> matsaman: just in one folder
02:32 < PowerPCM_> store thhere
02:32 < matsaman> nekoseam: no, because it's useless
02:32 < nekoseam> i think it's a good idea
02:32 < cmj> audio rather
02:32 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: oh that's much simpler
02:33 < cmj> so weird
02:33 < nekoseam> matsaman: It scans if already found malware is on the system
02:33 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: find . -type f -iname '*.chm*' will get you far
02:33 < nekoseam> So if it's recent malware it IS useless
02:33 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: find . -type f -iname '*.chm*' | less, check its output
02:33 < Mion> matsaman: game + music, or just lowering the volume when you get a phone call etc
02:33 < jnt> I am wondering though, when I ctrl-alt-F1 outside of X, pulseaudio stops playing audio, is there a way to change that?
02:33 < matsaman> PowerPCM_: then when you're confident it's only files you want to move, you can make it find . -type f -iname '*.chm*' -exec mv -n {} somewhere/ \;
02:33 < PowerPCM_> I will give it a try
02:33 < matsaman> nekoseam: it's useless 100% of the time
02:33 < cmj> Mion: yeah we all use pulseadio, yet to hear a valid reason not to
02:34 < matsaman> the only way to make a system that has been compromised again un-compromised is to have been checking which files exist and what they are made up of from installation time
02:34 < matsaman> or: to reinstall
02:34 < matsaman> anything else is a waste of time
02:34 < matsaman> look into AIDE (after an installation)
02:34 < cmj> there is rkhunter
02:34 < matsaman> "we all use it so it must be worth using"
02:34 < Mion> cmj: there are valid reasons not to, like latency, but then again jack + pulse combined works quite well too these days
02:34 < matsaman> classic
02:34 < nekoseam> matsaman: I've done tests by enabling a lot of thid party repositories and installing from them and rkhunter found some malware
02:35 < lnnb> what if i don't use it, am i an outcast?
02:35 < nekoseam> in a live image of coursew
02:35 < matsaman> you will do well in the future =P
02:35 < cmj> matsaman: tell me why one shouldn't use pulseaudio
02:35 < matsaman> nekoseam: but not all, and you also found lots of false positives
02:35 < lnnb> cmj, why use pulse audio?
02:35 < matsaman> lnnb: no, you're either smart or just some person
02:35 < Mion> nekoseam: rkhunter is basically useless without a profile from a known good state
02:35 < nekoseam> matsaman: do you have evidence of that?
02:35 < cmj> i think that was just explained
02:35 < Mion> (and even then it is not that great)
02:35 < matsaman> cmj: it is additional to ALSA and is unneeded, it is superfluous
02:35 < cmj> so here we are
02:35 < lnnb> i read "because we all use it" and stopped there
02:35 < matsaman> thin of a reason to use it and you'll get somewhere
02:35 < matsaman> it's more software that adds nothing
02:36 < cmj> you think we can have the same capability with just alsa?
02:36 < Mion> matsaman: unless you need the features it provides, want glitch free playback, want better battery life etc
02:36 < nekoseam> I know you shouldn't let it hold your hand and depend on it entirely
02:36 < matsaman> nekoseam: personally no, because it's a fundamental truth and not worth proving
02:36 < cmj> have you even used it?
02:36 < cmj> what is your basis for comparison?
02:36 < Mion> matsaman: also the pulse devs have exposed and fixed a hell of a lot of bugs in alsa
02:36 < nekoseam> cmj: who are you speaking to
02:36 < matsaman> Mion: well I don't get glitches during playback or battery problems with alsa
02:36 < Mion> matsaman: so even if you don't use it, you have benefitted massively from it
02:36 < cmj> you, nekoseam
02:36 < matsaman> Mion: then I thank them for fixing the alsa I already use
02:36 < matsaman> that's fine with me
02:37 < cmj> the only one that is concerned with pulseaudio features
02:37 < nekoseam> uh
02:37 < matsaman> I think he was the rkhunter guy
02:37 < cmj> oh matsaman, my bad
02:37 < nekoseam> yeah
02:37 < cmj> fingers00
02:37  * matsaman shrugs
02:38 < cmj> it's not my concern. sorry, we can all take pride in what we find useful.
02:39 < nevodka> I was missing pulseaudio-zeroconf
02:39 < matsaman> cmj: what do you find useful about it?
02:39 < nevodka> ;D
02:39 < matsaman> of course you were, naturally he would make pulseaudio dep on his other abominations =P
02:39 < cmj> to have the ability to manage every single sink individually
02:39 < cmj> something alsa can't do on its own
02:40 < Mion> matsaman: actually zeroconf is an apple invention
02:40 < Mion> or rather, the protocol
02:40 < lnnb> sounds like a design defect that should be corrected instead of hacked around
02:40 < cmj> so they are two different breeds in that respect. alsa controls bare minimum
02:41 < Mion> dmix is also really fragile
02:41 < matsaman> people concerned with who invented what are a fun lot
02:41 < jnt> I don't like pulseaudio, but I will use it, until something better comes around.
02:41 < matsaman> and pretty good at being wrong =P
02:41 < matsaman> jnt: better at doing what?
02:41 < lnnb> i'll just adjust volume in application, thanks
02:41 < matsaman> cmj: what do you actually use that for, though
02:41 < Mion> matsaman: " naturally he would make pulseaudio dep on his other abominations"
02:41 < cmj> i have bluetooth speakers, hdmi audio, etc
02:42 < Mion> matsaman: so you are saying you are pretty good at being wrong? :p
02:42 < matsaman> cmj: so you have multiple end users on a system simultaneously
02:42 < cmj> all can be controlled via pulseaudio individually
02:42 < cmj> you can't do that with alsa alone, if i'm not mistaken
02:42 < matsaman> Mion: why is it that people who pointlessly quote other people are so bad at reading
02:42 < cmj> no i have multipled audio sinks/devices, matsaman
02:43 < matsaman> cmj: maybe, but are you saying you're using your bluetooth speakers and hdmi output simultaneously?
02:43 < jnt> at doing per application volume control. I like having one global way to adjust volume, especially when using the web, there are some websites that play sound and don't have a volume slider.
02:43 < matsaman> or just that you want the audio levels saved
02:43 < cmj> alsamixer just is a master control. pulse manages many sinks
02:44 < cmj> i can choose not to send to hdmi but rather bluetooth for example
02:44 < cmj> (better speakers)
02:44 < cmj> it's full control
02:44 < matsaman> you can do that with alsa alone
02:44 < cmj> am i wrong?
02:44 < cmj> i can be
02:44 < matsaman> it's also possible the pulseaudio utils make that simpler
02:45 < cmj> i never seen this amount of control with just alsa
02:45 < Mion> alsa with multiple sources and sinks at the same time is basically impossible
02:45 < lnnb> yeah but it's probably impossibly complex to set up
02:45 < matsaman> but yeah you're technically wrong
02:45 < Mion> unless you are really lucky with what hardware you have
02:45 < cmj> well i digress. i hated the pulseaudio influx at first, but liked to be able to control all the sinks
02:46  * noodlepie uses MIDI a lot
02:46 < cmj> if i fire up alsamixer i get standard controls, pulsemixer (-l) gives me more control
02:46 < matsaman> noodlepie: heh
02:47 < Mion> even more fun if sources/sinks with different bitrates are involved
02:47 < Mion> bitrate/sample rate
02:47 < cmj> yeah i'm yet to be convinced it was the same with just alsa
02:47 < cmj> shrug
02:47 < matsaman> you could make a TUI frontend for ALSA alone that does what you want I think
02:48 < cmj> i'm all, ahem, ears though… matsaman
02:49 < Mion> would probably go insane from trying to use the alsa api first :p
02:49 < Mibix> my god im getting so pissed off at ubuntu
02:49 < Mibix> wish i could just login as root
02:49 < matsaman> oh I've no interest in it myself; there's a small chance I could crap out some sh for you without a TUI frontend
02:49 < Dan39> why cant you?
02:49 < cmj> only thing i dislike about pulse is it seems not hotplug worthy for my devices. mpd for example needs me to HUP pulseaudio to find it
02:49 < matsaman> because he doesn't realize sudo is root
02:49 < noodlepie> MIDI over USB uses the "Muso" SP/DIF interface protocol from TOSLINK optical fiber connections standard, to send samples to and from my keyboard for its DSPs to work the wonderful magic they perform.
02:50 < Mibix> sudo wont open any apps
02:50 < cmj> heh midi
02:50 < matsaman> cmj: that is likely more due to how your mpd was built/configured
02:50 < noodlepie> MIDI files sound great sent to it as musical note streams
02:50 < Dan39> Mibix: gui apps as root? what are you trying to do?
02:50 < matsaman> lot of distros assume pulseaudio at this point
02:50 < cmj> my 1994 piano uses midi
02:50 < Mibix> trying to open gedit as root
02:50 < Dan39> Mibix: probably using wayland which doesnt let you
02:50 < matsaman> my 2018 piano uses springs
02:50 < matsaman> Mibix: you'd want gksudo or whatever is contemporary then
02:50 < noodlepie> I can record the score of the notes I play realtime, and then playback and capture some more layers which its playing my first along with me
02:50 < matsaman> Mibix: it'll work from a terminal, too, though
02:50 < Dan39> contemporary bro
02:50 < triceratux> Mibix: sudo -i
02:51 < cmj> mpd uses sinks, you select the input sink and if it's off by a number it doesn't show up. i thin i fixed that by enabling all (yesterday)
02:51 < Mibix> when i do gksudo gedit a prompt comes up for my admin password
02:51 < Mibix> cant click anywhere in it to put it in
02:51 < matsaman> think mpd predates pulseaudio, let me check
02:51 < cmj> ncmpcpp is great by the way
02:51 < Mibix> just types the password in the terminal and doesnt work
02:52 < cmj> matsaman: yes of course
02:52 < cmj> you can use icecast, etc
02:52 < cmj> it's probably 15 years old?
02:52 < matsaman> yeah it barely preceded it, but yup
02:52 < matsaman> and doesn't require pulseaudio
02:52 < Mibix> why cant i just log in to the gui as root and it stop bitching all the damn time
02:52 < cmj> no you can choose many outputs
02:52 < matsaman> probably your distro has just embraced pulseaudio (which is whatever it is) and so it's setup to use it
02:53 < jnt> cmj: I like ncmpcpp, but I hate its name, I always need to think 15 seconds on how to spell it when I want to start it.
02:53 < cmj> http, icecast, etc
02:53 < matsaman> Mibix: because Ubuntu is silly
02:53 < matsaman> Mibix: but you can, anyway
02:53 < matsaman> Mibix: it's not really worth doing just to run gedit as root, though
02:53 < matsaman> Mibix: the simplest way is to open a terminal, su to root, and then run gedit
02:53 < slackin> sudo gedit
02:53 < jnt> and how do you even pronounce ncmpcpp
02:53 < cmj> jnt: yeah i have a hard time remembering it's name. i just have gnu screen autostart it
02:53 < matsaman> jnt: well it has 'cpp' in its name, so "dumb" =P
02:53 < cmj> hey
02:54 < Bashing-om> Mibix: Lately hksudo is no longer . In latestest debian try as ' gedit admin:///your-file ' .
02:54 < sauvin> nht: "enne cee emme pee cee peepee".
02:54 < Mibix> mibix@mibix-VirtualBox:~$ sudo gedit
02:54 < Mibix> No protocol specified
02:54 < Mibix> Unable to init server: Could not connect: Connection refused
02:54 < Mibix> (gedit:2155): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: :0
02:54 < Bashing-om> gksudo*
02:54 < lupine> admin:// ? seriously?
02:54 < matsaman> yeah they keep changing what they think the best way to call sudo for GUIs is, it's not worth keeping track of
02:54 < matsaman> running from a terminal as root should always work
02:54 < Mibix> gksudo doesnt work, it commands up with a password prompt and wont let me type anything in the keyboard focus is on the terminal still
02:54 < nekoseam> I asked this awhile ago but with little response. Would anybody be interested in a fork of openbox with XML removed?
02:55 < Mibix> commands up = comes up
02:55 < matsaman> nekoseam: that probably depends
02:55 < lupine> nekoseam: what would the xml be replaced wiht?
02:55 < nekoseam> Probably Lua or C
02:55 < matsaman> nekoseam: do any of blackbox and fluxbox, et al. have it removed?
02:55 < lupine> definitely not
02:56 < matsaman> there are some window managers that use lua pretty heavily already
02:56 < nekoseam> matsaman: Fluxbox does
02:56 < matsaman> nekoseam: then why would you need another fork on top of fluxbox?
02:56 < nekoseam> But it tries to be something a bit different
02:56 < matsaman> ah
02:56 < matsaman> probably some people would be interested in it, sure
02:56 < nekoseam> It comes with its own toolbar/panel
02:56 < matsaman> if you like openbox but (quite sanely) hate xml, there you go
02:56 < matsaman> that'd be a pretty simple fork, I'd say, too
02:56 < matsaman> so little expense
02:56 < jnt> didn't lua start arrays at 1 or something like that?
02:57 < nekoseam> maybe I could convince the lead dev to switch it from XML but he considers Openbox a finished product
02:57 < nekoseam> "bug free"
02:57 < nekoseam> I can't deny that. Never have had the tiniest issue with it
02:57 < nekoseam> asside from, well, XML
02:58 < cmj> jnt: hsetroot -fill sea.png -tint \#cccccc
02:58 < cmj> oops
02:58 < cmj> rather https://i.imgur.com/fG5DDBB.png
02:58 < Mibix> so basically i cant open any gui apps as su
02:59 < cmj> don't need to
02:59 < Mibix> its a lot quicker
03:01 < cmj> if you need to for whatever reason, try xhost +
03:02 < Mibix> xhost +?
03:03 < cmj> root can usually fire up anything so maybe that won't help. maybe prepend with DISPLAY=:0
03:04 < cmj> but yeah try that command first
03:04 < triceratux> xhost si:localuser:root or something
03:04 < Mibix> i keep getting:
03:04 < Mibix> No protocol specified
03:04 < Mibix> Unable to init server: Could not connect: Connection refused
03:04 < Mibix> (gedit:2155): Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display: :0
03:04 < cmj> xhost +
03:04 < Mion> don't do this
03:04 < cmj> ↑
03:04 < Mibix> when i do sudo gedit
03:04 < Mion> EDITOR=gedit sudoedit thefile
03:04 < Mion> problem solved, next!
03:05 < cmj> don't use root to open x11 apps. sudo or get yourself in the group allowed for access
03:06 < Mion> sudo gets you root
03:06 < Mion> sudoedit however will use a tempfile so that the editor is run as your normal user
03:07 < cmj> well right. don't sudo su and start firefox
03:08 < cmj> those access controls from xhost are preventing this from happening
03:08 < luxio> does this indicate a failing hard drive https://i.imgur.com/VoGigRw.png
03:11 < sauvin> luxio, *maybe*. Could also just be bad cable or a bad interface card.
03:12 < Mion> smart it as a start
03:12 < ayecee> verb all the things
03:12 < Mibix> i swear i just sudo gedit in another version of ubuntu and it opened right up
03:13 < Mibix> could really do any app like that
03:13 < Mion> there is no reason to use sudo gedit instead of sudoedit
03:13 < luxio> Mion: http://termbin.com/wivo
03:14 < Mibix> what if i want to just write a new file and save it somewhere i cant access without su?
03:14 < Mion> raw error rate and load cycles are quite high
03:14 < Mion> Mibix: sudoedit
03:17 < Mibix> editing files in a writable directory is not permitted
03:17 < Mion> ?
03:18 < Mion> so you have access
03:18 < Mibix> where its saved now
03:18 < Mibix> want to open it and save it a bunch of other places
03:18 < Mion> so you don't need sudo to begin with
03:18 < Mibix> dont want to type a bunch of crap in a terminal to do it
03:19 < Mion> and you keep changing your requirements
03:19 < ayecee> as is tradition :P
03:19 < Mibix> my only requirement is for sudo gedit to work
03:20 < aclaivi> You're asking for too much
03:20 < Mibix> lol
03:20 < Mion> luxio: I wouldn't trust that disk anymore, but do test on a different cable/controller
03:20 < luxio> it's a laptop
03:20 < luxio> i can't replace it
03:20 < luxio> (the cable)
03:20 < Mion> Mibix: it works if you do it correctly, for some defenition of works
03:21 < Mion> you can test in another machine or with a usb->sata adapter
03:21 < Mion> and/or
03:21 < Mion> you should keep one in your toolbox anyway, they are really useful to have
03:21 < triceratux> Mibix: i can say sudo <gui-gtk-editor> & it works. systems which behave like yours have x11 misconfigured
03:22 < Mibix> i think that is the problem
03:22 < Mibix> i dont know how to fix it :(
03:22 < Mibix> i swear i was just doing this on another VM earlier
03:22 < Mibix> worked fine
03:22 < Mion> just set DISPLAY correctly etc
03:22 < Dan39> its bullshit imo, should be able to sudo gedit.... not all this workaround nonsense. but it's the future :P
03:23 < Mion> Dan39: yea, who cares about security and how things actually works
03:23 < Dan39> i know :|
03:23 < Mion> would be much saner if gedit would use polkit to get permission to write
03:23 < Mion> instead of running the gui code as root
03:24 < Dan39> yea yea, security. probably for the best.
03:24 < Dan39> cant argue there
03:24 < Mibix> who needs security :p
03:25 < cmj> nobody these days
03:25 < aclaivi> Agreed, anyone want to compare passwords?
03:25 < Mion> who cares if a different user can access your X session, it is not like they could keylog everything and screencapture you sexting your aunt :p
03:25 < cmj> ******
03:25 < aclaivi> Looks like you fell for my master ruse. You're done kiddo.
03:26 < cmj> you used to be able to connect to port 6001 on open x servers
03:26 < RustyJ> thats gross.... it was my aunts phone... but my cousin was using it
03:26 < cmj> (iirc)
03:26 < saderror256> hi all. i want to position polybar across the middle of my screen, any way to do that?
03:26 < sauvin> Yea, here's my password: *****************
03:27 < cmj> back when workstations were a thing
03:27 < cmj> sauvin: all i see is hunter2
03:27 < ayecee> it's an old meme, sir, but it checks out
03:27 < cmj> my bad
03:28 < ayecee> :)
03:38 < Mibix> omg i fixed it
03:38 < Mibix> xhost si:localuser:root
03:39 < matsaman> nice
03:39 < Mibix> it was that wayland garbage
03:39 < matsaman> & wrong =P
03:39 < matsaman> xhost is probably more of an X thing, and I doubt you're using wayland without having chose to do so, but whatever
03:50 < aclaivi> For whatever reason weechat doesnt seem to like me copy pasting from keepassxc
03:50 < nekoseam> I tried using weechat but I'm too familiar with irssi
03:50 < Umeaboy> Hi!
03:50 < nekoseam> hewwo uwu
03:50 < aclaivi> Tbh I've only just started getting into IRC recently, so I didn't have a preference
03:50 < luxio> OwO
03:50 < Umeaboy> If I create the sudoers group manually and add myself into that would I have to restart X to make sudo commands work in the future?
03:50 < nekoseam> UwU;
03:51 < nekoseam> Umeaboy: I believe it happens instantly
03:51 < nekoseam> So no
03:51 < matsaman> weechat keeps adding things, so the whole omfg-it's-smallah argument isn't really compelling
03:51 < Umeaboy> Because I can't successfully execute sfossdk mentioned here: https://sailfishos.org/wiki/Platform_SDK_Installation
03:51 < matsaman> Umeaboy: no, but you might have to relogin to appear as part of a group
03:51 < Umeaboy> Everything else works until then.
03:51 < Sitri> aclaivi: It's likely the terminal, X has multiple copy/paste buffers
03:52 < Sitri> GUI applications favor one, terminals tend to favor another
03:52 < Umeaboy> OK.
03:52 < matsaman> you can su - yoursameuser, groups, but exiting & logging in again is in a way simpler, yeah
03:52 < matsaman> aclaivi: Sitri: autocutsel?
03:52 < Umeaboy> Trying that then.
03:53 < aclaivi> Using middle mouse button to paste works in any other terminal I open
03:53 < aclaivi> Odd
03:53 < nekoseam> I'm not entirely sure but I believe Xfce's power management program just automatically fixed a problem with the percentage being stuck at 97%
03:53 < nekoseam> I would say Xfce was amazing but if I thought so I'd be using it
03:53 < matsaman> nekoseam: as compared to what?
03:53 < matsaman> Xfce is pretty amazing
03:53 < nekoseam> matsaman: Pretty much anything else
03:53 < matsaman> it's very ordinary, but amazing in how it never betrays its users
03:53 < matsaman> it doesn't ever rewrite everything from scratch and force new strangeness
03:54 < matsaman> you can make it look like KDE, like GNOME, like Windows, like whatever
03:54 < nekoseam> The only DE's I can stand are Xfce and LXDE
03:54 < matsaman> and it's strictly lighter than KDE & GNOME both
03:54 < nekoseam> LXQt looks extremely promising especially since it has a search function
03:54 < matsaman> it's nice that LXDE didn't even make their own window manager
03:54 < lupine> gnome3 is good
03:54 < matsaman> Qt is too commercial & C++ oriented for my tastes
03:55 < nekoseam> C++...ick
03:55 < matsaman> and while it isn't tied to KDE, KDE is its biggest example
03:55 < matsaman> and not my favie
03:56 < nekoseam> irssi ONLY supports 99 windows by default?
03:56 < nekoseam> disgusting!
03:57 < smallville7123> (◉-◉)
03:57 < smallville7123> Why do u have 99 windows open
03:57 < nekoseam> exit
03:57 < matsaman> doesn't it highlight new messages in non-focused channels by number?
03:57 < aclaivi> memes
03:57 < matsaman> should probably do that by name
03:57 < aclaivi> Well that pasted, but also sent :thinking:
03:58 < nekoseam> why have I never changed my default name
03:58 < nekoseam> I've had to manually change it this entire time ;-;
03:58 < matsaman> in irssi? It has kind of a tedious config, TBH
03:58 < matsaman> compared to nothing in particular, that is
03:59 < nekoseam> I found it relatively easy to read
03:59 < lupine> they get sad if you manually edit the config file
03:59 < lupine> bless 'em
04:00 < nekoseam> I've seen a person make it to where weechat automatically logs you in
04:00 < matsaman> heh
04:00 < matsaman> irssi can do that, too
04:00 < nekoseam> I didn't doubt that
04:00 < matsaman> it requires a good 10 minute commitment to figure out
04:01 < nekoseam> egh
04:01 < matsaman> which of course is a lot of time
04:01 < nekoseam> You'd have to put in your password in the config file
04:01 < aclaivi> Problem solved: Having mouse enabled in weechat breaks middle mouse click paste, unless you press shift
04:02 < matsaman> aclaivi: that's probably more your terminal client
04:02 < aclaivi> It's possible. Using URxvt
04:02 < matsaman> yeah it is, urxvt is very configurable
04:03 < nekoseam> Greed is an insanely addictve terminal game
04:03 < nekoseam> It's hard to describe it but easy to learn
04:04 < Styil> hmm, just wondering, does a block without segwit transactions require a witness merkle root in the coinbase?
04:04 < matsaman> heh
04:04 < Styil> oh whoops
04:04 < Styil> wrong channel
04:04 < aclaivi> I like to make up words too
04:04 < Styil> lol
04:05 < matsaman> nekoseam: oh wow, reminds me of caverns of kroz/zzzt
04:06 < matsaman> zzt*
04:06 < nekoseam> Linux has no games, pffft
04:06 < nekoseam> https://i.imgur.com/6i8dL1P.png
04:06 < matsaman> it has tons of games, what it doesn't have a lot of are games that have paid advertising
04:06 < nekoseam> It was a joke
04:07 < matsaman> but then it doesn't really need'm 'cause it has package management
04:07 < nekoseam> whoa
04:08 < nekoseam> anybody else gettin a mountain of spam?
04:08 < matsaman> probably a netsplit
04:10 < nekoseam> well Xfce's power management program stopped it at 99%
04:10 < nekoseam> An upgrade over 97 I guess
04:10 < nekoseam> This battery's getting old
04:11 < matsaman> well, battery technology isn't advanced, not the way we'd want it to be
04:12 < nekoseam> speaking of that...hardinfo fails to display any information about my SSD
04:13 < sauvin> nekoseam, what kind of spam?
04:13 < nekoseam> sauvin: Users joining, exiting, ect.
04:13 < nekoseam> I've gotten it before
04:13 < sauvin> Nearly 2200 people in this channel. Lots of traffic, and netsplits ain't helping.
04:14 < Mibix> omg this wayland trash is causing so many problems lol
04:14 < Mibix> think it might be easier to just go back to 16.04 ubuntu
04:14 < nekoseam> Wayland is probably not to blame
04:15 < nekoseam> Wayland itself is rather stable, programs need to support IT better
04:15 < Mibix> cant even gksudo with it
04:15 < triceratux> Mibix: 18.04 isnt wayland by default. only 17.10 was iirc
04:15 < Mibix> ya im on 17.10
04:15 < nekoseam> openSUSE 15.0 and Fedora 26(?)+ are the only major distros that use wayland by default
04:15 < nekoseam> as for as i know
04:16 < nekoseam> far*
04:16 < triceratux> they sidelined that wayland stuff for 18.04 itz true ;)
04:16 < Mibix> ya im not sure i want to use 18.04 yet
04:16 < triceratux> thats true its still a bit early
04:16 < nekoseam> Why?
04:16 < sauvin> I'm poking at it on occasion in a VM, but not sure I want to make the jump.
04:17 < nekoseam> VM isn't very accurate. You'll encounter tons more bugs there than when actually installed
04:18 < sauvin> I've encountered none, but not all that pleased with it overall, truthfully.
04:18 < epicmetal> Mibix: you can just use X11, no need to downgrade distros
04:19 < Mibix> what?
04:19 < Mibix> how do i do that
04:19 < epicmetal> Mibix: Wayland... it's easier to switch to X11
04:19 < matsaman> by not using wayland
04:19 < nekoseam> poor wayland
04:19 < epicmetal> Mibix: there may be a session option when logging on at your display manager
04:19 < matsaman> when wayland is ready for prime time, distros will start to deprecate their X builds
04:19 < nekoseam> and poor xorg
04:19 < nekoseam> poor every display manager
04:19 < epicmetal> Mibix: otherwise there's a config file setting usually
04:19 < matsaman> ?
04:20 < Mibix> ooo i think you are right epicmetal
04:20 < nekoseam> Apparently someone has ported all of Openbox to pure C
04:21 < nekoseam> And is compatible with Wayland
04:21 < nekoseam> https://github.com/wizbright/waybox
04:21 < matsaman> waybox, heh
04:22 < matsaman> and what'll they have to do when wayland is replaced
04:24 < slackin> anyone know of a way to play videos from desktop/laptop to chromecast?
04:24 < Mibix> hmmm im still getting the error maybe its not the wayland :p
04:24 < nekoseam> what error
04:27 < nekoseam> Geanie uses XML too?
04:27 < nekoseam> What is this world
04:32 < Mibix> nekoseam (system-config-samba:1711): IBUS-WARNING **: The owner of home/mibix/.config/ibus/bus is not root!
04:32 < Mibix> i cant seem to get that to open any way i try heh
04:32 < nekoseam> Oh god I thought irssi gave me that warning
04:33 < nekoseam> lol
04:33 < Mibix> lol
04:36 < Mibix> https://www.hastebin.com/opohonahey.rb
04:51 < dviola> wow
04:51 < dviola> lol
05:09 < nekoseam> test :D
05:10 < aclaivi> t e s t
05:10 < sauvin> Probierung eins zwei drei OW
05:14 < [R]> sauvin: ENGLISH... do you speak it!?
05:14 < swift110> sup folks
05:14 < ayecee> don't mind if i do
05:14 < sauvin> [R]: you're one to talk!
05:15 < aclaivi> swift110: hello
05:17 < jim> doo joo speek da languish dats com outta joo mouth?
05:17 < swift110> how are you acetakwas
05:17 < swift110> sup ayecee
05:18 < swift110> I am checking out Manjaro Cinnamon today and I really like it
05:18 < jim> what were you running before?
05:19 < kangyu> manjaro i3
05:20 < jim> oh ok, so you're switching front ends
05:20 < kurahaupo_> [R]: testing one two three oh!
05:22 < swift110> jim I run several distros as I have multiple lapops
05:24 < swift110> But Solus and Ubuntu mate are on my t420,  Linux Mint Mate and likely Manjaro Cinnamon on one of my x201's the other is undecided as of yet.
05:25 < swift110> Kangyu I have Manjaro i3 on my Sony Vaio but not sure if I will keep it for much longer, I am undecided as to what I will put on my x60 or fujitsu lifebook4215
05:26 < aclaivi> Many laptops indeed
05:32 < warsoul> whats the best linux?
05:32 < aclaivi> The one that suits your needs
05:33 < ayecee> the one that suits my needs
05:33 < warsoul> whats the more stable?
05:33 < ayecee> the question is not meaningful
05:33 < warsoul> ayecee what you use?
05:33 < ayecee> mostly ubuntu
05:34 < warsoul> what happen with redhat?
05:34 < ayecee> it still exists
05:35 < warsoul> it is still one of the best?
05:35 < nekoseam> Does leafpad have syntax highlighting?
05:35 < Sitri> warsoul: why are you asking?
05:35 < ayecee> it is still commonly used, though mostly in commercial settings
05:35 < cmj> payed support
05:36 < warsoul> Sitri because has been long time dont use linux
05:36 < cmj> though i'm payed support too
05:36 < warsoul> and just wanted to know the more stable version
05:36 < kangyu> swift110:just like arch
05:37 < ayecee> warsoul: the ones that typical users use would be ubuntu, fedora, mint, or arch.
05:37 < ayecee> with some suse and debian in there for fun.
05:37 < warsoul> debian is still good?
05:38 < ayecee> yes
05:38 < warsoul> i think the last one that i used was debian
05:38 < Sitri> warsoul: That didn't answer the question.  The question of "what is best X" is pointless, as the answers are 100% subjective.
05:38 < nekoseam> warsoul: extremely
05:38 < matsaman> Sitri: nonsense
05:38 < nekoseam> I have complaints about glibc, systemd, apt, apt-get, .deb packaging and just about everything
05:38 < nekoseam> I still come back to it though
05:38 < ayecee> Sitri: it's easier if you don't process it literally.
05:38 < matsaman> as well you should
05:38 < nekoseam> :)
05:39 < [R]> nekoseam: well everyone uses glibc... so...
05:40 < ayecee> except those who don't
05:40 < rcf> [R]: doesn't alpine default to musl?
05:40 < [R]> any sane dist meant for actual use...
05:40 < ayecee> oh snap
05:40 < [R]> is taht beter?
05:40 < [R]> not toy garbage
05:40 < ayecee> not better, but more concise
05:41 < ayecee> maybe precise
05:41 < nekoseam> [R]: I know
05:41 < [R]> "It also implements most of the widely used non-standard Linux, BSD, and glibc functions."
05:41 < [R]> keyword being "most"
05:42 < Dreaman> uha
05:44 < rcf> There was also eglibc for a while, but that doesn't really count.
05:44 < [R]> well that was a fork
05:44 < [R]> so it was still glibc
05:45 < nekoseam> fluttershy is in a league of her own
05:45 < nekoseam> crap wrong place
05:46 < nekoseam> regarding my question earlier, it turns out leafpad doesn't have syntax highlighting
05:46 < [R]> darn
05:48 < nekoseam> This is sad. Geany, a full IDE, has less dependencies and is smaller than Gedit
05:49 < [R]> you don't say!
05:49 < nekoseam> I know it's not surprising anymore
05:50 < nekoseam> but that's what saddens me the most
05:50 < sauvin> Geany is what I use when I need to do stuff. Don't remember why, but I like it better than the kate I used to use.
05:58 < HappyHobo> Howdy
05:59 < eblu> hey! i'm trying to think of how to word this question without sounding like i'm not supposed to be here. give me a second
06:00 < ayecee> what a preamble
06:01 < eblu> so, i've been distro hopping nonstop and i just want to settle down somewhere. the problem is mostly the desktop environment i'm using
06:01 < Hunterkll> SuSE!
06:01 < [R]> eblu: well you dont have to change dists to do taht
06:01 < eblu> yeah i'm aware
06:01 < blocky> have you tried going CLI only?
06:01 < Hunterkll> heh
06:01 < Hunterkll> just install every DE offered by the distro
06:01 < Hunterkll> and use KDM / GDM to select what you feel like for that day
06:02 < [R]> sometimes you feel like a gnome... sometimes you don't
06:02 < blocky> zsh master race checking in
06:02 < Hunterkll> or XDM if you're feeling fancy and scripty and wanna work some TCL
06:02  * Hunterkll runs XDM and has a whole slew of fancy customizations
06:02 < iodev> blocky: don't remind me
06:02 < Hunterkll> sh mater race checking in, hasn't changed in 32475035972 years, is good
06:02 < blocky> vim/zsh/i3wm linux elitist starter kit
06:02 < iodev> I tried to get arch to boot faster than my windows, it does not!
06:03 < blocky> iodev: blasphemy, get out
06:03 < eblu> anyway so i haven't really found one that works yet. i use GNOME, i like how it feels but it's a bloated monster and keeps removing features. KDE, love the customization but just doesn't sit right with qt and all. xfce is hard to really crack into
06:03 < Hunterkll> blocky, vim is for newbies. real men use traditional vi
06:03 < iodev> blocky: sorry, SSD
06:03 < Hunterkll> iodev, not surprising, honestly
06:03 < blocky> Hunterkll: yes, because backspace is overrated lol
06:03 < [R]> eblu: you should probably just give up
06:03 < Hunterkll> blocky, honestly i never use backspace in vim >_>
06:03 < Hunterkll> i'm so used to older unixes
06:03 < iodev> Hunterkll: so windows boots in less than 5 seconds, I wanted arch to load in 2 phemtoseconds :D
06:03 < agent_white> blocky: I need to add zsh to be complete then. :P
06:03 < [R]> Hunterkll: unices
06:03 < blocky> Hunterkll: i mean in insert mode you can't backspace
06:03 < iodev> maybe it was because I used dm-crypt
06:03 < iodev> who knows
06:04 < Hunterkll> blocky, i'm aware
06:04 < nekoseam> I just use bash
06:04  * nekoseam shrugs
06:04 < Hunterkll> my first contact with vi was on solaris ... 8?
06:04 < Hunterkll> or was it HP-UX?
06:04 < blocky> the main draw of zsh is the history completion imho
06:04 < Hunterkll> i forget
06:04 < iodev> nekoseam: me too, on my Xubuntu desktop I use xfce4-terminal and bash
06:04 < blocky> i just installed freebsd this week actually, first time really trying out unix
06:04 < iodev> blocky: back when I had HDD, then I had arch and it was faster :-)
06:05 < blocky> eblu: tried a tiling wm yet?
06:05 < iodev> blocky: I have used i3wm :-)
06:05 < Hunterkll> >freebsd
06:05 < Hunterkll> >calls it unix
06:05 < Hunterkll> :P
06:05 < eblu> so i've just been wondering what DE would be right for me since there isn't an easy and fast way to compare them without installing all of them, filling up my linux partition, nuking my current kubuntu install, and wondering why i even tried
06:05 < blocky> it will load in less than 2 phlegmtoseconds
06:05 < iodev> don't think of me as a windows noob, for I am not
06:05  * aclaivi uses i3wm with everything default floating
06:05 < Hunterkll> blocky, you do know AT&T had a bit of a lawsuit about BSD's unix code usage, riiiight? ;)
06:05 < aclaivi> ho ho h o
06:05 < [R]> eblu: how do you epect us to know what you will like
06:05 < agent_white> eblu: We can't tell you what to like, just like I can't tell you what food to enjoy. You have to try it and see for yourself.
06:06 < [R]> eblu: especially considering you seem to hate everytihng mainstream everyone sane uses
06:06 < blocky> haha Hunterkll
06:06 < iodev> aclaivi: what's the point of that?
06:06 < eblu> blocky: last time i tried i never wanted to see a cfg file ever again
06:06 < Hunterkll> blocky, honestly, OS X is more UNIX than BSD is at this point
06:06 < iodev> I only had floating on android emulator, because it would not tile :D
06:06 < Hunterkll> OS X is even POSIX and SUSv3 certified >_<
06:06 < eblu> i guess i'll just keep looking then, haha
06:06 < Hunterkll> alongside solaris, HP-UX, AIX, etc
06:06 < blocky> Hunterkll: it's blasphemous to admit around here but i really like os x
06:06 < eblu> sorry for bugging you for something that's obvious
06:06 < nekoseam> Hmm...medit seems very promising
06:06 < aclaivi> iodev: I got used to the keybindings and couldn't be bothered migrating configs to another wm
06:06 < nekoseam> Very lightweight
06:06 < Hunterkll> blocky, i mean, apple is the largest commercial unix workstation vendor left, and yea, i've got some NeXT systems here myself :)
06:06 < blocky> eblu: you don't have to nuke anything to try a bunch of desktops
06:07 < Hunterkll> though i'm using a sun IPX as a foot rest right now
06:07 < iodev> aclaivi: yeah, keybindings those are cool, were you using i3lock?
06:07 < blocky> i would like to try next one day just for historical reasons
06:07 < iodev> had you i3status configured?
06:07 < Hunterkll> blocky, get out your credit card... ;)
06:07 < blocky> haha
06:07 < Hunterkll> I need to get another cube case again to put all my parts into
06:07 < Hunterkll> ripped out the DARPA stuff and sold the rest
06:08 < Hunterkll> yea, I had a NeXT cube that when i reset the root password and logged in, was loaded with scientific and eidtiong software (mathematica 1 ! photoshop 1 ! etc) and complained it couldn't mount /DARPA
06:08 < Hunterkll> i was like
06:08 < Hunterkll> *shut down. image drive*
06:08 < eblu> blocky, i tried installing kde next to GNOME on ubuntu once and it completely replaced my GNOME session with itself
06:08 < blocky> eblu: that doesn't sound correct lol
06:08 < aclaivi> iodev: Yeah i3lock is in there. Realistically I wouldn't have an issue moving if it wasnt for the fact I change between floating and tiling all the time
06:08 < Hunterkll> eblu, there A.) should be a selector at the login screen to chose and B.) ubuntu does some really. really. really dumb stuff
06:08 < iodev> synergy is the best program ever :-)
06:08 < Hunterkll> blocky, it's ubuntu, i could believe it
06:09 < aclaivi> iodev: Though the only reason I'm set to floating at the moment is due to i3-gaps being very buggy with tiling and title bars
06:09 < Hunterkll> I have code that runs on Solaris, Gentoo, RHEL, SLES, Debian, Slackware, AIX, z/OS with specific extensions, yet BREAKS ON UBUNTU because they're a bunch of blockheads
06:09 < agent_white> Once you go tiling you never go back. Everything in it's own place, nice and neat.
06:09 < blocky> Hunterkll: now im curious what would have happened if you successfully mounted /DARPA
06:09 < iodev> aclaivi: I never had i3-gaps
06:09 < Hunterkll> blocky, i'd probably be on darpa's internal network at a research lab sometime from 1989 to 1994 ?
06:10 < iodev> I had DWM from suckless, on gentoo, I also tried awesome WM and Window-maker
06:10 < blocky> /dev/timemachine: permission denied
06:10 < aclaivi> I've been considering dwm for a little while now
06:10 < nekoseam> I once tried to make a suckless rice
06:10 < eblu> i'd move upstream to debian honestly but there were a few packages that were only in ubuntu repos and i couldn't for the life of me figure out how to pull them down and install them correctly
06:10 < aclaivi> nekoseam: how did that go for you
06:10 < nekoseam> Installed OpenBSD, dwm, terminal programs like mutt and ranger....
06:10 < Hunterkll> blocky, i sold one of my NeXT systems to a guy at a hamfest who basically gave me his credit card before i even quoted a price for it
06:10 < nekoseam> Just wasn't for me
06:10 < Hunterkll> lol
06:11 < Hunterkll> charged him $1000 for the machine... 25mhz 68040 with 8MB ram and 100MB hard drive
06:11 < Hunterkll> it's hostname? flubber.umd.edu
06:11 < aclaivi> I didn't give MUTT enough of a go tbh
06:11 < Hunterkll> it was his CS department server when he was in college
06:11 < Hunterkll> :D
06:11 < aclaivi> But I very musch like using ranger
06:11 < nekoseam> It was pretty easy but I always go back to debian
06:11 < eblu> they have a tutorial for PPAs but not for packages actually in their repos
06:11 < blocky> lol
06:11 < Hunterkll> they ripped out all the GUI stuff except the logon screen/display server (DisplayPostscript, not X) to make room on that 100MB drive
06:11 < Hunterkll> loll
06:11 < blocky> i've never made PPAs work on debian
06:11 < Hunterkll> ubuntu is @#)%*@#%)
06:12 < Hunterkll> SuSE in 2001 was easier to install, maintain, and use than ubuntu is today. that's sad
06:12 < [R]> Hunterkll: thats doubtful
06:12 < Hunterkll> Nah, I still have that copy of SuSE 6.1
06:12 < Hunterkll> 11 year old me was able to - unassisted - set up a dualboot with my existing windows install
06:13 < [R]> i did th eesame thig back in the day
06:13 < iodev> just enabled MAC-filter even if I'm the only one who knows the password
06:13 < Hunterkll> the install of SuSE really hasn't changed much at all, nor has YaST2
06:13 < [R]> things now are so much easier
06:13 < Hunterkll> not really, SuSE's installer hasn't changed much at all
06:13 < Hunterkll> just did an install a few months ago for troubleshooting a system with a bunk CPU
06:13 < [R]> so you've got crap hardware
06:13 < [R]> and its ubuntu's fault?
06:13 < Hunterkll> .... no?
06:14 < Hunterkll> [R], I was saying that as a frame of reference when I make the statement that SuSE's isntaller hasn't changed much
06:14 < Hunterkll> the experience this year was almost identical to the one in 2001 down to the fact that i could have used the 2001 manuals for it
06:14 < nekoseam> I highly recommend you guys try out the Parole media player. It's really, really good
06:15 < Hunterkll> [R], i never said anything about ubuntu and that system with the faulty CPU. I installed SUSE (ubuntu has never touched that system) to ensure it wasn't a windows problem.
06:16 < Hunterkll> but yea, even compared to RHEL or other distros like Mint, SuSE has always had the easiest install experience from what i've seen other people deal with
06:16 < [R]> ubuntu has like 5 questions
06:16 < Hunterkll> damn you pc magazine for mentioning that linux thing and damn best buy for having a boxed copy in the store
06:16 < [R]> its not rocket science
06:17 < Hunterkll> 16.04 screwed up a dual boot system when I had to install it for working with a google toolstack
06:17 < Hunterkll> that was annoying
06:17  * sauvin remembers buying Red Hat in a box at CompUSA to put on his 64MB Asus Pentium
06:17 < Hunterkll> sauvin, we had real fun with SuSE - the first copy we bought, all 7 CDs were blank. pressed CDs that were a bad manufacturing run. but back then best buy had techs who were like 'oh lemme check that... yup nothin there. go grab another and we'll check it before you leave'
06:18 < sauvin> Yup, they were like that.
06:18 < Hunterkll> they weren't no compusa
06:18 < Hunterkll> but they were handy
06:18 < Hunterkll> somewhere i have a techtv hat signed by leo laporte :D
06:19 < [R]> leo laporte is such a hack
06:19 < Hunterkll> back in 2001-2002 he wasn't, call for help was a pretty good show
06:19 < sauvin> They weren't *really* competent, but when they told me they needed an engineer to diagnose a problem I told them about, and I told them I WAS an engineer, they said "oh." and did what I told them.
06:19 < [R]> lol
06:20 < Hunterkll> I haven't really kept up with him since TechTV got canned for G4
06:20 < Hunterkll> some of the calls they got were great though
06:20 < Hunterkll> reminds me of this old bash quote - <D1> on call for help, they ask this guy for the type of modem he has, so he tries to be a bigshot and says, "YEAH, I HAVE AN INDUSTRY STANDARD ARCHITECHTURE MODEM, I THINK IT'S PCI."
06:21 < sauvin> I wonder how many coffee cup holders they had to replace.
06:21 < Hunterkll> sauvin, well, competent enough to identify faulty commercial CDs and know what a power supply is, and why the voltage selector switch is important on cheap ones. ;)
06:21 < sauvin> :D
06:22 < Hunterkll> oh, and swap hardware around unassisted
06:22 < Hunterkll> they had tier-1 techs!
06:22 < Hunterkll> now they have tier-0 techs and a depot that does work for them and a CD that connects them to a callcenter for people who are tier 0.5 techs to do the work
06:23 < Hunterkll> okay, that's just wrong. Kali Linux in the windows 10 app store.
06:23 < sauvin> Last time I went to Best Buy and tried to ask a question about Linux compatibility, they said "Um... what's linux?"
06:23 < sauvin> They'll never touch any of my machines again.
06:24 < aclaivi> If you're asking retail 'techs' about anything other than mainstream software you're going to have a bad time
06:24 < Hunterkll> hah
06:24 < sauvin> I didn't have a bad time. I had a GREAT time... somewhere ELSE.
06:24 < aclaivi> lol
06:24 < meingtsla> (As if you needed yet another reason)
06:25 < Hunterkll> aclaivi, my ISP is pretty good, they're a mid-sized (like 5 state footprint) cable company taht's not comcast or time warner or whatever, and tier-1 techs are actually damn helpful ..... I was running a Solaris based router at the time (IPX) and was doing diagnostics from it to the cable modem, and the guy asked me which version of windows I was using (solaris 9? :D)
06:25 < Hunterkll> I paused for a moment and he said
06:25 < Hunterkll> "Oh or linux or unix or OS X"
06:25 < Hunterkll> I read off the MAC address and he said "Oracle huh?" and i nearly cried :'(
06:25 < Hunterkll> our tier-1 is awsome for our ISP
06:26 < n-iCe> hi
06:26 < aclaivi> I was more referring to your standard in-store retail assistant
06:26 < aclaivi> I don't doubt there's actually people out there that have a wider breadth of understanding
06:27 < Hunterkll> aclaivi, well, try doing that with a comcast rep
06:33 < nekoseam> ristretto is the only image viewer other than xed that actually handles gifs larger than 6mb well in my experience
06:36 < matsaman> GIF larger than 6MB should probably do a slap-over-IP
06:51 < nekoseam> Which filesystem do you use?
06:51 < nekoseam> filesystem(s)
06:53 < Triffid_Hunter> btrfs
06:54 < [R]> i can't belive it's not butter, filesystem
06:55 < sauvin> Melts in your hand before you even get it out of the wrapper!
06:58 < supernov3h> Um so, I', trying to set open a socket with socket(2) with socket(AF_INET, SOCK_STREAM, 0) where 0 corresponds to ip, 6 would be tcp (I desire tcp) but this function never returns...
06:58 < supernov3h> is this unusual behaviour?
07:01 < [R]> i've never heard of socket blocking
07:01 < [R]> are you positive thats whats going on?
07:01 < supernov3h> no I just checked it and it sits on accept(3, <nothing more> and what made me think it was blocking was that printf doesn't output anything
07:02 < supernov3h> well it doesn't get to print, or perhaps some output buffer gets blocked or something, I dunno
07:02 < [R]> blocking on accept and blocking on socket are 2 totally differnet things...
07:05 < supernov3h> It's just odd to be because when I strace it I can see EADDRINUSE but when I write my code to see what value is returned from it, it doesn't return anything...
07:05 < Triffid_Hunter> supernov3h: from man 2 accept: If  no  pending  connections are present on the queue, and the socket is not marked as nonblocking, accept() blocks the caller until a connection is present.
07:06 < Triffid_Hunter> supernov3h: also, "The argument sockfd is a socket that has been created with socket(2), bound to a local address with bind(2), and is listening for connections after a listen(2)." - have you done all those things before calling accept?
07:07 < supernov3h> Triffid_Hunter: thx yea, but why does it block printf outputting anything? It seems there's no asynchronous buffer output
07:08 < Triffid_Hunter> supernov3h: printf has its own buffers, perhaps it hasn't decided to flush them before your thing blocks?
07:09 < Triffid_Hunter> supernov3h: if you want unbuffered output, use snprintf() and write()
07:10 < supernov3h> that's not the bufferig I'm talking about, I'm talking about the terminal that's connected
07:15 < Samian> sup mofos
07:15 < Samian> rich multi millionaire walkin through
07:15 < nevodka> nice mate
07:15 < Samian> lay down the red carpet for american royalty
07:16 < supernov3h> o.0
07:16 < supernov3h> being a millionaire is nothing in 2018, virtually everybody is...
07:21 < ShapeShifter499> supernov3h: I wish I was
07:21 < sauvin> I'm a multimillionaire if what's being counted is pennies.
07:21 < aclaivi> Any millionaires out there burdened by money feel free to handball me some
07:21 < ShapeShifter499> ditto
07:21 < [R]> i'm rich with love...
07:21  * [R] giggles
07:22 < sauvin> Very good, [R]. Go run your bedsheets through the washing machine now.
07:23 < ShapeShifter499> anyhoo
07:24 < Triffid_Hunter> go to nigeria and you can be a trillionaire :P
07:25 < ShapeShifter499> I'm getting this error on my Raspberry Pi running Linux.  It seems dm_crypt crashing, does any one have any ideas what I could do to fix this?    Is this a RAM issue?       the snip of log is here: https://gist.github.com/ShapeShifter499/2ef8e32b989e32bd337d326befe7a668
07:29 < ShapeShifter499> Does that error above mean I lost data?    I don't know if it occurred during a 'mv' operation but I did run one and it seems to have completed correctly but I haven't checked all of my data
07:36 < pankaj_> I just compiled the linux kernel but wifi interface is not working. When i type lsmod it givee only one listing about ×86_pkg_tmp_thermal
07:39 < Triffid_Hunter> pankaj_: did you enable support for your wifi hardware? do you have firmware for it available?
07:40 < Triffid_Hunter> ShapeShifter499: looks more like your lan driver is requesting a buffer but there's no free memory
07:41 < Triffid_Hunter> ShapeShifter499: look at lines 10-19 and 81-88
07:42 < ShapeShifter499> Triffid_Hunter: I'm more concerned this affected data since it mentioned "Workqueue: kcryptd kcryptd_crypt [dm_crypt]"    All of my USB drives are encrypted
07:44 < ShapeShifter499> Triffid_Hunter: shouldn't my system be swapping though?   'free -h' shows              https://gist.github.com/ShapeShifter499/504cddba831c3e5bfee4f971348c8c18       But swap use is zero
07:45 < [R]> pankaj_: well the answer now is the same as it was hours ago
07:45 < [R]> pankaj_: sounds like youo're missing a driver
07:45 < Mead> While installing a debian based distro (SteamOS) from a DVD I get a message to change the media to disc 1. Disc 1 is already in the optical drive, and the it keeps asking me to insert it.
07:45 < [R]> mead: sounds like a stupid installer
07:46 < Mead> It's the Debian installer
07:46 < [R]> mead: you shoud probably complain to whomever gave it to you
07:46 < [R]> mead: taht they did whho knows what to
07:46 < Triffid_Hunter> Mead: wow DVDs are still a thing? my last computer that had a disk drive was made in 2008.. Tried a usb stick instead?
07:48 < Mead> Triffid_Hunter:  yes, my motherboard does not support booting from a flash drive.
07:48 < Triffid_Hunter> Mead: wow, must be ancient
07:48 < [R]> yet you think its good enough to play games
07:48 < [R]> rofl
07:48 < pankaj_> Triffid_Hunter: I saw tutorial on youtube for arch linux and their he ran make menuconfig and just saves the .confog file and then exit from menu and then go on.
07:49 < Oddity> optical discs are the devil
07:49 < ShapeShifter499> Triffid_Hunter: what should I do now?
07:49 < Triffid_Hunter> pankaj_: that's nice, but there's a zillion options in the kernel and you need to set them to match your hardware and usage caes. perhaps he had his config pre-made already?
07:49 < pankaj_> [R]: So shall recompiling the kernel will be okay.
07:49 < [R]> pankaj_: what?
07:49 < Triffid_Hunter> ShapeShifter499: dunno, try another kernel version perhaps?
07:49 < Mead> I agree,  it's pretty old Phenom II x4 and a geforce gtx460, but it should play team fortress 2
07:50 < pankaj_> Triffid_Hunter: Okay. So automatically generating .comfig file do it ?
07:50 < [R]> mead: sounds like you should juse use a sane dist
07:50 < Triffid_Hunter> Mead: well that's newer than the athlon XP I built in 2005, which could boot from USB
07:50 < Triffid_Hunter> pankaj_: I don't know of a reliable way to automatically generate a config
07:51 < [R]> you kinda have to know what you are doing
07:51 < [R]> lol
07:51 < pankaj_> Triffid_Hunter: okay. I am tryong this way now as per documentation. Hope it works
07:51 < Mead> Triffid_Hunter:  I've tried
07:53 < rcf> Triffid_Hunter: you underestimate just how badly PC BIOS vendors can screw something up that should have been working fine a decade beforehand.
07:53 < Triffid_Hunter> rcf: ah yeah probably :/
07:54 < rcf> Or maybe years of horrible ACPI bugs followed by (just as things were getting kind of OK) years of even worse UEFI bugs have made me a bit too cynical.
07:54 < Mead> it's got an option in the bios for usb-hdd, but it doesn't recognize any of the flash drives I've tried to install from.
07:55 < rcf> Mead: in that case, yeah, they tried, but not hard enough.
07:56 < Mead> well either way,  any clue what is causing the installer to not find something and expect another disc during install?
07:58 < jim> what other oses boot from that machine?
07:59 < Mead> Previously it had windows 7 installed
07:59 < sauvin> A great many ACPI "bugs" aren't even that, really: they're omissions.
08:00 < [R]> mead: wahtever crap they did to it
08:00 < [R]> mead: sounds like you should just use a sane dist
08:00 < sauvin> Mead, I just walked back in. What are you trying to install?
08:00 < jim> Mead, is the windows boot firmware in the ESP?
08:01 < rcf> Mead: a bad disc is a real possibility. Modern drives can have atrocious burn quality.
08:02 < Mead> rcf: I was thinking that is a possibility, but wanted to ask here before I burned another coaster.
08:03 < jim> so the focus issue is again probably the frontmost to be dealt with
08:03 < jim> what are you burning?
08:04 < jim> yep, no focus
08:04 < jim> no response
08:04 < rcf> Mead: as someone who still uses optical media somewhat successfuly, go for slow speeds and try to verify the burn.
08:05 < Mead> sorry I was getting a link to the image I used, it can be found here http://repo.steampowered.com/download/
08:06 < jim> so you're installing a steam-produced dist to get steam games?
08:07 < Mead> that is the plan
08:07 < Styil> huh, someone who actually uses SteamOS
08:07 < jim> I run steam on debian, and I didn't need any cd blanks to get it
08:07 < Styil> imo I would just take a popular distro and just install steam on it
08:08 < Triffid_Hunter> Mead: steam should work fine on basically any distro you care to try.. works perfect on my gentoo and my gf's linux mint
08:08 < Mead> jim: I'd need to burn an image of whatever I wanted to install on this system due to lousy motherboard.
08:08 < jim> can't boot from usb?
08:10 < jim> and, debian netinstalls are hybrid images, which means they will boot either from cd blank or from usb media
08:10 < Mead> jim: No use flash drive booting, tried half a dozen thumb drives, scoured the bios, and even looked up the motherboard manual.  It simply doesn't recognize them
08:12 < jim> do you have plenty of cd blanks (so that one more doesn't matter too much)?
08:12 < syb0rg> Mead, there is a tool called PLOP you can burn to CD, which will allow you to then boot to USB even if your motherboard does not support it
08:12 < syb0rg> https://www.plop.at/en/bootmanagers.html
08:13 < jim> well debian doesn't need that, because it can already boot from either
08:13 < syb0rg> jim how big is the regular debian image?
08:14 < rcf> jim: not if the BIOS is broken
08:14 < jim> somewhere between 250 and 350 mb
08:14 < syb0rg> nice, that is pretty tiny
08:14 < jim> rcf, yeah that could be
08:15 < Mead> I burned it to a dual layer, perhaps if I dig through my box of disused computer stuff I could find a blank single layer and try that.
08:15 < jim> in case it would fail, that's why I asked if you have plenty of blanks, so that you can experiment without fear
08:15 < Mead> after that I'm gonna take a look at that plop tool
08:16 < jim> ok, what's your cpu?
08:16 < Mead> jim, I verfied the image when I burned it.
08:16 < jim> the steam image?
08:16 < Mead> my cpu?  Phenom II x4 965 black
08:17 < jim> what is that, x86-64?
08:17 < jim> that is, 64 bit intel?
08:17 < Mead> yeah,  quad core AMD chip
08:19 < jim> ok, so you want the amd64 one (or, the i386 should work if you want to try 32 bit, but I don't think it's necessary to go there these days)
08:20 < Mead> I've got the correct image for the system
08:20 < jim> oh ok... you might want this one, if you need the nonfree firmware for stuff like wireless: https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/9.4.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-cd/firmware-9.4.0-amd64-netinst.iso
08:22 < Mead> see the problem is that halfway through installing of the system core (or whatever the term is) it stops and asks me to change the media to disc 1 of 1 which it was already installing from.
08:22 < jim> but if you don't have that stuff, your net should be detected (if it will boot)
08:27 < jim> Mead, wait, trying to get what you were saying... it wanted disk 1? you mean the steamos one?
08:27 < jim> what's the "it"
08:28 < supernovah> is there a way to ask ptmx for a numbered pts
08:28 < supernovah> as apposed to a randomly assigned one
08:32 < Mead> jim: yes:  it was an old fashion "change the disk" type message.  I'd get a screenshot of if I could.
08:33 < Mead> Jim: and by "it" I was refering to the installer that steamOS uses, which I'm almost certain is just the debian installer
08:38 < jim> Mead, that could be very well true... and, the installer image you have (if it's the actual debian one) will not be asking you for other disks
08:41 < Mead> jim: the entire reason I started chatting here is because it ask for a "media change"
08:43 < Styil> btw, any of yall know how to change the next boot option for grub in windows?
08:45 < well_laid_lawn>  what's a yall ?
08:46 < aclaivi> I think you mean y'all'st'd've
08:46 < jim> Mead, ok... has the debian netinstall asked for a second disk yet?
08:47 < jim> Mead, alternatively, have you tried a debian netinstall before that did?
08:50 < supernovah> whats the difference btween the different pages on manual with different numbers and how do I know which one I;'m using?
08:50 < jim> Mead, yet another alternative... is your bios doing something special that causes it to ask for another disk even when you don't have one, or something along those lines?
08:50 < rcf> supernovah: man man
08:56 < kurahaupo_> supernovah: sections are 1 commands, 2 kernel calls, 3 library calls, 8 sysop stuff, 4-7 other stuff I don't recall right now
08:56 < Mead> jim: no, the bios already did it's job and booted from the DVD rom, it is the debian installer asking me to change media (disc)
08:57 < Mead> I bet the my second disc burn is finished, let me go look and try it.
08:59 < jim> Mead ok best of luck
09:00 < jim> gotta wander out for a bit
09:09 < hey2> Is there a way to move a mouse with bash?
09:09 < lopid> no but xdotool can move the mouse cursor
09:10 < hey2> :-(
09:10 < hey2> I have a VDI at work running Ubuntu
09:10 < hey2> it times out after a minute or two
09:10 < hey2> have permission to run bash scripts, just tried
09:10 < overkiLLe> test after auth
09:10 < overkiLLe> that's better
09:10 < hey2> anyone have any suggestions to keep it from timing out lol
09:15 < jim> Mead, how'd that last one work?
09:23 < Mead> jim: the install is running, not quite to the spot it would stop and ask for the media changed on the last.   This time I burned it to a single layer dvd instead of a dual layer
09:28 < Mead> hurm it stopped at the same place,  I'm typing this from another screen so it might not be exact:  " /media/cdrom:Please insert the disck labeled: 'Steam0S GNU/Linux 2.0 _brewmaster_ -unofficeal multi-architecture i386/amd64 DVD #1 20180122-22:40' into the drive '/media/cdrom/' and press enter. "
09:30 < jim> ok, what disk did you boot first?
09:31 < Mead> that disk
09:32 < Mead> it's been asking me to insert the disk that was in the drive
09:32 < jim> pronouns -bad-! :) please tell me which you booted first, the debian disk?
09:32 < Mead> I booted from the steamosdvd
09:32 < jim> ok, could you try to boot the debian netinstall
09:33 < jim> instead, that is
09:34 < jim> will the real pabed please stand!
09:34 < Mead> before I go make another coaster,  what is the reasoning behind burning that image to boot from it?
09:35 < jim> well first, I thought you already burned a debian netinstall
09:36 < jim> but that's nonreasoning... the reasoning is:
09:37 < jim> the debian netinstall should be able to either connect to the net early in its install process, and doesn't ask for another disk
09:37 < Mead> That would be great if I wanted vanilla debian
09:38 < jim> ok, so you don't?
09:38 < Mead> no,  I'm trying to install SteamOS, which is based on Debian...
09:39 < jim> ok, I'm guessing something is wrong with their installer
09:39 < jim> if not so, you'd be installed by now
09:40 < Mead> I'd already being playing hatsimulator in my living room
09:40 < Mead> I mean teamfortress 2
09:40 < Ben64> why not install ubuntu
09:41 < Mead> well ubuntu would require a mouse to start steam. I want this to boot into big picture mode for my controller
09:41 < jim> ok, and you installed steamos on the machine in your living room?
09:41 < nekoseam> Is there a more minimal alternative to GNOME disks?
09:41 < jim> and you did it with those cds?
09:41 < Ben64> it doesn't require a mouse
09:41 < cheapie> nekoseam: What are you wanting to do with it?
09:42 < Mead> Ben64 how would I control everything from a my gamepads?
09:42 < nekoseam> cheapie: Basically to be able to unmount things and view contents of a drive
09:42 < cheapie> nekoseam: GParted should do that for you.
09:42 < Mead> jim: Yes, I've installed steamOS from a dvd before on another system.
09:42 < cheapie> If you want command-line, then fdisk, mount/umount, file, etc.
09:44 < jim> Mead, the thing is, that even though this version of steamos is based on debian, I don't know what it does beyond installing the debian part... but I'm not a be-all or end-all, there might be others who understand steamos on this channel... and if not, there is a bot, alis, that can assist you in looking for channels on the Freenode irc net. To start, /msg alis help
09:44 < badsekter> when you run a game in WINE, does it utilize only 4 GB RAM at most? because WINE is 32 bit?
09:45 < jim> badsekter, that's possible, yes
09:47 < AliSh> Hi, I'm trying to run git server on my vritualbox(ubuntu). I used this Link (https://www.linux.com/learn/how-run-your-own-git-server) except generating ssh. I wanna use user pass model for accessing git. Now I'm getting this error when I'm going to clone on real host => fatal: Could not read from remote repository.  Please make sure you have the correct access rights and the repository exists.
09:48 < AliSh> I'm using this command for clone => git clone alish@192.168.0.156:/home/test/git/myproject.git
09:48 < aclaivi> Do you need to supply a port maybe?
09:49 < AliSh> "ip addr show" in server shows: "192.168.0.156/24
09:49 < AliSh> is "/24" the port?
09:50 < aclaivi> /24 is the sub
09:50 < aclaivi> subnet
09:50 < AliSh> aha, thank you
09:50 < aclaivi> Let me have a quick read through that article to see if I can help you at all
09:50 < AliSh> thanks
09:50 < jim> AliSh, one easy way to do that (and one that will not have any web interface), is to make a bare repo on the server, and add a remote pointing to that repo from, say, home. then, you should be able to push changes to it
09:51 < AliSh> i created this path in my server "/home/test/git/myproject" then in that directory i wrote "git init --bare"
09:52 < AliSh> and added a user to system like this "sudo useradd alish" and "sudo passwd alish"
09:53 < aclaivi> Try something like 'git clone ssh://git@192.168.0.156/home/test/git/myproject.git'
09:54 < aclaivi> That article gets you to setup the git user account, so most likely that will be used for credentials
09:54 < aclaivi> Or you may even just be able to do 'git@192.168.0.156:/home/test/git/myproject.git'
09:55 < AliSh> aclaivi, let me check. Also full command was "$git clone alish@192.168.0.156:/home/test/git/myproject.git Cloning into 'myproject'... ssh: connect to host 192.168.0.156 port 22: Connection refused fatal: Could not read from remote repository.  Please make sure you have the correct access rights and the repository exists."
09:56 < aclaivi> Instead of alish try 'git'
09:56 < AliSh> ok
09:57 < jim> AliSh, if it's saying connection refused, that means an ssh server is not running on port 22 on that machine
09:57 < jim> or can't reach it
09:58 < Triffid_Hunter> badsekter: my wine is 64 bit.. if you set up a 32 bit prefix then yes the game will crash if it tries to use more than 4GB
09:59 < Triffid_Hunter> badsekter: many modern games are 64 bit only, you'll be doing yourself a disservice with a 32 bit prefix.. fwiw most 32 bit apps (eg steam) seem to work fine in my 64 bit wine prefix
09:59 < aclaivi> Odd that the article gets your to setup rsa-keys for ssh but never actually ensure SSH is running
10:00 < AliSh> is it safe to generate ssh on my machine? i don't know much about ssh
10:00 < Styil> perfectly safe
10:00 < AliSh> tnx
10:00 < malina> depends on if your computeris safe.. but ifyou assum e it is, then yes
10:00 < Styil> assuming you dont have some malware installed or something
10:00 < aclaivi> Just to confirm something at the moment alish, is the machine you are setting up a git server on the same as the machine you work on
10:00 < malina> andlol 'perfectly safe' ..
10:01 < AliSh> aclaivi, yes
10:01 < AliSh> malina, :)
10:01 < AliSh> i'm sure my machine safe for now
10:01 < aclaivi> Are you going to use other machine to pull the code, or is it just going to be worked on on your own machine
10:01 < aclaivi> Because if that is the case, you don't need to run a server
10:02 < AliSh> fresh installed. I'm at new Co, and they were using windows. I'm changing all devices to linux. We're Python dev
10:02 < aclaivi> Ah
10:02 < jim> AliSh, please spell out tnx as thanks
10:02 < jim> (and similar, for example please spell out u as you, it helps people (particularly new english speakers) to understand, at least, most of what's going on)
10:02 < AliSh> aclaivi, I wanna run a git server. In current co they haven't source control.
10:03 < AliSh> jim, Ok, you are right. I was like that in first days.
10:03 < jim> AliSh, thanks
10:03 < AliSh> aclaivi, and use this server for all team.
10:03 < aclaivi> Understood, was just checking so that you weren't wasting your time
10:04 < AliSh> Now just trying this things on my own machine to ensure that everything will go fine.
10:05 < jim> AliSh, do you want one of those github-alikes that have a pretty good web interface and everything like that?
10:06 < AliSh> jim, If it's good and secure, absolutely yes!
10:10 < aclaivi> GitLab might be worth looking in to then
10:12 < aclaivi> AliSh: https://about.gitlab.com/product/ the basic version is free, and seems to be what you want. I'm sure other alternatives also exist
10:13 < aclaivi> Also if you are concerned about security, I would recommend learning about ssh keys for authentication
10:13 < AliSh> jim, aclaivi, I ran to google and found some solution. because I wasn't familiar with ssh so I didn't know that i had to install "openssh-server". now i get another error. :)
10:13 < AliSh> aclaivi, I'm going to check that
10:13 < Styil> ecdsa keys > rsa keys
10:15 < aclaivi> Styil: I don't know enough about that to argue a point, but I think we can both agree that either of those is better than a password
10:16 < Styil> just joking, both accomplish the same task more or less
10:16 < Styil> I mean, ECDSA authentication is milliseconds faster but that doesnt matter of course
10:16 < aclaivi> If my authentication is out by a millisecond I can't sleep at night
10:18 < Styil> but yes, key authentication > password authentication, no joke
10:19 < Styil> But I do make all my ssh keys nowadays ecdsa because why not
10:20 < Styil> just a bit confused about why a web interface is needed here though
10:22 < Styil> a web interface for git is only good for searching through many projects, which doesnt seem to be what you are doing here
10:27 < aclaivi> We don't really know what his spec is though
10:27 < aclaivi> The issues I can see at the moment with it is that he needs to be able to manage users
10:28 < jim> Styil, well, if it's just one project, you're right, probably doesn't need the whole github/gitlab experience... right now, I'm thinking about that connection refused as the first thing he needs to fix
10:30 < AliSh> I checked gitlab, I also checked other tracking tools before. like bugzilla, redmine, trac, apache bloodhound (i know it's just tracking tools).
10:30 < AliSh> I have to council with others.
10:31 < aclaivi> Keep in mind you don't really need those services if you have a good flow of communication throughout the team
10:31 < aclaivi> If you have other ways that are already in place for discussing issues and that sort of thing
10:32 < AliSh> I struggled with articles again and i found that i need to create new "git" user with its home directory and ".ssh" directory. currently I get this => "fatal: '/home/git/myproject.git' does not appear to be a git repository"
10:32 < cloudbud> How to  set a cron for a  user to execute a command at 8.35 in morning
10:32 < AliSh> aclaivi, why? I need issue tracking, source control and this things. we also using scrum.
10:33 < jim> AliSh, ok... can you try sshing to the machine?
10:33 < AliSh> ok
10:33 < Armand> cloudbud: https://crontab-generator.org/
10:33 < jim> if you get connection refused from that, gotta fix it
10:33 < aclaivi> AliSh: We're trying to figure out the scope of your problem as a whole
10:34 < AliSh> jim, ssh worked
10:34 < AliSh> aclaivi, ok, thank you for helping
10:34 < jim> ok, still sshed in, when you do ls, do you see a test dir?
10:36 < aclaivi> Gosh there's a lot of articles out there for multi-user git setups
10:36 < jim> (so if he didn't get connection refused, we should find out if a repo is there, find it on the serverm, and clone it
10:37 < jim> )
10:37 < aclaivi> AliSh: Once you ssh in can you give us the output of 'pwd;ls'
10:37 < aclaivi> I'm interest to know if the myproject.git folder actually exists at this point
10:38 < jim> AliSh, you can do that as  ( pwd ; ls ) | nc termbin.com 9999
10:39 < jim> the nc command should respond with a url
10:39 < supernov2h> when I'm closing a connection opened with socket, bind, listen, accept: which file descriptor do I shutdown to send a fin packet so the port isn't remaining open with TIME_WAIT?
10:39 < AliSh> jim, I did what you said. There was repository but with wrong spell. Thank you guys. :) It was very Hard. I was .Net developer for several years (but used linux in home). I didn't tried this things on my own. Thank you again.
10:40 < jim> AliSh, are things working now?
10:40 < AliSh> jim, Yes :)))))) I'm so excited
10:40 < jim> AliSh, there is also a channel here, #git
10:40 < AliSh> I love LINUX
10:41 < AliSh> jim, Thank you. I'll save it.
10:41 < jim> you can clone that repo?
10:41 < AliSh> yes
10:41 < AliSh> jim, aclaivi, Thank you for helping me :)
10:41 < jim> ok, good... try making a simple change, commit, then git push origin master
10:42 < aclaivi> AliSh: no problem, make sure you test it like jim says before you assume it is all working though :)
10:42 < jim> then clone it again in another dir at your home, then look for that change... you can do git log to look for the commit there
10:42 < AliSh> so problem was this => must install "openssh-server" - must create user "git" with "/home/git" - must init ".ssh" and ssh key.
10:43 < AliSh> ok
10:43 < Styil> once you have an ssh key established, disable password authentication for ssh
10:43 < jim> AliSh, at some point, you're going to want to read the 14-page pdf "git from the bottom up"
10:43 < AliSh> I'm going to check what you said. after that I must get it work with user password assigned. I want to manage users.
10:43 < aclaivi> That termbin pipe is neat
10:44 < AliSh> Styil, Ok, Thanks
10:44 < jim> aclaivi, yeah I wanna get one for here
10:44 < Styil> AliSh, that would entail going into /etc/ssh/sshd_config and setting on some line writing "PasswordAuthentication no"
10:44 < jim> what Styil says is probably needed... otherwise the chinese hackers will get it
10:45 < aclaivi> One billion entries in lastb
10:45 < aclaivi> The dream, if you will
10:46 < AliSh> How we can remove ssh? so previous machines and current can't communicate anymore.
10:46 < Styil> waht do you mean remove ssh?
10:46 < aclaivi> You cannot remove ssh if you are using git, but you can put proper security on it, such as rsa keys
10:47 < AliSh> i mean ssh_keys
10:47 < jim> AliSh, actually what you probably want to do it start by getting ssh keys working
10:47 < AliSh> i made config for rsa_keys
10:47 < jim> then after that, you would turn off password auth on the server
10:48 < jim> AliSh, does it ask you for your pass phrase
10:48 < jim> ?
10:49 < Styil> AliSh: You mean remove access from some computers? That would involve deleting the line associated with their key in ~/.ssh/authorized_keys
10:49 < Styil> on the computer getting sshed into of course
10:50 < AliSh> jim, with "PasswordAuthentication yes" it is asking me
10:50 < AliSh> Styil, yes
10:50 < aclaivi> Styil: can't you map one private key to multiple public keys?
10:50 < aclaivi> Styil: so you could add/remove them on the fly
10:50 < AliSh> jim, with "PasswordAuthentication yes" it didn't ask m e
10:50 < AliSh> anymore
10:51 < AliSh> but it asks me for rsa_key password on my local machine
10:51 < aclaivi> Thats good
10:51 < Pantsu> only if you put a password on the key, and are not using a keyring
10:51  * Pantsu suggests using a keyring
10:51 < Styil> aclaivi: one private key maps to one pubkey
10:51 < Pantsu> you can eg use gpg or gnome-keyring and have it automaticly unlock when you log into your machine
10:52 < AliSh> I must go for now. Thank you all.
10:52 < Styil> not sure what the purpose of mapping to more than one pubkey does
10:52 < Pantsu> Styil: but you can make multiple subkeys
10:52 < Styil> stop by anytime
10:52 < Styil> true
10:52 < Pantsu> if you use gpg keys for ssh
10:52 < Styil> but it is a different privkey for that
10:52 < Pantsu> yep
10:52 < Styil> nonetheless
10:54 < Styil> that said
10:54 < Styil> didnt know you could use gpg for ssh auth
10:54 < Styil> cool
10:55 < Pantsu> gpg-agent is imo nicer than ssh-agent, and the gpg infrastructure makes managing keys easier
10:56 < aclaivi> Goodbye AliSh, thank the heavens you disabled password auth
10:56 < aclaivi> May your git servers rip in pepper
10:57 < Styil> how do I check attempted ssh logins btw?
10:57 < aclaivi> lastb
10:57 < aclaivi> That shows the failed ones, at least
10:58 < Styil> my IP is still clean
10:58 < supernov2h> I can't for some reason, close a connection I've established without it entering TIME_WAIT, I tried using shutdown(fd, SHUT_RDWR) and close(fd) where the fd is the one returned from socket, but also tried the one returned from accept. On both of them I tried doing shutdown+close, shutdown only and close only... no comibations let me rebind the socket within about 20 seconds because of TIME_WAIT
10:58 < Styil> cool beans
10:59 < aclaivi> I was shook the first time I did lastb on one of my vps'
10:59 < aclaivi> Did not expect it to be flooded, given it was a static page for a local rural pub
11:03 < Styil> eh, if it is a webpage, it is bound to be indexed by search engines
11:03 < Styil> I havent actually ran a webpage, but my IP does have a domain tied to it
11:04 < MrGrz> hi
11:08 < MrGrz> hi
11:08 < MrGrz> hi
11:09 < balance> hi
11:10 < post-factum> hi
11:10 < balance> is there a possibility to lock a specific action, e.g. starting firefox, for a superuser?
11:10 < balance> temporarily
11:11 < chchjesus> lock, as in, block?
11:14 < balance> chchjesus: yeah, so let's say I'd like to block the action "start firefox" or whatever for like 30mins on a specific machine for all users. It's cear that that's possible for ordianry users, but what about su/sudo ?
11:16 < chchjesus> Not unless you create a slightly less powerful superuser
11:24 < simoneb> anybody knows if it is possible to have an nfs mount hang (instead of returning stale) if the share does not exist anymore on server? I can get this to happen only by disabling the IP
11:26 < balance> chchjesus: ok thanks
11:36 < nekoseam> http://accc.uic.edu/answer/how-do-i-use-joe A good guide to using JOE, a minimal full-screen text editor with different modes that function like other popular text editors
11:42 < post-factum> nekoseam: why should i use it instead of neovim?
11:45 < nekoseam> post-factum: I don't know, you decide
11:46 < nekoseam> I use it because it's dead simple and straightfowards to use
11:48 < Styil> eh, vim is not that but I know how to use it well enough
11:59 < hans_> the previous process listening on TCP port 8888 had to be SIGKILL'ed, now bind() returns 0 (indicating success), and connections are accepted by the OS, and the listening socket is in blocking mode, but accept() never returns when new connections are created on port 8888, any idea why?
12:00 < hans_> or how to fix it, short of a reboot?
12:02 < hans_> hu, nvm, it works now
12:08 < BluesKaj> Hey folks
12:08 < supernov2h> I can't seem to close a connection I've made, it always says there's bytes to be read but read returns nothing
12:08 < jim> hi blues
12:08 < jim> (also brb)
12:09 < manjaroDeepin> I am using syslinux as bootloader but I did not understand the concept of this fallback image in syslinux.
12:11 < BluesKaj> Hi jim
12:11 < widp> How do I use passwords in configuration files?
12:11 < supernov2h> this is the segment of code and all the functions involved in the process of closing my socket, can anyone catch why my timeout, times out instead of succeeds in closing it? https://pastebin.com/LcjXNeGE
12:12 < hans_> supernov2h, just because there's bytes to be read doesn't mean you can't close it... what kind of connection are you talking about? TCP? UDP? unix socket? som tin else?
12:13 < supernov2h> hans_: TCP, and I can close it and it closes, but when I try to reopen it it is always already open by linux with TIME_WAIT
12:13 < supernov2h> if both ends send and receive fin/ack's, then the system should close the socket, which means my code isn't achieving that for some reason
12:14 < Pantsu> widp: generally you try to avoid that
12:14 < widp> I am considering using something like "pass"
12:15 < widp> I noticed macos has a builtin keyring command to manage this "security" I think.
12:15 < widp> is there something builtin like that on linux?
12:16 < widp> A command line utility for password management?
12:16 < Pantsu> the linux kernel do have a keyring
12:16 < Pantsu> (if you have a new enough kernel)
12:16 < Pantsu> you probably don't want to use it though
12:16 < Pantsu> just use gnome-keyring or the kde on if you want something osx like
12:17 < Pantsu> libsecret is quite decent
12:17 < widp> I've been using keepass so far, but this is making me consider pass because I could easily use it shell scripts and such.
12:18 < Pantsu> keepassxc has a nice cli interface
12:18 < Pantsu> and isn't written in .net
12:18 < supernov2h> I think the tcp connection has TCP_KEEPIDLE set on it
12:18 < Pantsu> gnome-keyring is still nicer though
12:18 < Pantsu> (when it comes to cli interface)
12:19 < widp> Pantsu: but I intend to use this on android too.
12:19 < widp> So I'll probably try keepassxc. thanks!
12:20 < _0x40_> Hi. How can I find all lines in file A that are also in file B?
12:20 < _0x40_> Nvm I think I have an idea.
12:22 < hans_> php -r '$a=file("file A");$b=file("file B");foreach($a as $line){if(in_array($line,$b){echo $line;}}'
12:25 < mAniAk-_-> supernov2h: so whats the problem? that sockets are in time_wait or not closing correctly with fin fin/ack ack?
12:26 < supernov2h> I don't know if they aren't closing, but they're in time_wait, so my question was going to be, should I set the flag to use the socket anyway
12:26 < supernov2h> I would prefer to have the socket close gracefully, but it seems to wait for the fin_timeout set by the system
12:27 < mAniAk-_-> supernov2h: sockets on close initiator will always be in time-wait for a while
12:27 < supernov2h> mAniAk-_-: but if the fin/ack is sent, why would it remain open
12:28 < supernov2h> part of the TCP stack says that, no more data will be communicated after both parties do that...
12:28 < mAniAk-_-> supernov2h: a good writeup if you want to understand time-wait https://vincent.bernat.im/en/blog/2014-tcp-time-wait-state-linux
12:29 < djph> time-wait is "I'm waiting for the other end to finack"
12:29 < djph> ... err, I think ...
12:29 < supernov2h> mAniAk-_-:  I understand why it can be that way, they want to prevent delayed packets being sent to the wrong receiver (ie a secondary process that grabs the port)
12:29 < supernov2h> mAniAk-_-: so the solution, would be to use SO_REUSEADDR I presume?
12:30 < mAniAk-_-> djph: no, it's the state on the closing side after fin fin/ack ack is done
12:31 < _0x40_> I figured it out. {uniq A & uniq B} | sort | uniq -d
12:33 < michael2> hi all. I have a  question about syslinux. is the reason the `syslinux --install /dev/sdX' command is needed - say vs. just placing the executable file in the folder - because `syslinux --install' actually places the ldlinux.sys file in the first sector of the boot partition? i.e. the block pointers within `ldlinux.sys's inode  would actually point to the first blocks of the boot partition - which wouldn't
12:33 < michael2> happen if you just created `ldlinux.sys' within an existing filesystem?
12:33 < mAniAk-_-> supernov2h: you should just create a new socket afaik, i dont do much socket programming :)
12:35 < djph> mAniAk-_-: ah, right - it's the "wait for the other end in case something got lost in transit"
12:35 < djph> mAniAk-_-: thinking of FIN_WAIT
12:41 < supernov2h> mAniAk-_-: so the solution, would be to use SO_REUSEADDR I presume
12:41 < supernov2h> mAniAk-_-: I am creating a new socket... problem is it uss the old port and address, therein lies the problem, error: address in use
12:44 < milp> hi, is there a way to force a system reboot incase even init 6 would time out?
12:45 < Sitri> milp: ctrl+alt+delete?  If that fails, sysrq.
12:45 < deo> michael2: you can not just copy the file as boot sector wont be changed
12:46 < milp> sitri: no physical access
12:47 < michael2> deo: thats what I thought, I need to link to another pre-existing ldlinux.sys file - but it seems you can't just chop and change files like that...
12:48 < deo> michael2: you are right you can not just copy the file
12:50 < Pantsu> milp: hardware watchdog
12:50 < michael2> deo: could I make a file in any directory - say with `syslinux --install /boot/installer/' ?  in other words, the final file path doesn't matter, as long as the inode pointers for the file are in the boot sector (which I assume is the first sector/block of the partition?)
12:51 < Pantsu> milp: most boards supports it these days
12:52 < milp> Pantsu: i got a selfmade raspberry based device that can hard-reset the server, but i was wondering if there are any emergency-commands for htis
12:52 < Pantsu> if you have ME or similar there is
12:52 < deo> michael2 install accept only device name
12:53 < deo> i do not understand your question
12:53 < hans_> how can i programmatically inject commands to a running screen session's /bin/bash ?
12:53 < Pantsu> sounds like a xyproble
12:53 < Pantsu> m
12:54 < deo> michael2: if you are talking about directory option then syntax is syslinux --directory /boot/syslinux/ --install /dev/sdb1
12:54 < Sitri> hans_: screen manpage covers that
12:55 < Pantsu> would usually install it to the mbr not a partition
12:55 < Sitri> Syslinux does install to the MBR
12:55 < introom> is there a level db brwoser
12:55 < introom> so that i can see all the kvs/
12:56 < Sitri> However, it also needs to be installed to the /boot partition
12:56 < deo> correct it was wrong example copied to save writing it, just take of the 1
12:57 < michael2> deo:  Im wondering if the ldlinux.sys 2nd stage bootloader can be valid with pretty much any filename/path as long as the file points to data in the first sector/blocks of the disk? do you know if that is right?
12:58 < hans_> Sitri, "screen at" ?
12:59 < hans_> damn, that seems to be it, thanks!
13:00 < deo> michael2 never tried to change the name seems like pointless task, but it is the same name on all file systems I tried to install it on so guessing is hardcoded
13:01 < michael2> yeah, I think I need to be able to change the name
13:03 < hans_> hmm, doesn't seem to work tho;  screen -S test -dm ;  screen at test ping 8.8.8.8 ;
13:03 < hans_> and nothing happens in the test screen
13:15 < sveinse> How can erase the first x bytes in a file with dd, but retain the rest of the file? So the overall size is the same after
13:15 < rajrajraj> nm /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libcurl.so.4.4.0 says U SSL_CTX_new, how do i figure out why?
13:15 < sveinse> erase = fill with 0
13:15 < deo> michael2 just wondering why you want to do that, why does it matter what is the file name
13:17 < supernov2h> oh god, now my terminal scrolling doesn't bind to my cursor on this mac... how annoying
13:18 < deo> hans_ try -m command (and -d if you want it detached) and google :)
13:23 < hans_> this works, screen -S test -X stuff "/bin/ping 8.8.8.8^M"
13:23 < hans_> injects it into the terminal and emulates pressing enter :)
13:23 < blueglass> sveinse: dd if=/dev/zero of=<file> bs=1 count=<x bytes>
13:24 < deo> hans_: screen -S test -dm ping 8.8.8.8 should work too
13:26 < pewpew> sveinse: maybe just use dd with a count?
13:27 < revel> Or bs=<x bytes> count=1, or whatever gets the product of them to <x bytes>.
13:28 < djph> er, wouldn't that completely replace $file with $count zeroes?
13:28 < revel> I don't think so.
13:29 < hans_> deo, that creates a new screen session called "test", running ping, but i wanted to inject commands into an already existing screen session
13:29 < revel> Apparently it will...
13:30 < revel> Guess that's since block devices don't behave the same way regular files do.
13:31 < poxifide> hm.. i wonder if it is possible to tail a log file and throw it in dev null somehow...
13:31 < zack6849> poxifide: why would you want to do that?
13:32 < djph> revel: yup it does - just tried it.  http://termbin.com/uyff\
13:32 < djph> err\
13:32 < djph> stupid bandaid.  http://termbin.com/uyff
13:32 < zack6849> you mean like, tail the file and write the output to /dev/null not your terminal?
13:32 < revel> I did too.
13:32 < poxifide> for a log file for a music server that just spams library updates. it can fill up a log file quick, so i want it to go straight to /dev/null, but i want to be able to watch the output to it in a terminal
13:33 < deo> hans_: in that case you are right, your way should be used
13:33 < zack6849> poxifide: oh you mean like it logs to /dev/null but you can watch it at the same time?
13:33 < poxifide> yea
13:33 < zack6849> hm.
13:33 < zack6849> now that's an interesting idea, not sure though
13:35 < poxifide> i tried symmlinking a test.log to dev null and tail -f the file but it doesn't pick up when i echo "test" > test.log :(
13:36 < zack6849> poxifide: i wouldn't imagine you can do that from your application ootb either way, but maybe some sort of special file would help, i dont know a ton but could a FIFO file help at all?
13:36 < zack6849> poxifide: of course, because it's following th elink to /dev/null, lol
13:36 < revel> poxifide: Maybe use a fifo.
13:36 < poxifide> never heard of fifo. ill look into it.
13:37 < hans_> why does ^M emulate pressing enter? some ascii control character or something?
13:38 < zack6849> it's a line ending
13:38 < zack6849> or, line feed, one of them
13:38 < zack6849> my memory is bad
13:38 < zack6849> hans_: either way it's a line ending so
13:38 < zack6849> https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/32001/what-is-m-and-how-do-i-get-rid-of-it
13:41 < hans_> well, makes sense for a MSDOS system, but this is a linux system :o
13:41 < hans_> and neither ^n  nor ^r  nor ^r^n  works
13:41 < JimBuntu> char representation needs to be observed across filesystems.
13:42 < JimBuntu> hans, it's not identical to /r or /n (which is one way to show those chars)
13:43 < zack6849> hans_: but was the file ever edited on a windows computer?
13:44 < zack6849> if so, there's your answer.
13:44 < hans_> it's not a file, its a screen session. i'm running screen -S test -dm
13:44 < hans_>    - then  screen -S test -X stuff "ping 8.8.8.8^M"
13:44 < rajrajraj> anyone?
13:45 < zack6849> rajrajraj: what
13:45 < zack6849> hans_: o.0
13:45 < zack6849> i mean i guess that's one way to do it lol
13:45 < rajrajraj> zack6849:  nm /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libcurl.so.4.4.0 says U SSL_CTX_new, how do i figure out why?
13:47 < zack6849> rajrajraj: that's a nice question, I don't know
13:47 < zack6849> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
13:47 < rajrajraj> zack6849:  https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/5nPLyZVO/
13:47 < zack6849> hans_: i guess that whoever wrote that script got their answer form here
13:47 < zack6849> https://unix.stackexchange.com/posts/13961/revisions
13:47 < zack6849> er, sorry wrong link
13:47 < zack6849> https://unix.stackexchange.com/a/13961/214521
13:48 < mohabaks> hello folks;am running Ubuntu 18.04 trying to get the dhcp info from /var/lib/dhcp/dhclient.leases but the file doesn't exist unless I just run dhclient
13:48 < zack6849> mohabaks: well yeah, why would it have a list of active leases if it's not running?
13:48 < Exagone313> rajrajraj: what are you trying to achieve?
13:49 < supernov2h> so I've narrowed down my socket problem, the shutdown(fd, SHUT_WR) for the listenfd (returned from listen(...)) always returns -1, errno 107: (transport endpoint is not connected) ...
13:49 < mohabaks> zack6849: am running ubuntu with apache cloud stack it has ip and I can ssh to it
13:49 < zack6849> mohabaks: are you just trying to get the computers current local ip?
13:49 < Oxyz> how can I replace any non alphanumeric numbers in a string? ... with: echo "fg12!" | sed 's/[^a-zA-Z0-9]//g' I can remove them..  but lets say I want to replace them with .* ?!
13:50 < zack6849> Oxyz: what do you mean when you say .*?
13:50 < poxifide> zack6849: thank you so much! have to use less -f to see changes, but it works :D
13:50 < rajrajraj> Exagone313:  copile a code that uses curl
13:50 < Exagone313> rajrajraj: your curl is statically linked to libssl
13:50 < compdoc>  anyone good with samba as DC or member server?
13:50 < rajrajraj> Exagone313:  oh, how do i change it
13:50 < Exagone313> wait, i'm not sure
13:50 < Oxyz> zack6849: basically, I need this:  echo "fg12!"  -> fg12.*
13:50 < rajrajraj> ok
13:51 < rajrajraj> Exagone313:  how do you know its static
13:51 < zack6849> you could escape that
13:51 < zack6849> just replace // in your sed with
13:51 < zack6849> actually do you even need to escape
13:51 < zack6849> hold on
13:51 < mohabaks> zack6849: no; I want to get dhcp-server-identifier from dhcpclient.leases.
13:51 < Oxyz> zack6849: I need to create a regexp for any nonalfu num
13:52 < zack6849> Oxyz: looks fine to me?
13:52 < zack6849>  echo "fg12!" | sed 's/[^a-zA-Z0-9]/.*/g'
13:52 < zack6849> fg12.*
13:52 < Exagone313> "U" The symbol is undefined.
13:52 < zack6849> but you could even make this simplier I think
13:52 < Exagone313> ok, sorry, it has to be dynamically linked
13:52 < Oxyz> zack6849: well... no I just feel stupied..  =)
13:52 < Oxyz> thanks!
13:53 < zack6849> no problem
13:53 < Exagone313> rajrajraj: try pkg-config --libs --cflags curl
13:53 < Exagone313> or libcurl
13:54 < zetheroo> if regexp(\A1)}=1 is looking at the first character of the first line for number 1, is regexp(\Z1)}=1 looking at the first character of the last line for the number 1?
13:56 < supernov2h> should I be closing the fd returned from accept, or listen, to properly terminate a tcp socket? (or shutting it down with SHUT_WR)
13:57 < zack6849> supernov2h: not to criticize, but aren't there channels better for more kernel specific questions? or is that actually what this channel is for
13:57 < Shibe> anyone here know of a good libratbag frontend?
13:57 < zack6849> I've always thought this channel was just a general linux discussion, you'd probably have better luck asking in a place specific to things like that
13:58 < Exagone313> supernov2h: listen does not create a socket
13:58 < Exagone313> see ##posix
13:58 < Exagone313> if you don't discuss any linux-only thing
13:58 < supernov2h> Exagone313: rather socket(), not listen()
13:59 < Exagone313> yes you need close to close a socket
13:59 < supernov2h> But which one, close socket() or accept(), the fd returned from socket always fails
14:00 < Exagone313> perror("wtf");
14:00 < Exagone313> share some code
14:02 < supernov2h> Exagone313: https://pastebin.com/qyXnWd9c the group I commented out near the end of main is the one that I can't close, and I've tried closing it before closing the socket returned from accept(), but it also doesn't work
14:03 < Exagone313> supernov2h: https://gist.github.com/
14:04 < Exagone313> or anything that is not pastebin.com and that does not require js
14:04 < supernov2h> Exagone313: why not pastebin sory?
14:04 < zack6849> hat are those escapes everywhere, color codes?
14:04 < supernov2h> yeah ansi
14:05 < supernov2h> makes output nicer to read
14:05 < supernov2h> 31 red, 32 green, 36 blue, and the triplets are just quote marks utf-8 hex bytes
14:06 < zack6849> what's this supposed to be, an echo server or something?
14:06 < zack6849> I dont know a ton of c, was just curious about what i was looking at :)
14:07 < supernov2h> zack6849: its part of a larger program, it's just me learning how sockets work on linux
14:07 < zack6849> ah, ok
14:07 < supernov2h> zack6849: overall goal is the reverse of sertonet
14:08 < supernov2h> I've got everything tackled except the tcp layer
14:08 < zack6849> interesting, convert tcp to serial?
14:08 < supernov2h> yes, predictably, with a host service running that talks to remote devices to enumerate pseudo-terminals in a predictable fashio
14:08 < zack6849> neat idea
14:09 < supernov2h> except that was written in node.js which has the tcp layer sorted out
14:12 < Sveta> connected a tv via audio jack cable, and it makes background noise when nothing is playing
14:12 < Sveta> what is the reason? how can this be removed?
14:12 < zack6849> Sveta: w.....
14:12 < zack6849> why is this relevant to linux?
14:12 < armin> Sveta: well first of all, you're in a linux channel.
14:12 < armin> Sveta: then again: analogue signaling does mad things.
14:12 < zack6849> yes hello computer people please fix my tv
14:12 < zack6849> lmao
14:13 < armin> zack6849: no reason to make fun of them.
14:13 < armin> also it doesn't hurt to have some occasional generic audio nerd topics
14:14 < armin> but, still: it's hardly linux-related, you might want to consider ##electronics or something.
14:14 < zack6849> not at all, I just found it funny what a random question it was
14:14 < zack6849> people are discussing serial connections and kernel function things and then along comes a discussion about plugging in a tv to an audio jack
14:14 < Sveta> it's a debian computer, at least alsamixer is working, but i am simply looking for a generic intro to this concept and the reasons why not everyone needs it as zero
14:21 < hans_> zack6849, maybe he's using a smart-TV, and the TV's OS is linux :p
14:22 < hans_> (some smart TVs really are running linux)
14:22 < leeyaa> hello
14:22 < leeyaa> is it ok to ask ansible jinja question here? :p
14:22 < hans_> i have no idea what that is.
14:22 < hans_> try?
14:23 < zack6849> i know what ansible is
14:23 < zack6849> but not jinja
14:23 < zack6849> lol
14:23 < leeyaa> well trying to iterate over multiple groups in ansible template. I have this atm {% for host in groups[datacenter ~ "_opb_docker"] %} and it works great
14:23 < leeyaa> however if i want to add a second group and i try like this {% for host in groups[datacenter ~ "_opb_docker"] | intersect(groups[datacenter ~ "*_opb_db"])  %}
14:23 < leeyaa> it just prints empty lines in my template
14:25 < talin> hello. some process is crashing, but i am not sure which, and logs aren't saying anything. i am wondering if there's a way with systemd to do something like: check which process changed status last?
14:25 < talin> i could go through all the culprits and check systemctl status <process>, but there are many
14:26 < beterraba> Guys, I have 2 HDs. I'm currently unable to do anything in one of them because it's now a 'Read-only file system'. I'm afraid the system is self-protecting against bad writing. Would you have any suggestions on what to do?
14:27 < beterraba> I though on unmounting it, and then mounting again. But I'm not if that would make any sense
14:28 < ananke> beterraba: check 'dmesg' and 'smartctl -a /dev/yourdevice'
14:28 < overkiLLe> hey guys, i'm looking for a good terminal client for mattermost, *not matterhorn*. Any ideas?
14:29 < hans_> the heck is mattermost?
14:29 < Sitri> beterraba: If there isn't an issue that you can see, you can remount it with: mount -o remount,rw /mount/point
14:30 < ananke> hans_: google.com
14:30 < ananke> overkiLLe: you may want to check in #gitlab
14:30 < hans_> so, its like a search engine?
14:30 < beterraba> Sitri: I've just tried exactly that. But it returns the error:
14:30 < beterraba> lucas@inspiron:/$ sudo mount -o remount,rw '/data' Remounting is not supported at present. You have to umount volume and then mount it once again.
14:30 < ananke> hans_: you can use google.com to look up things
14:30 < overkiLLe> cool, thanks! @ananke
14:31 < ananke> Sitri: first let's help him with identifying an issue, before suggesting a potentially damaging operation
14:31 < Sitri> That's why I had the prefix :/
14:32 < zetheroo> does anyone know of a regexp which can match the last char in a string? I am trying regexp(\z)}=2 but it's not working
14:32 < Sitri> zetheroo: t$ will match anything that ends in t
14:34 < zetheroo>  Sitri: I am trying to match the last char of a multi-line output to a single digit. The last line of the output is only populated by a single digit.
14:36 < Exagone313> zetheroo: how is it related to linux? what are you using?
14:37 < Exagone313> this will match and extract the last character: /([\s\S])$/
14:40 < zetheroo> Exagone313: Using Zabbix
14:41 < zack6849> zetheroo: you could just do \d$ which would match any digit just before the end of a line
14:41 < zack6849> or if you want one where the entire line is just digits
14:41 < zack6849> ^\d+$
14:41 < zetheroo> zack6849: but I only care about the very last line
14:41 < zack6849> the very last line of the file?
14:42 < Exagone313> zetheroo: #zabbix
14:42 < zack6849> like, regex is for processing lines usually
14:42 < zetheroo> the very last line of the text
14:42 < zack6849> zetheroo: https://regex101.com/
14:42 < zack6849> maybe make a testable example there and link it?
14:42 < zack6849> like with sample info so i can see what you mean
14:43 < leeyaa> agaffney: any idea how to combine two groups in template? i tried this with no luck ;p {% for host in groups[datacenter ~ "_opb_docker"] | intersect(groups[datacenter ~ "*_opb_db"])  %}
14:45 < zack6849> zetheroo: i dont know zabbix but if you disable multiline in your regex you can just do \d+$ like so https://regex101.com/r/R7gS7F/1
14:46 < zetheroo> zack6849: at the moment I am using (\A1)}=1 to match the number 1 with the first char of the first line.
14:47 < zetheroo> zack6849: and this works great. But now I need to match number 1 with the last char of the entire block of text
14:47 < zack6849> zetheroo: i don't follow what you mean, i need example text or something and what you're tying to match lmao
14:47 < zack6849> make an example on regex101 and link me
14:47 < zetheroo> ok
14:49 < zetheroo> zack6849: https://regex101.com/r/5IhOfr/1
14:49 < zetheroo> ^ that's whats working now
14:49 < darkis8> exit
14:52 < zetheroo> zack6849: this is what I am trying to figure out https://regex101.com/r/rDsopi/1
14:53 < zack6849> zetheroo: and you want to match just the 1?
14:53 < zack6849> i dont understand
14:53 < zetheroo> yes
14:53 < zack6849> and are line 1 2 and 3 literally like that in the file?
14:53 < zetheroo> no
14:53 < zack6849> like is the word line in the file or are you just trying to give me an example
14:53 < zetheroo> they will be changing
14:53 < zack6849> ok
14:53 < zack6849> I understand that
14:54 < zack6849> but your overall goal is just to get the 1?
14:54 < zetheroo> there are a whole bunch of scripts outputting stuff ...
14:54 < zetheroo> yes, just to get the last char of the output
14:54 < zack6849> last char, or last digit.
14:55 < zack6849> either way with the example you just sent me my regex from earlier works
14:55 < zack6849> \d+$ will match the 1 on your example
14:55 < zack6849> https://regex101.com/r/rDsopi/2
14:55 < zetheroo> the zabbix string looks like regexp(\A1)}=1
14:55 < zetheroo> ok, will try
15:01 < zetheroo> I see here in the docs that Zabbix supports PCRE
15:03 < zetheroo> zack6849: that doesn't seem to be working for me :( But thanks for trying anyhow
15:08 < zack6849> zetheroo: np sorry i couldn't help, i dont know zabbix
15:10 < dbedrenko> test
15:10 < zack6849> dbedrenko: C-
15:10 < zack6849> see me after class
15:10 < dbedrenko> :)
15:11 < dbedrenko> This year I stopped having the occasional nightmare where I'm rushing to meet a coursework deadline due tomorrow . That's long over now
15:15 < prussian> instead it's just product deadlines, or production deployments or some other dreadful thing
15:19 < dbedrenko> prussian: let the managers worry about those
15:21 < antranigv> hey all
15:21 < antranigv> I need help :)
15:21 < antranigv> I have 2 disks attached to my VM, but for no reason I see 4 disks
15:21 < antranigv> sda, sdb, sdc, sdd :)
15:21 < antranigv> any one has any idea why?
15:21 < blueglass> run dmesg
15:22 < antranigv> and it's really an issue because I want to do stuff on LVM and it's not working because LVM works on UUIDs :)
15:22 < blueglass> and blkid
15:22 < antranigv> blueglass: what should I dig in dmesg?
15:22 < blueglass> look for sdd
15:22 < antranigv> I see sdd.
15:23 < antranigv> it says /dev/sdd: PTTYPE="gpt"
15:24 < blueglass> is there information from the scsi driver or similar?
15:24 < blueglass> also look for the other ones
15:24 < pankaj_> I am getting error after i compiled linux kernel. Please somebody visit this link and if you can please suggest some solution https://pasteboard.co/HnqoaF9.jpg
15:24 < blueglass> the goal is to figure out where these devices are coming from and which drivers are registering them
15:25 < blueglass> blkid can tell you a bit about them as wel
15:25 < blueglass> well*
15:26 < antranigv> blueglass: yea :/ scsi 0:0:1:0: Direct-Access     IBM      3303      NVDISK 0001 PQ: 0 ANSI: 5 I see 4 of it :D
15:26 < antranigv> it's definetly an issue with my PowerVMs
15:26 < antranigv> stupid IBM.
15:27 < blueglass> yeah, seems like a VM issue
15:36 < pankaj_> Can any body suggest a ver lightweight and best window manager in use
15:36 < rypervenche> pankaj_: I find i3 to be nice.
15:36 < dbedrenko> what does best mean?
15:37 < Psi-Jack> pankaj_: You want an overly subjective and biased batch of random answers unrelated to youi?
15:37 < Psi-Jack> you*
15:37 < djph> Psi-Jack: of course, he wants emacs.
15:38 < Psi-Jack> But... the text editor!
15:38 < dbedrenko> dwm is very lightweight. In fact they have a LOC limit
15:38 < djph> that's what vim's for :)
15:38 < Psi-Jack> LOC?
15:39 < dbedrenko> Lines of Coliflower
15:39 < Psi-Jack> Besides he didn't ask for an OS. :)
15:40 < Psi-Jack> dbedrenko: Seems unusual.
15:40 < dbedrenko> lines of code
15:40 < Psi-Jack> That too, seems unusual. :p
15:40 < dbedrenko> It also has no configuration file, all settings must be set at build time :>
15:41 < Psi-Jack> In fact, that's a bad thing against dwm. Developers limiting themselves with the number of lines of code they're allowed to use? What a shame, and waste of potentially good talent.
15:41 < Psi-Jack> Exactly. What a waste.
15:41 < dbedrenko> Yeah there are as many WM's as distros... we don't need so many, but people still do it for some reason
15:41 < dbedrenko> for fun I guess
15:42 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: suckless tools are very nice. I'm a big fan of st. Very minimal. Some of the other tools are a bit too minimal for me, but I still love the simplicity and attitude toward their programs.
15:42 < Dominian> hrm
15:42 < oneko> \o/
15:43 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: I think it gets too minimal. For example their browser doesn't do tabs, because they say, it should be up to the WM to manage browser windows
15:43 < Psi-Jack> That's horrible logic.
15:43 < dbedrenko> What is the adavantage in such minimalism? That you can run it on hardware from the 70s?
15:43 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: Aye. But you can patch it to your liking, I suppose. Which is what they encourage, to a certain extent.
15:43 < pankaj_> I just downloaded ssdm but i noted that many of the login managers or display managers are greater in size. Thier functioanlity looks be so small like giving login screen and showing shutdown screen. So why they are greater on soze then window manage
15:44 < Psi-Jack> dbedrenko: They say that ignorance is bliss......
15:44 < pankaj_> Sorry, manager
15:44 < Psi-Jack> ssdm again eh? You mean sddm?
15:44 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: might as well write my own browser then, or actually use a full-functioning browser that has the features I want rather than expecting me to code them in
15:44 < dbedrenko> > greater on soze then window manage
15:45 < azarus> ??
15:45 < dbedrenko> pankaj_: how much bigger in size are they?
15:45 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: Well, this is Linux. We have plenty of choices. For those who want that level of code, they can have it. For the rest of us, we have more functional browsers.
15:46 < azarus> surf is cool -- but the underlying engine sucks
15:46 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: right, and me and Psi-Jack are wondering why would anyone want "that level of code"
15:46 < Psi-Jack> dbedrenko: He seems to be not making any sense. much like last time he was here with the same "ssdm"
15:46 < Psi-Jack> Which somehow he equated a window-manager to a display-manager. :p
15:47 < rypervenche> Different people different strokes. I want that for my terminal. st has been an amazing terminal and gives me what I want/need with nothing more.
15:47 < Psi-Jack> suckless software, the software YOU have to patch to make suck less. LOL
15:47 < Psi-Jack> That's what I think of suckless.
15:47 < dbedrenko> haha good one
15:48 < azarus> I like suckless software, sue me
15:48 < Psi-Jack> azarus: I'll have my lawyers contact you shortly. :)
15:48 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: all the other terminal emulators were too heavy and featureful? Konsole took too much RAM? LXTerminal overheated your graphics card?
15:48 < azarus> there are no users, users == developers
15:49 < azarus> bug reports? nope. send patches.
15:49 < azarus> and i like that
15:49 < dbedrenko> They make you work to have usable software, really gotta earn it
15:49 < azarus> and that's why it's satisfying
15:49 < azarus> it's like a meal you cook yourself, it'll taste that much better
15:50 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: Again, your needs are obviously not that. You're missing their point, I suppose.
15:50 < azarus> it's home cooked vs lazy macdonalds
15:50 < azarus> (i know what I prefer)
15:51 < djph> azarus: lazy mcdonalds?
15:51 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: I am trying to suss out the point from you--of what is the advantage of such software--but you have not explained it yet
15:51 < azarus> djph: yeah, software you just install like that, from binary packages mostly
15:52 < djph> azarus: actually I was making the joke you wanted mcdonalds :)
15:52 < rypervenche> And I don't have to explain it to you. Our logics are different and that is ok. I like software that is KISS.
15:52 < azarus> dbedrenko: it's rather lean, loads quickly, and is simple (both in terms of usage and code quantity)
15:52 < djph> azarus: didn't come across all that well, I guess :)
15:52 < hans_> why does this NOT work: https://paste.fedoraproject.org/paste/X19otj68~vexGG33vBgLUQ/raw?password=qP5SpXc0UZU1CznDPvb6
15:52 < hans_> while this DOES work: https://paste.fedoraproject.org/paste/vwE6VeO8MZYZu4CJIce4gg/raw?password=YljlM0lxNhbp-HvjuztA
15:52 < hans_> it says: ./foo.sh: 6: ./foo.sh: Syntax error: word unexpected
15:52 < dbedrenko> I used to run Openbox with no DE because my laptop was bad. But the performance difference between Openbox and dwm is negligible
15:52 < smokeysea> Guys does any one know how to get chat.google get it working on IRC or CLI?
15:53 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: you don't have to, but we're having a discussion and I really wanted to hear your opinion and learn something from another kind of user
15:53 < djph> hans_: the shebang being the only difference?
15:53 < hans_> djph,
15:54 < hans_> yes* sorry about the newline
15:54 < dbedrenko> azarus: at least for surf there is no alternative, so you're right. All the other browsers have to load up webkit
15:54 < azarus> dbedrenko: surf by suckless uses webkit
15:54 < dbedrenko> oh right
15:55 < azarus> dbedrenko: also, I find suckless code much more pleasant to study and modify myself
15:55 < djph> hans_: my understanding of scripting is that without the shebang, the shell interpreter won't know how to handle it (i.e. it's undefined behavior)
15:55 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: Well, I've already expressed my main reasons. The program is super small. Does not have a lot of dependencies. It's the fastest terminal I've used to date. I love the idea behind it and how it compiles its configuration into it. And it's fun to tweak.
15:55 < hans_> well, in this case, the shebang breaks the code
15:55 < dbedrenko> azarus: perhaps because there's less code to go through, given that there are less features. Once it gets to the size of Firefox it won't be so pleasant :P
15:55 < hans_> here it only works without the shebang
15:56 < azarus> dbedrenko: certainly not. and suckless programs are small, by definition
15:56 < hans_> can someone try to replicate it?
15:56 < djph> hans_: oops, got the working / not working reversed then.  Which shell are you using ? bash?
15:56 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: I see, fair enough. Though with the super small and dependencies... I don't think that matters in 2018, with the performance of our hardware
15:56 < hans_> yes, bash
15:56 < djph> and /bin/sh is ... what?
15:56 < azarus> dbedrenko: well, a good thing about barely any deps is that the software works everywhere
15:57 < azarus> requires very little porting
15:57 < djph> I mean, is it a binary, or a symlink to another shell?
15:57 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: I like to use small netbooks, so I don't always use the most performant machines.
15:57 < hans_> file /bin/sh > dash
15:57 < hans_> err, here's the stat sh: https://paste.fedoraproject.org/paste/GzDWKDSbSz8Meq8IaO19YA/raw?password=wRhfabsW0XHrgq1TCGYl
15:57 < dbedrenko> azarus: what exotic platform does not have the more popular WMs like xmonad or awesome?
15:57 < azarus> xmonad is *hell* to port
15:57 < azarus> because of haskell, which has cyclic deps
15:58 < dbedrenko> oh. what platform has not ported it?
15:58 < azarus> alpine for example, does not have it
15:58 < azarus> because haskell is just such a huge hassle
15:58 < djph> OK, so then when you have the #!/bin/sh; it's being executed under dash instead of bash.  Obviously a difference in how both handle things.  Odd that it says "word unexpected" -- usually, it's something a bit easier to pinpoint
15:58 < azarus> awesomewm is quite a bit better in that regard, dbedrenko, it has its roots in dwm by suckless
15:58 < dbedrenko> rypervenche: if you get AwesomeWM you get bazillion more power and features than dwm and it will run as fast, and insignifcantly more RAM
15:59 < azarus> dbedrenko: awesome is like dwm++
15:59 < azarus> but many people don't need the extra functionality, and dwm works for them
15:59 < hans_> huh yeah, it works under #!/bin/bash   but not #!/bin/sh
16:00 < hans_> thanks
16:00 < azarus> also "bazillion more power", can I have one? :P
16:00 < rypervenche> dbedrenko: Aye, I tried out dwm, and I don't think I could use it. Again, I like the idea, but I've been spoiled with i3. So I'm not opposed to using heavier software.
16:00 < dbedrenko> azarus: I see. Well I don't know why anyone would use a distro that can't even port Haskell apps... that's some beaten, off-the-road linux
16:01 < rypervenche> Mostly because i3 has features that I want.
16:01 < dbedrenko> azarus: the great thing about AwesomeWM over dwm, is to modify it to your liking you don't have to write horrible C. You can write Lua :)
16:01 < azarus> dbedrenko: "Horrible C" you have insulted my very existence
16:01 < azarus> shame on you :(
16:01 < rypervenche> <3 C
16:01 < azarus> C can be very beautiful
16:02 < dbedrenko> Sorry. C is like JS, and someone should really write a book "C: The Good Parts"
16:02 < hans_> i love doing string manipulation in C!
16:02 < jeffree> hell yeah, I just got NCSA Mosaic running
16:03 < azarus> dbedrenko: The very core of this channel is primarily written in C, Linux, and you just called C "horrible"
16:03 < azarus> that clashes, doesn't it?
16:03 < azarus> why not use Redox OS or something, if C is horrible?
16:03 < djph> C is a precursor to JS ...
16:03 < dbedrenko> If we were to start a new project for a new kernel today, what language would we pick?
16:03 < djph> C
16:03 < hans_> sometimes im tempted to just do char *str=calloc(99999); and hope that it'll be enough
16:04 < azarus> C
16:04 < dbedrenko> Then I guess C is the right language for a kernel. But for app development, there are 50 better alternatives before you land on C
16:04 < djph> ... I mean, I guess you could use C++ ... but ...
16:04 < hans_> #osdev says C
16:05 < phinxy> QTile is written in Python, even better
16:05 < hans_> djph, yeah it's proven possible. https://wiki.osdev.org/Bare_Bones#Writing_a_kernel_in_C.2B.2B
16:05 < AE-35> dbedrenko: most likely those 50+ are written in C
16:05 < phinxy> Not many use it but its a excellent WM
16:05 < dbedrenko> I remember seeing a funny question on StackXEchange: "Why don't we rewrite the linux kernel in Common LISP?"
16:05 < azarus> and we have good reasons not to
16:05 < hans_> >Writing a kernel in C++ is easy. Note that not all features from the language is available. For instance, exception support requires special runtime support and so does memory allocation. To write a kernel in C++, simply adopt code above: Add an extern "C" declaration to the main method. Notice how the kernel_main function has to be declared with C linkage, as otherwise the compiler would include type information in the assembly name (name
16:05 < hans_> mangling). This complicates calling the function from our above assembly stub and we therefore use C linkage, where the symbol name is the same as the name of the function (with no additional type information).
16:06 < hans_> -- possible, but probably not a good idea
16:06 < dbedrenko> OK, OK. C is portable. That's a major reason why languages and kernels are implemented in it
16:06 < dbedrenko> But for apps: nah.
16:06 < djph> in short - you wrote it in C++ and then told C++ to behave like C.  Lot like writing for AVR chips
16:07 < azarus> dbedrenko: use what language you like, but I like my C and you cannot take it away from em
16:07 < azarus> me*
16:07 < hans_> quick, som1 take his C compiler!
16:07 < azarus> I have multiple
16:08 < hans_> my evil plans are foiled again!
16:08 < azarus> crisis averted
16:08  * Pantsu would rather have a kernel in rust
16:08 < hans_> tcc in there?
16:08 < azarus> yes of course
16:08 < azarus> it's my favorite one
16:08 < Pantsu> on risc-v hardware
16:09 < dbedrenko> C definitely has a charm to it, and a lot of history, so I respect it
16:09 < ayecee> +r is registered only?
16:09 < djph> ayecee: I ... think so?
16:09 < hans_> test message to see if i can still send em.
16:09 < azarus> dbedrenko: and it is still perfectly good for userspace
16:09 < azarus> not *just* for kernels
16:09 < hans_> ughg
16:09 < azarus> case in point -> awesomewm is written in C
16:09 < zack6849> acetakwas: yes
16:09 < hans_> curl is written in C
16:10 < hans_> curl is awesome
16:10 < dbedrenko> Yeah it can be, but there are much better choices now
16:10 < zack6849> ayecee: *** rather
16:10 < zack6849> sorry for bad ping
16:10 < huaw> Hello, I was wondering whether it is possible to have (soft)link of an executable file that itself is not executable, or vice versa. Is it's possible? I've tried simply chmodding +x and -x, but it always propagated onto the linked file.
16:10 < djph> dbedrenko: such as?
16:10 < huaw> neither hard nor soft link would work
16:11 < e36freak> why
16:11 < dbedrenko> C++/Qt, Python, Java, list goes on
16:11 < azarus> I tried AwesomeWM once, and the configuration requried an unholy mess of spaghetti code
16:11 < azarus> c++...
16:11 < azarus> blergh
16:12 < huaw> are file permissions associated directly to an i-node entry or a file? should it be the latter, hard link ought to have worked so I am guessing it actually is associated to an i-node entry
16:12 < phinxy> I wish Bash was replaced by Python
16:12 < Pantsu> azarus: awesomewm was started as a bunch of patches to dwm to make it useable
16:12 < dbedrenko> azarus: I like how you didn't say blergh at Java :D
16:12 < Pantsu> and uses lua, not c++ for configuration now
16:12 < phinxy> Is there a benchmark och Bash versus Python?
16:12 < Pantsu> lots
16:13 < azarus> dbedrenko: java is just as blergh
16:13 < Pantsu> will any of them be useful for your use case? probably not
16:13 < azarus> Pantsu: i know
16:13 < dbedrenko> what you feel for C is what I feel for C++. Awesome language
16:13 < huaw> phinxy, replacing bash with python for scripts only or to have python-powered interactive shell as well?
16:14  * Pantsu feels a lot of rage and hate for both C and C++
16:14 < rypervenche> huaw: You would not change the permissions of the symbolic link. They are always 777.
16:14 < azarus> Pantsu: rage against linux then
16:14 < huaw> you can write your scripts in python and nobody would care much as long as they have py and all the deps you'd need ^^
16:14 < huaw> rypervenche, I tried hard links as well with little success
16:14 < Pantsu> azarus: the linux kernel is pretty terrible in many ways, like the lack of seperation and security
16:14 < azarus> Pantsu: write something better
16:15 < rypervenche> huaw: What is it exactly that you're trying to do?
16:15 < azarus> (and then have it fail spectacularly)
16:15 < Pantsu> azarus: people have already done so, but they have very small use bases and few contributors, so the hardware support is lacking
16:15 < trout> Where does the linux kernel store its mapping of usb identifier <-> human name?
16:15 < azarus> Pantsu: well then use/improve that?
16:15 < Pantsu> trout: it doesn't
16:16 < trout> Pantsu: you're not wrong, but its doubtful that ##linux is the right place for this discussion
16:16 < Pantsu> trout: hwid/usb-id is used
16:16 < trout> (for linux being mostly bad code)
16:16 < huaw> rypervenche, have, say, file1 and file2 sharing the same content (not a copy), one executable and the other not
16:16 < trout> Pantsu: hrm/
16:16 < Pantsu> hwdb*
16:16 < trout> I'm looking for Linux's equivalent to sys/dev/usb/usbdevs
16:16 < AE-35> Pantsu: what's your ideal os?
16:16 < trout> * to FreeBSD's sys/dev/usb/usbdevs
16:16 < Pantsu> man 7 hwdb
16:17 < rypervenche> huaw: Can't do that. You'll need two copies of the file. You might want to look into ACLs or normal UNIX permissions to decide who has executable permissions and who doesn't.
16:17 < trout> Pantsu: I don't have a running linux box
16:17 < Pantsu> trout: can find it online too
16:17 < rypervenche> huaw: That way you would only need one copy of the file.
16:17 < trout> Pantsu: https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/hwdb.html ?
16:17 < Pantsu> yep
16:18 < trout> ugh
16:18 < trout> okay
16:18 < Pantsu> ugh what?
16:18 < Pantsu> hwdb is pretty good
16:18 < trout> Pantsu: ugh I need to go find another thing now
16:18 < trout> not "its bad"
16:19 < trout> Pantsu: am I reading right that this is in systemd https://github.com/systemd/systemd/tree/master/hwdb ?
16:19 < trout> or is there a better source?
16:19 < Pantsu> trout: http://www.linux-usb.org/usb-ids.html is also used by some tools, but it is pretty much deprecated
16:20 < Pantsu> trout: systemd maintains the hwdb currently, yes
16:20 < Pantsu> because no one else bothered to do so
16:21 < Pantsu> you can use it without having systemd on the machine
16:21 < trout> Pantsu: sure. I just need to grep for something )
16:21 < RebelCoder> Guys, please help. I have this linux board and have ADBed into it. It is an obscure linux image on it (build with Yacto I think) and it is very minimal. I am trying to add few .sh files to start at boot but this image is missing  update-rc.d and systemctl.
16:21 < Pantsu> usually you use a compiled version of the db
16:21 < RebelCoder> Any way to go around it  somehow ?
16:22 < trout> Pantsu: I don't want the compiled version
16:22 < trout> just want to confirm that 0x1022 is AMD :)
16:22 < Pantsu> usually you do, unless you are doing a one time lookup
16:22 < huaw> rypervenche, it is a single-user system so I am not looking into restricting executable rights for another user and/or group; I've got a git directory with the scripts in question; these scripts are symlinked to where ever I need them, but I don't want to make them executable in the git directory alone
16:23 < trout> hrm pci.ids claims 1022 is 1022  Shinko Shoji Co., Ltd
16:23 < huaw> (there are usually pretty small scripts, so there is no need to keep 'stable' versions of them elsewhere)
16:23 < huaw> *they
16:23 < trout> system claims that pci.ids claims its AMD hwdb/pci.ids 4094:1022  Advanced Micro Devices, Inc. [AMD]
16:24 < Pantsu> pci and usb ids doesn't always match, and the db is not authorative
16:24 < Pantsu> the authorative db is not publicly available
16:24 < anubisra> Hi, i want to develop an app for Linux (esp. Arch) could someone pls point me in the direction of some resources (Python centric)
16:24 < anubisra> thanks
16:24 < trout> Pantsu: oh, wait, I'm a moron
16:24 < trout> Pantsu: I knew that usb != pci
16:24 < rypervenche> huaw: With the correct permissions, they wouldn't be executable in your git repo's directory, except by root, if that's how you set it.
16:24 < trout> I just can't read
16:24 < azarus> anubisra: 1. write a python program 2. package it for arch
16:24 < azarus> 3. profit?
16:25 < anubisra> No, libre
16:25 < Pantsu> azarus: use setuptools, ???, profit
16:25 < Pantsu> anubisra: ^
16:25 < azarus> anubisra: libre...?
16:25 < anubisra> Free
16:25 < azarus> yes, you can make your program free
16:25 < anubisra> NOt as in opensource
16:25 < azarus> no magic behind that
16:25 < Pantsu> anubisra: https://packaging.python.org/tutorials/packaging-projects/
16:25 < Pantsu> anubisra: you want it to be freeware?
16:26 < dgurney> so? I'm pretty sure all tools required for creating python are libre
16:26 < Pantsu> that is horrible, but it is not a problem either
16:26 < anubisra> yes, publish to aur
16:26 < azarus> anubisra: arch is opensource, not free, btw
16:26 < Pantsu> arch tools are all gpl
16:26 < Pantsu> pretty much
16:26 < azarus> yeah, pretty much
16:26 < Pantsu> not that it matters in this case
16:26 < azarus> but they don't really care about being libre, and that's OK
16:26 < djph> free (libre) means the software isn't imposing undue restrictions on your ability to do stuff with it.
16:27  * Pantsu can't really see what anubisras issue is, except being totally confused about something
16:27 < djph> or .. something, IDK
16:27 < djph> as opposed to free (gratis), which means "no cost"
16:27 < azarus> ... and he's gone
16:28 < djph> no surprises there
16:28 < Pantsu> maybe he was confused about the fact that you can make profits off free software too
16:28 < rypervenche> huaw: Or put your git repo in a different location where the files can have the correct ownership and permission and can't be read by unwanted users.
16:28 < djph> yeah, it's not exactly groundbreaking to provide free(libre) software and charge for something associated.
16:28 < ayecee> or saw the preacher starting on his sermon and got out before the choir chimed in
16:31 < repys> I need to use rsync server with a shared directory. which one is the best choise with rsync server between SMB, AFP and NFS?
16:32 < ananke> repys: you want to serve via rsync something that's already shared via smb/afp/nfs?
16:32 < ananke> either way, not sure what you define as 'best'. you provide no criteria for that
16:33 < repys> I have to backup some data using rsync server and that backup directosy has to be shared
16:33 < repys> I would like to know which one is the best with rsync server
16:33 < ananke> repys: define 'best'
16:33 < post-factum>  /usr/bin/rsync is the best rsync server if you know what i mean…
16:34 < dunpeal> Hi. I'm having a weird issue with my keyboard on a new workstation. I use screen, and it used to be that when I hit ^a and then immediately a number, I'd get to the particular window of that number. Now, I have to release Ctrl before I hit the number for hte action to happen.
16:34 < dunpeal> Any idea what sort of configuration that is?
16:34 < repys> I have to share the directory in the rsync server.. which one is the best (fastest and most reliable) between the 3 above?
16:34 < repys> :)
16:35 < huaw> rypervenche, solved it, thank you for your assistance :)
16:36 < post-factum> repys: what are the clients of that shared folder?
16:37 < hans_> post-factum, i usually use the openbsd guys's server for rsync
16:37 < repys> mac os, linux
16:37 < post-factum> repys: smb then
16:37 < hans_> sure, it's more cpu hungry and slower tho
16:37 < hans_> (that encryption n stuff which rsync server doesn't do)
16:37 < repys> smb better than nfs or afp?
16:38 < post-factum> repys: it is a matter of interoperability, actually
16:38 < repys> can smb + rsync do encryption?
16:38 < repys> all right but is smb reliable like NFS ?
16:38 < repys> I really need that :)
16:38 < post-factum> define "reliable"…
16:39 < hans_> kitteh is cute.
16:39 < ananke> repys: you keep mixing concepts. and smb has nothing to do with rsync, consequently there's no such thing as 'can smb + rsync do encryption?'
16:40 < djph> wait, these are linux and mac hosts?  why not just ssh as part of rsync and call it a day?
16:40 < ananke> repys: you'd be better off explaining what your actual goal is, not what you think would be the right tool
16:43 < trout> Pantsu: thanks for the help!
16:52 < repys> the goal is to backup data from laptops (mac, linux) to rsync. and rsync has to have a shared directory where to backup data to :)
16:52 < repys> what's the best approach to achieve this?
16:53 < hans_> repys, idk about macs, but with linux, openssh+rsync works great
16:54 < hans_> as a bonus, most distros come with openssh built-in, and installs rsync with some simple package manager command (like `apt install rsync` in debian/ubuntu-based distros)
16:55 < hans_> actually i know some macs come with rsync too. idk if openssh does tho.
16:58 < djph> repys: rsync [options] /source/path/ backup-user@backup-host:/path/to/backup/dir/currenthost/
16:59 < twainwek> echo test
16:59 < djph> in the event you want to use ssh keys add "-e 'ssh -i /path/to/key'"
17:05 < ice9> i need OCR tool (German language)
17:06 < vimal2012> how to save http response header and response body in separate files WITH A SINGLE REQUEST? I know how to get response header alone (with curl, wget, elinks etc.), but I have to make 2 requests (one for header, one for body).
17:06 < bitSt0rm> ice9, tesseract
17:07 < vimal2012> if some tool sends response body to stdout and response header to stderr, it will be easy.
17:08 < hans_> vimal2012, there's probably some better way, but curl url -v >stdout 2>stderr
17:08 < hans_> -v will print more than just the headers, but it will also print the headers
17:08 < hans_> and the headers will be printed to stderr, the response body will be printed to stdout
17:08 < ice9> bitSt0rm, it works on images or directly from scanner?
17:15 < JimmyNeutron> When I run      lsof | grep 'deleted'      I see a lot of files as "deleted".  What cause this "deleted" to appear?  I tried adding a file, deleting it, and then running the lsof command again, but I don't see the file I just deleted in the lsof output.
17:16 < Dan39> JimmyNeutron: if the file is still open and it gets deleted
17:16 < JimmyNeutron> Dan39: Let me try that, vim <file> and then delete it.  Thanks!
17:17 < Dan39> JimmyNeutron: not sure vim is going to hold the file open though
17:17 < JimmyNeutron> Dan39: Yeah, vim didn't.  Thanks for that help!  At least I know what causes that state now.
17:18 < Dan39> JimmyNeutron: vim will create a .filename.swp file that it keeps open
17:19 < JimmyNeutron> Dan39: Yeap...saw that.
17:19 < JimmyNeutron> trying to find another program that I can similute that delete state
17:20 < Dan39> JimmyNeutron: you can try like `sleep 1d | tee test.file`
17:20 < JimmyNeutron> Dan39: Thanks!  Let me try that out after my other test.
17:21 < Dan39> JimmyNeutron: it works, i already tried it
17:23 < Jellyg00se> Hi, I'm trying to rsync a repository from a URL locally, but I can't seem to figure the syntax out, or I'm doing something wrong.  I'm trying: rsync -avz /home/repos/suse rsync://anorien.csc.warwick.ac.uk/download.opensuse.org/ thanks
17:23 < lupine> the source goes first
17:23 < JimmyNeutron> Dan39: Thanks!  It works like you stated.
17:23 < screwsss> using linux in a virtual machine. its not netecting my wireless adapter card
17:24 < screwsss> tried a couple things no luck
17:24 < screwsss> funly enough it connects to my regular ethernet adapter just fine
17:25 < Jellyg00se> lupine, I did try it the other way around, I keep getting connection refused.  Do I need to set the source to deeper nested folder instead?  Or maybe there's some credentials that I've no idea how to set... there isn't much info on this :)
17:32 < lupine> Jellyg00se: connection refused tells you the source isn't accepting connections
17:33 < lupine> to find our why, you'd need to discuss it with warwick uni. perhaps their mirror doesn't permit rsync while some others do?
17:34 < Jellyg00se> lupine, I've tried a multiple servers listed here: https://mirrors.opensuse.org/ I guess I'm to presume that these aren't publically available? :/  That doesn't seem right to me though
17:37 < lupine> Jellyg00se: this wfm: rsync -avzP rsync://rsync.opensuse.org/opensuse-full/ opensuse
17:37 < lupine> quite what any other mirror offers or does not offer is up to them
17:38 < Jellyg00se> lupine, ah thanks a lot for your help!
17:39 < screwsss> wow vm ware is incompatible with wifi
17:39 < screwsss> who wouldve thought
17:45 < djph> most virtualization doesn't work so hot with the host on wifi
17:49 < triceratux> http://www.concertocloud.com/blog/concerto-cloud/2018/04/16/are-you-ready-for-june-30th%27s-pci-deadline-say-hello-to-tls-v-1.2
17:52 < djph> good god, I thought that forced update would never come
17:54 < nothos> Still time for another exemption :D
17:57  * djph dies a little more inside
17:57  * Armand kills djph a little more...
17:59 < nothos> djph So I shouldn't mention that there's still thousands of public facing servers running Debian Wheezy or lower or RHEL 5 or lower? :D
18:00 < djph> nothos: oh, I know that.  I'm just tired of hearing the other side complain that our servers tell their dinosaurs to get lost.
18:30 < toothe> Is there a free version of quickbooks?
18:30 < toothe> for Linux?
18:31 < toothe> Let me rephrase that - software that does the same functionality.
18:32 < ayecee> gnucash is probably the closest
18:32 < ayecee> and it's not all that close
18:33 < Sonolin> gnucash is great
18:33 < Sonolin> just a little fugly
18:35 < Pantsu> less ugly now
18:35 < Sonolin> eh
18:35 < Sonolin> wait, did they switch away from GTK?
18:36 < Sonolin> because everybody knows *all* gtk apps are inherently fugly
18:36 < Pantsu> bd
18:36 < Pantsu> bs
18:40 < armin> Sonolin: rude
18:40 < Sonolin> nou
18:40 < Sonolin> aesthetics are subjective
18:40 < Sonolin> :%s/everybody/most sane people/g
18:41 < Sonolin> well option is meaningless, oh well ...
18:41 < screwsss> so vm ware sucks
18:41 < screwsss> cant use wifi on linux
18:43 < revel> Are those two things related...?
18:43 < hexnewbie> screwsss: What? I mean, I'm not fan of VMWare (being proprietary and all, and being used to QEMU/KVM), but how is your hypervisor related to your wireless kernel stack?
18:45 < dgurney> vmware isn't actually a bad hypervisor at all
18:46 < hexnewbie> And even if it was bad, it wouldn't break your wifi on Linux.
18:46 < revel> I don't think it's that great either.
18:47 < revel> hexnewbie: Well, who knows, it has its own kernel modules, doesn't it?
18:47 < dgurney> it does, but why would they break wifi
18:47 < Sonolin> revel might want to look at other warnings other than software...
18:47 < revel> What?
18:48 < screwsss> hexnewbie: im no expert but apparently vm ware workstation provides no support for wireless cards
18:48 < hexnewbie> revel: In theory, in 2018 software is so complex and interconnected that anything can break anything without kernel modules. But still, I'm a doubter
18:48 < revel> My file browser doesn't support wireless cards :o
18:48 < revel> My shell doesn't support wireless cards :o
18:48 < hexnewbie> ssh doesn't support wireless cards, and it's a networking tool!
18:48 < Sonolin> wut?
18:49 < triceratux> screwsss: hrm looks like this is a known aspect of vmware https://www.quora.com/Ive-installed-Kali-Linux-on-VMware-but-the-wifi-is-not-working-Why-is-that-so time to go with qemu-kvm
18:49 < Sonolin> +1 for kvm (best hypervisor)
18:49 < Sonolin> although a bit unwieldly
18:49 < hexnewbie> triceratux: I can't think of a hypervisor that doesn't have that issue
18:49 < nrg> i like virtual box fairly well
18:49 < revel> Oh, for exposing the interface directly or something?
18:50 < balance> hi
18:51 < hexnewbie> Mention of Kali makes me I presume someone wants to run aircrack, so needs wlan in monitor mode. For that one needs USB passthrough, PCI passthrough, or a hypothetical  non-existent way to pass through the wireless feature without passing the wireless card.
18:51 < CoderInfinity> I like virtual box too.  For ease of use.  I have tried KVM but not as a hypervisor.
18:51 < Sonolin> hexnewbie you should be able to enable PCI passthrough (assuming your board supports it) in KVM
18:52 < Sonolin> then use USB ethernet
18:52 < Sonolin> at the least...
18:52 < dgurney> there's no space in VirtualBox
18:52 < Sonolin> *or* just proper ethernet PCI card
18:53 < screwsss> triceratux: yep spot on. i learned this the long and hard way god dammit
18:53 < balance> Is there some kind of blacklist of processes? Like you find it often for urls? e.g. a "chat application blacklist" or "browser application blacklist" or whatever?
18:53 < screwsss> didnt even enter my mind that it wouldnt be supported
18:53 < screwsss> vmware should come with a warning
18:53 < revel> Or run the software directly on bare metal.
18:57 < nothos> screwsss I'd disagree
18:58 < nothos> It's not the hypervisor's job to account for people blindly trying to do stuff that if you take a few seconds to think about it won't be possible
19:00 < Logitech> hello
19:01 < nothos> (that's before we factor in the rep of kali of it being installed by folks who just wanna blindly be 1337 hax0rz without actually understanding what the tools and their low level functions/purposes)
19:03 < Logitech> I have a laptop provided to me from my company.  I want to be able to also use it for my personal needs (pay bills online, youtube, school work, emails, etc).  Nothing major or gaming anything like that.  But the company records everything in Windows that it does.  I don't wanna mess with installing a dual OS.  Is there an OS I can run solely from a USB drive?  Just plug it in, run from USB,
19:03 < Logitech> and then obviously save all my work on that USB.  I don't want it to run as a fresh install each time, it needs to save what I'm doing each session.  Any suggestions?  The laptop's specs are like i5 and 8gb ram.
19:04 < nothos> Logitech Pretty much any linux will let you do this
19:04 < Alexander-47u> hey guys
19:04 < Alexander-47u> i got a bootstrap template
19:04 < Alexander-47u> want to edit it, any good editor?
19:04 < Alexander-47u> total noob here when it comes to web app dev
19:04 < Alexander-47u> just got my ass roasted trying to use angular for a full day
19:04 < djph> Logitech: sounds like you want "not the company's laptop"
19:05 < nothos> Logitech The persistence is a little bit harder, but in windows you can use http://www.linuxliveusb.com/
19:05 < nothos> Which will flash a linux ISO to USB an you can tell it to create a persistent partition
19:05 < nothos> However, if the laptop is that locked down it's possible/likely they've restricted the bios to prevent booting from USB
19:05 < Logitech> so any distro would work Nothos?
19:05 < screwsss> ill bbl guys
19:06 < Logitech> no, it can run from USB.  I ran puppy a few times,  but I didn't like it
19:06 < nothos> Logitech More or less, long as it has a live environment
19:06 < RebelCoder> Guys, how can I add my .sh script to run on boot, if update-rc.d AND systemctl are missing from my linux mini-distro ?
19:06 < Logitech> too outdated
19:06 < screwsss> linux seems to have a lot of potential
19:06 < nothos> You'll want a smaller, lighter linux for if you wanna run it on USB
19:06 < nothos> Coz even on 3 performance isn't the best
19:06 < Logitech> what distro do you suggest?
19:06 < nothos> My go to 'light' distro is xubuntu, but it's pretty much a preference thing
19:06 < revel> RebelCoder: What distro is it? It may just not have systemd.
19:06 < Logitech> how about lubuntu?
19:07 < Logitech> I wonder if you can run that in this fashion
19:07 < nothos> Also a possibility
19:07 < RebelCoder> revel, thanks! it is a custom built from scratch for an embedded system.
19:07 < nothos> Logitech You definitely can
19:07 < revel> ("mini" sort of logically implies "not systemd", actually :D)
19:07 < RebelCoder> I have no idea....
19:07 < CoderInfinity> dsl is small
19:07 < logically> revel, :>
19:07 < nothos> revel Oh please no, let's not start this again :D
19:07 < nothos> CoderInfinity it also hasn't been updated since 2012
19:07 < jim> RebelCoder, you got a file /etc/init.d/rc.local or /etc/rc.local?
19:07 < revel> nothos: He said "embedded system", are you aware of any that have systemd?
19:08 < revel> Also, yeah, rc.local probably.
19:08 < RebelCoder> revel, those files do not exist
19:08 < CoderInfinity> nothos: oh I wasn't aware
19:08 < Logitech> what is the term used to describe the OS install I'm looking for?  I'm not looking to install from a USB, I'm looking to run the OS solely on the USB.  Is that called "Portable"?
19:08 < nothos> revel Not that I'm aware of, but I'm basically not a zealot when it comes to init systems, they all have pros and cons in my mind
19:09 < jim> does that machine have net right now?
19:09 < revel> RebelCoder: Well, if it's really custom, then there may not be anything for that. Not sure, poke around and find some directory with a bunch of scripts in /etc, maybe.
19:09 < nothos> Was more worried about the systemd argument going off again :D
19:09 < Sonolin> revel most have systemd
19:09 < Sonolin> without-systemd.org
19:09 < dgurney> nothos, that's almost too reasonable to belong to a linux channel :p
19:09 < revel> nothos: I'm just saying that "if it doesn't have systemctl and it's supposed to be a small system, then it probably doesn't have systemd" and that "systemd is a bit bloaty for embedded devices"
19:10 < revel> Sonolin: Most embedded devices...?
19:10 < RebelCoder> revel, that is the problem :( I tried few things, adding my ,sh file to /etc/init.d/, still nothinh
19:10 < RebelCoder> Damn !
19:10 < Logitech> what is the term used to describe the OS install I'm looking for?  I'm not looking to install from a USB, I'm looking to run the OS solely on the USB.  Is that called "Portable"?
19:10 < Sonolin> revel idk that was mostly heresay
19:10 < Sonolin> meant "most embedded OSes", I'm sure if its coded in assembly it doesn't have systemd...
19:10 < Sonolin> ...at least one would hope...
19:11 < revel> I'm not aware of any that have it.
19:11 < jim> you can put the file there, is it executable?
19:12 < triceratux> Logitech: live & persistent are the most accurate modern terms
19:12 < nothos> revel Aaaah, I think we've got crossed messages, I thought you were referring to the wuqestions logitech had about a light linux for USB :D
19:12 < nothos> Didn't see the embedded conversation
19:12 < revel> No, no.
19:13 < revel> That'd be fine with systemd, probably.
19:13 < nothos> Thought you were just slapping the init system gauntlet down, apologies
19:13 < jim> it needs to take an argument, a string... if it's start, you run the rest of the script, if it's stop, you shut it down
19:15 < hans_> Logitech, maybe a "live system" ?
19:15 < Sonolin> people, Linux is about choice, let's not repeat history please
19:16 < hans_> what history?
19:16 < Sonolin> vi vi vi is our god
19:16 < sauvin> Yours, maybe. Mine is Geany.
19:16 < Sonolin> vim vim vim doesn't look quite as pleasing, unfortunately
19:16 < Sonolin> neither does "spacemacs spacemacs spacemacs"
19:16 < nothos> alias nano=vim
19:16 < nothos> standard
19:17 < Sonolin> haha, so good
19:17 < hans_> the "vi vs emacs" thing?
19:17 < Sonolin> 🍪
19:17 < Sonolin> hans_ no, that's silly, emacs is clearly more than an editor
19:17 < revel> zsh: command not found: vim
19:18 < hans_> alias wget='man curl'
19:18 < revel> lol
19:18 < AE-35> Sonolin: so is vim
19:18 < Sonolin> eh, debatable
19:18 < screwsss> wow linux runs great off a live usb on my i7 pc
19:18 < screwsss> about 1000x faster than in vm ware
19:18 < Sonolin> as long as you don't compile with any options of course...
19:18 < fattredd> Try loading it all into ram
19:18 < Sonolin> screwsss welcome to the dark side
19:19 < screwsss> this linux OS looks like it could really perform
19:19 < hans_> did you install LXDE?
19:19 < djph> "looks"? "could"?
19:19 < fattredd> Which distro?
19:19 < djph> bah, the top 50 (100?) supercomputers all run *nix
19:20 < hans_> djph, what, *nix other than linux?
19:20 < djph> IIRC, some run "proper(tm)" UNIX
19:21 < hans_> ?? is that even a thing anymore?
19:22 < revel> djph: Top 500 all use Linux (custom variations, of course), actually.
19:22 < Sonolin> screwsss use ffmpeg to re-encode video, easy test
19:23 < Sonolin> :s/easy/"easy"/
19:23 < Sonolin> YMMV
19:23 < revel> Last two AIX machines dropped off the top 500 last November, apparently.
19:24 < Sonolin> revel interesting, didn't know IBM still was a thing
19:24 < djph> revel: I figured it was more than 100, but I'd rather be safe :)
19:24 < hans_> turns out that the highest authority of linux development is like "i like speed. i like micro-optimizations.", while the *BSD guys are more like "i like clean, readable code", and "clean readable code" is often incompatible with micro-optimizations
19:25 < djph> "proper(tm)" UNIX? oh yeah, all the big boys still have some variant of it for their machines that cost a fortune.  It's still very much "when you need it to be bulletproof"
19:25 < ayecee> "when you need to justify it to the shareholders"
19:25 < revel> Oh, wait, I read what you said as "there's UNIX™ in the top 50"
19:26 < hans_> linux is more optimized and faster than most of the alternatives, i guess that's why the supercomp guys all go to linux
19:26 < Sonolin> yes hans_ , minus the politics of #bsd
19:26 < djph> ayecee: well, that too.
19:26 < Sonolin> I prefer BSD code & license, but enjoy the practical applications of Linux
19:27 < djph> revel: in either event, if I said top 500 I'd still have been wrong :)
19:27 < ayecee> "you paid _how much_ for something my son downloaded for free?"
19:30 < Sonolin> ayecee you mean "donated", right?
19:31 < Sonolin> free/libre != free as in beer
19:31 < ayecee> uh, no?
19:31 < ayecee> talking about justifying large expenses to shareholders.
19:31 < Sonolin> oh nm
19:31 < Sonolin> wasn't paying attention
19:31 < ayecee> i can tell
19:31 < Sonolin> oh shush
19:33 < hexnewbie> Attention is overrated. I can text while I'm a watching a movie in the theatre. While driving the drone remotely. While fixing the unscheduled maintenance I just caused by sending poweroff to 10 servers accidentally.
19:34 < djph> hexnewbie: you're the reason people shoot up movie theatres.
19:34 < compdoc> you can do those thing, but its dangerous to do do
19:35 < compdoc> *to do so
19:35 < nothos> djph Or the British approach: Stern tutting
19:35 < ayecee> i too like to live dangerously
19:35 < BluesKaj> remind me to stay off the road when you're driving
19:35 < jnewt> i'm trying to track down why cutecom doesn't see my serial port (usb -> serial converter).   i see it in lsusb (BUS 007 Device 003 ID 0403:6001).   I assume cutecom loods in /dev, and I see a ttyUSB0, which i assume is the one (although I don't know how lsusb ties to /dev or how to see it).  permissions on ttyUSB0 are crw-rw---- 1 root dialout
19:35 < ayecee> stay off the road while i'm driving
19:36 < ayecee> less traffic that way
19:36 < Sonolin> hexnewbie yup its all about window of opportunity
19:36 < jnewt> are my permissions ok?   I tried running cutecom as root.   do i need x permissions on the device in /dev?
19:36 < Sonolin> in other words, use Gentoo/other source-based distro :P
19:37 < ayecee> jnewt: those look like normal permissions
19:37 < djph> jnewt: are you part of teh dialout group?
19:37 < jnewt> djph: yes I am
19:37 < BluesKaj> well, lucky for me I don't drive a lot anymore
19:37 < JimmyNeutron> Is there a way to give a directory ownership of <me>:<no group at all>?
19:37 < ayecee> JimmyNeutron: no
19:38 < djph> JimmyNeutron: ^
19:38 < jnewt> I think maybe something is up with my usb system as a whole.   I can't see my scanner either.
19:38 < jnewt> I mean I can't use it.
19:38 < JimmyNeutron> ayecee: What about group nobody?
19:38 < ayecee> still a group
19:38 < JimmyNeutron> would that block other groups?
19:38 < ayecee> also, nobody shouldn't own files
19:39 < JimmyNeutron> besides doing 700
19:39 < djph> ##linux, a hive of pedantry :)
19:39 < JimmyNeutron> ayecee: ok..thanks!
19:39 < ayecee> because nobody is supposed to be a user/group that doesn't own files
19:39 < djph> JimmyNeutron: technically, the only *GROUP* that matters is the "owning group".  If a user is not the owner, nor part of the owning group, then they immediately fall into "others"
19:40 < nekoseam> good morning ##linux
19:40 < nekoseam> did you guys sleep well?
19:40 < ayecee> no it isn't
19:40 < nothos> ayecee Tell that to cPanel's apache implementation :D
19:40 < nekoseam> ayecee: Oh yes it is
19:40 < nekoseam> if it's not morning for you your clock is wrong ;)
19:40 < ayecee> can't tell those guys anything
19:40 < djph> so, a directory with 750 permissions and the owner "jimmy:jimmy" will only open for the user 'jimmy', or a user who is part of the group 'jimmy'
19:40 < JimmyNeutron> ok...guess i'll set permisison to 700 then
19:41 < JimmyNeutron> thanks!
19:42 < jnewt> just tried adding execute permissions to /dev/ttyUSB0, no change.
19:42 < ayecee> no, i wouldn't think there would be
19:43 < jnewt> ayecee, i'm just guessing here.   I have no idea why this stopped working.   I booted into windows to verify the hardware all worked because I have absolutely no idea.  I'm just trying random things that I know how to do now.
19:43 < ayecee> how are you testing it, what happens when you try, and what should happen instead
19:44 < jnewt> ayecee: I should open cutecom, and /dev/ttyUSB0 should be listed in the port selection dropdown.  I open cutecom and there is nothing listed in the dropdown.
19:45 < ayecee> has this worked in the past?
19:45 < ayecee> in cutecom
19:46 < jnewt> ayecee: yes, but I haven't used it in a while.   For a while I think I had to run cutecom as root, but I think changing the device to group dialout and adding myself to the dialout group fixed that problem and it worked fine.
19:47 < ayecee> perhaps it needs to be configured to look for such devices files, and not the normal ttyS* that some programs expect
19:49 < jnewt> ayecee: I haven't run across any mentions of any configurations that are outside of the program itself.
19:50 < ayecee> i think i had to do something like that with minicom
19:50 < ayecee> i think i created a symlink, rather
19:51 < strixdio> I have a partition I'd like to use for swap. I am pretty sure I left this partition empty, but I'm not 100% sure if it's in use by zfs or has data on it.
19:52 < strixdio> /dev/sda5. mount | grep sda5 is empty. When I try to mount it: "mount: /mnt/disk: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/sda5, missing codepage or helper program, or other error."
19:53 < strixdio> Does it seem safe to assume it has nothing?
19:53 < strixdio> or am I missing something?
19:54 < ayecee> see what's on it, file -s /dev/sda5
19:54 < strixdio> /dev/sda5: data
19:54 < ayecee> could be an encrypted volume
19:54 < strixdio> I didn't do that ;)
19:57 < strixdio> it doesn't seem to be a partition used by an OS either.
19:57 < djph> you using MBR with extended / logical partitions at all?
19:57 < strixdio> is there much difference between using a partition vs a file for swap?
19:58 < ayecee> in terms of performance, no
19:58 < strixdio> djph: I don't think so
19:58 < ayecee> not on modern hardware anyhow
19:58 < strixdio> just says it's a "linux filesystem"
19:58 < chris11> is there any way to view all the webpage assests loaded recently
19:59 < djph> history?
19:59 < chris11> will that show what the page has loaded? eg if a page directly links to a video I want to see the link to that video.
20:05 < prussian> strixdio: some filesystems like btrfs don't work with swapfiles. that's about it
20:06 < eb0t> strixdio why not just take a look in all your fstabs for your os's you have installed ..if none of them are using the partition then just zap it.
20:06 < strixdio> thanks.
20:06 < strixdio> Yeah, I did that :)
20:06 < strixdio> I just wanted to double-check that I didn't forget something.
20:06 < strixdio> I now have a 25G swap file LOL
20:06 < eb0t> ha ha
20:06 < paulcarroty> LOL
20:07 < strixdio> I want to rule out some lockups, and I feel like that is a definitive way to do so.
20:07 < paulcarroty> I delete my swap partition after buying SSD
20:07 < strixdio> I should have opted for the 64GB ram when building my system years ago.
20:08 < strixdio> Why?
20:08 < strixdio> paulcarroty: ^
20:08 < paulcarroty> strixdio, swap just slow down your OS.
20:09 < strixdio> I don't do much on my host.
20:09 < strixdio> it's a headless host for gpu passthrough VMs
20:10 < strixdio> and it seems to lock up if I use my 2nd VM/GPU, but leave it idle for a long time. Could be a ram issue, being that I only have 32GB and that's shared with ZFS too.
20:11 < paulcarroty> gaming?
20:11 < strixdio> yeah
20:12 < strixdio> ... among other things
20:13 < paulcarroty> well, my 2 machines works good with 8GB and disabled swap. Each has a free slot.
20:14 < strixdio> well, do you run ZFS also?
20:14 < strixdio> I have over 12TB raw, which hypothetically needs over 12GB ram. ZFS is very ram hungry.
20:15 < paulcarroty> nope, ext4. reliable as a brick.
20:16 < strixdio> nice.
20:17 < strixdio> I have a few things I need to check why it locks- swap is one, hugepages is the second. Beyond that, maybe a crappy windows setting, maybe my 760 is too old for *all* of this tech?
20:17  * strixdio shrugs
20:19 < paulcarroty> strixdio,  don't see any real profits from ZFS on desktop. Btrfs - maybe, I'm on SUSE - the homefront of btrfs, and they written a tons of stuff - rollbacks, snapshots, atomically updates etc.
20:20 < strixdio> i've heard some not-so-great things about btrfs
20:20 < strixdio> and it's not a desktop, it's more a server than anything else.
20:21 < strixdio> I use it for raid, snapshots (files and VMs, and now for iscsi targets too)
20:24 < cayhan> hey guys
20:24 < cayhan> i need help with something
20:24 < cayhan> you know how android kernel sets performance as the boot up governor
20:24 < cayhan> and switches to interactive after?
20:24 < cayhan> yeah, i tried setting it to something else but it just doesn't find it
20:25 < cayhan> do i need to add it to some list or something
20:25 < cayhan> or is there another way to it
20:25 < cayhan> i really can't use init.d, it's a public project
20:26  * strixdio waves
20:26 < paulcarroty> strixdio, I heard btrfs has a built-in RAID.
20:34 < brutser> how can i prevent in MATE desktop to show all /dev/loopX devices under Devices, even when not mounted?
20:34 < brutser> they are of no use to me there and just confuse
20:36 < TheWild> hello
20:38 < phogg> brutser: it has nothing to do with MATE, it's a udev rule that controls that
20:38 < TheWild> I have two text files, A and B. Who knows an easy way to check that B contains every line of A?
20:38 < phogg> TheWild: use comm
20:39 < TheWild> I did:  diff A B | grep -v '^>'
20:39 < brutser> phogg: but they dont show with gnome
20:39 < phogg> TheWild: comm -3 <(sort A) <(sort B) # if there is any output then the there were some different lines
20:40 < phogg> TheWild: diff doesn't exactly tell you the right thing. It will give you *any differences*, not tell you if some lines are missing. Diff cares about the order of lines, but you probably do not.
20:40 < phogg> brutser: GNOME is not a file browsing tool. What do you mean "Show with GNOME?" How are you seeing them?
20:40 < TheWild> the lines in files are probably sorted, but I can't say for sure
20:41 < phogg> TheWild: that's why in the comm case we sort them first, just to be sure
20:41 < TheWild> yikes, comm takes some time
20:41 < phogg> TheWild: sort takes some time, comm is fast
20:41 < phogg> TheWild: if you want to skip sorting you can, but the results may not be accurate since it becomes sensitive to order again
20:41 < TheWild> yeah, that's probably sort
20:42 < TheWild> A has 530791 lines, B has them 759782
20:42 < phogg> so there are definitely differences
20:42 < phogg> the comm output will be two columns. If you only care about lines from B you should also add -1 to suppress lines from A which are not in B (if any)
20:42 < phogg> if there aren't any then the switch does nothign
20:42 < phogg> s/ign/ing/
20:42 < TheWild> it should be that B is a superset of A
20:43 < brutser> phogg: i create a livecd centos7 with either mate or gnome, in mate those show, with gnome they dont, perhaps caja is causing it with mate?
20:43 < brutser> i can make rules i guess for udev
20:43 < phogg> brutser: You should open a terminal and ls /dev/loop*
20:43 < TheWild> comm -13 then?
20:43 < phogg> TheWild: yes
20:43 < phogg> brutser: that way you are comparing applies to apples on both installations.
20:44 < phogg> brutser: it very well may be that the GNOME file manager is doing something clever and lying about what's there.
20:44 < brutser> yea true
20:44 < phogg> brutser: it's also possible that installing GNOME packages has also installed additional udev .rules files which account for the difference.
20:44 < brutser> ill create some udev rules to hide them in my mate config
20:45 < phogg> brutser: I'd look in the GNOME install's /etc/udev/rules.d/ first and see if some exist
20:45 < brutser> yes doing now
20:46 < brutser> no rules
20:46 < brutser> but ok, maybe some other way like you said
20:49 < TheWild> phogg: meh, I messed up a bit. if I'm going to check that A is a subset of B, then I think I should run comm -23 instead.
20:49 < TheWild> sort takes way too much time.    sort a > a.sorted; sort b > b.sorted
20:50 < phogg> TheWild: pre-sorting is definitely recommended
20:52 < TheWild> "comm -23" version produced no output. Yay, and I even learned a new command!
20:52 < TheWild> Thank you very much phogg
20:53 < phogg> TheWild: you're welcome. comm is one of the lesser-known tools, which is a shame because it's everywhere and very handy
20:54 < phogg> TheWild: try looking at join some time, then imaging it's 1980 and you're dealing with flat file databases
20:55 < Sonolin> yay
20:56 < bls> hehe, I've written "relational databases" using join, paste, sort, nl, etc as a learning experience
20:58 < TheWild> phogg: the company I'm working for still has to deal with some old DOS systems using DBF files as databases. But we're neither writing nor practically use them - we're migrating data away from them.
20:58 < phogg> bls: I think a lot of people must do that. It's fun in that it gives you an appreciation for real RDBMSs
20:59 < TheWild> DBF was flat. But DBF was so flat that makes me wonder why those systems didn't use plain, fixed-width line text files instead.
21:00 < phogg> TheWild: fixed width is evil
21:00 < phogg> structured is infinitely easier to work with at the cost of a little speed
21:06 < gronke> Hi, I wanted to install Qiime 2 on my Centos 7 system (https://docs.qiime2.org/2018.4/install/native/), it said I needed to install Miniconda first to get a conda prompt to install, and I installed that via the shell file here (https://conda.io/miniconda.html) and yet after running the shell script I cannot type "conda" to launch it. Where did I go wrong? Thanks.
21:08 < phogg> gronke: it probably installed somewhere not in PATH
21:08 < phogg> gronke: looks like the default install location is $HOME/miniconda3
21:08 < gronke> phogg, for the question "Do you wish the installer to prepend the Miniconda2 install location to PATH in your /root/.bashrc ? [yes|no]" I answered yes.
21:09 < gronke> And then it says: "Appending source /root/miniconda2/bin/activate to /root/.bashrc"
21:09 < phogg> gronke: but you didn't re-source it, and you should also not install to $HOME anyway
21:09 < gronke> I was unsure of where to install, and it said "If you are unsure, just use the defaults," so I trusted them,
21:10 < phogg> gronke: you should re-run the installer with -p /usr/local/miniconda/ and after install completes manually create a symlink to it and place that symlink in /usr/local/bin
21:10 < nothos> Can someone tell me if I'm being stupid or not
21:10 < phogg> gronke: they're idiots. Lots of people are
21:10 < phogg> nothos: You are being stupid. Humans usually are. You're welcome.
21:10 < nothos> But the u attribute you can set on files, which is supposed to set it to undeleteable
21:10 < nothos> Doesn't actually stop it being deleted
21:11 < nothos> phogg I walked right into that, fair play
21:11 < gronke> phogg, while that's probably true, I assumed that a developer of a widely used tool would know more about install locations than me, a mere intermediate user
21:11 < phogg> nothos: where do you see that documented?
21:11 < nothos> phogg man pages for chattr
21:11 < phogg> gronke: They just don't care. Application developers are generally either disinterested in FHS policy or ignorant of it.
21:12 < gronke> phogg, so, what should be my next steps? I dont know what to do now
21:12 < phogg> gronke: A standalone package like that should go either in /usr/local or in /opt, and I hate /opt so /usr/local it is.
21:12 < phogg> gronke: did you re-run the installer as I suggested?
21:12 < nothos> Though everyone seems to say that the u stands for undeleteable
21:12 < nothos> So not 100%
21:12 < gronke> phogg, do I need to uninstall it first?
21:12 < phogg> nothos: did you read what it says about 'u'?
21:13 < nothos> I did: " When  a  file  with  the 'u' attribute set is deleted, its contents are saved.  This allows the user to ask for its undeletion"
21:13 < phogg> nothos: Exactly. So it does not make it impossible to delete, it makes it *possible to request that deletion be reversed*
21:13 < TheWild> installed Windows 7 starter on VirtualBox, for testing. Wait, why is the battery level displayed? VirtualBox is leaking way too much information to the guest OS.
21:13 < nothos> I wouldn't necessarily say "can be deleted but restored" should count as undeleteable? (I assume it sticks them in lost+found
21:13 < phogg> nothos: in practice I do not know that this is reliable
21:13 < brutser> phogg: would these rules work (reply by infirit) -> https://github.com/mate-desktop/caja/issues/158
21:14 < phogg> brutser: I don't know. I am not very familiar with udev. Maybe someone else will know.
21:14 < dgurney> TheWild, because that's default behavior, I'm sure you can disable it in the settings
21:14 < nothos> phogg Well that's the other thing, manpages basically say it's not respected by ext2/3/4
21:14 < brutser> ok np
21:14 < phogg> Anyone care to look at brutser's udev rules and see if they'll prevent unused loop devices from being persisted in /dev?
21:14 < nothos> Shame, would've been handy for it to be the way I imagine a lot of people would infer it to work
21:14 < phogg> nothos: I expect only xfs respects it, if anything does.
21:15 < phogg> nothos: you want the 'i' attr
21:15 < nothos> phogg But i doesn't allow writing
21:15 < phogg> nothos: okay then you don't want it
21:15 < nothos> phogg Yeah, this isn't really for any real world stuff, I was just wondering some things and decided to turn to the man pages
21:16 < phogg> nothos: think about it: If I can write to a file can I delete the file? Yes, I can replace its contents with nothing. The file still "exists" but it has no bytes. This is functionally equivalent to being deleted for most practical purposes. This is why Linux (and most systems) do not distinguish delete and write permissions
21:17 < nothos> phogg I'd argue there's enough software that distinctly distinguishes between empty file and no file
21:17 < phogg> nothos: what you can do is this: Make a directory, put a file in it, remove write access to the dir. Grant write access to the file.
21:17 < nothos> mysql is an example
21:17 < phogg> nothos: now the user can modify the file, including truncate to zero bytes, but cannot rm it (because he cannot update the dir entry)
21:18 < phogg> he also cannot make *new* files, so that's where this isn't quite the same as merely revoking delete permissions
21:18 < nothos> phogg Yeah, i suspect that'd be the only real way
21:18 < nothos> Though it was more curiosity, like I said
21:18 < nothos> Thanks for the insight though :)
21:18 < phogg> sure
21:18 < nothos> I am curious though
21:18 < nothos> Why do you dislike /opt phogg? :D
21:18 < gronke> phogg do I need to "uninstall" what I've done so far before trying to install it again?
21:19 < Juesto> opt is like extra clutter
21:19 < phogg> nothos: because the FHS has a place for everything and /opt is a place with no rules. I don't consider an organization rule that says "Do anything" to be a good rule. There should be no dumping grounds.
21:20 < phogg> gronke: I don't know but it's unlikely. These kinds of programs usually do a one-dir-is-everything style with few side effects
21:20 < nothos> phogg Juesto yeah, I can see that argument. I assume you'd err on the side of using /usr/local in these cases
21:20 < gronke> phogg, okay, I installed it in /usr/local/apps/miniconda2
21:21 < phogg> nothos: in general /opt will have one dir per program or one dir per entity (e.g. company) with subdirs per program and each program dir *may* have its own etc/bin/share/doc, and so on. Sometimes the internal structure is wildly different, though. /opt is exactly like C:\Program Files\ - an unstructured mess of code, shareable data and runtime data interleaved.
21:21 < phogg> gronke: find /usr/local/apps/miniconda2 -type d -name bin # does it find something?
21:22 < Juesto>  /usr takes the place of program files+programdata too
21:22 < chris11> how can i convert a hex dump wihtout getting the hex values?
21:22 < gronke> phogg, yep
21:22 < hexnewbie> Or find /usr/local/apps/minconda2 -perm /111
21:22 < phogg> People who like app bundles probably love /opt
21:22 < phogg> hexnewbie: literally nobody understands -perm
21:23 < phogg> gronke: in that dir is probably the binary you want
21:23 < nothos> phogg Boy you'd hate cpanel then :D
21:23 < phogg> gronke: you should ls it and symlink anything you want to be runnable elsewhere into /usr/local/bin
21:23 < phogg> nothos: oh believe me I do!
21:23 < gronke> phogg, I... am not sure how to do that
21:23 < nothos> An entire / hierarchy within /opt :D
21:23 < phogg> gronke: which part? ls the dir? create a symlink?
21:24 < phogg> nothos: Yeah, but that's *nothing* compared to RHEL "software collections"
21:24 < nothos> phogg Some handle it more nicely than others
21:24 < nothos> Like remi for example
21:24 < phogg> nothos: /opt/rhel/<package>/root/ and then an entire per-package root hierarchy
21:24 < phogg> nothos: NO. SCREW REMI. If you think that's nice you've been living in hell way too long.
21:25 < gronke> phogg, it's in /usr/local/apps/miniconda2/bin, I am not sure how to create the symlink, I'm also not sure why this is being so complicated, everything made it seem like I run an installer and then I have "conda" ready to go here :-/
21:26 < phogg> gronke: the installer is badly written. It could do all of this for you, but it doesn't work in an intelligent fashion
21:26 < phogg> gronke: okay, so if you ls /usr/local/apps/miniconda2/bin you should see an executable file called 'conda'. Do you?
21:26 < gronke> phogg, yes sir
21:26 < jim> what symlink do you need? not sure I understand
21:26 < phogg> gronke: to create a symlink: ln -s source dest. In this case: ln -s /usr/local/apps/miniconda2/bin/conda /usr/local/bin/
21:27 < nothos> phogg Really? From my experience it respects the expected ways more
21:27 < phogg> gronke: this makes a symlink in /usr/local/bin/ with the same name as the source file ('conda'). Because /usr/local/bin is probably in your PATH anyway you should now be able to run your command.
21:27 < nothos> So configs go in /etc/opt for example
21:27 < phogg> nothos: being better than the average does not make it nice
21:27 < jim> is that the only thing in /usr/local/apps/miniconda2/bin/?
21:28 < gronke> phogg, this only works for me, correct?
21:28 < phogg> jim: could be I should have had him use a prefix of just /usr/local, but with these standalone installer scripts it's a bit risky.
21:28 < jim> if there are other things... you may wish to put /usr/local/apps/miniconda2/bin/ into your PATH var maybe?
21:28 < phogg> gronke: it will be in the PATH of everyone who has /usr/local/bin in their PATH. If you don't want that then don't create the symlink there.
21:29 < phogg> gronke: there a lot of ways you can make it work. It just depends on what kind of effect you are trying to achieve. I am giving you the most typical setup.
21:30 < jim> wait, is he just trying to run something? or package something or make an installer?
21:30 < bls> there's also GNU stow if more than one thing needs to appear as a first class /usr/local citizen
21:30 < gronke> jim I'm trying to install Qiime which wants Miniconda (or rather, conda) and everything is being difficult as usual https://docs.qiime2.org/2018.4/install/native/
21:31 < phogg> jim: https://conda.io/miniconda.html the sh script downloaded from here
21:31 < phogg> jim: it's a shell script sitting atop a tarball, typical .run file
21:32 < jim> you mean like dir siblings?
21:32 < phogg> jim: no?
21:32 < jim> ok, not sure how you mean "atop"
21:32 < phogg> jim: I mean like: cat install.sh data.tar.xz > installer.sh
21:33 < phogg> a "self extracting executable"
21:33 < jim> in the same file?
21:33 < phogg> jim: yes
21:33 < jim> ok
21:33 < phogg> think mkself, except this one was made by some other tool
21:33 < phogg> which is good because mkself is really brittle
21:34 < gronke> cool typing conda works now
21:34 < phogg> gronke: as jim was saying earlier: if there are other files in the /usr/local/apps/miniconda2/bin/ dir you may want to add the whole dir to your PATH so you can access them. Maybe they're not needed in normal use, though.
21:36 < gronke> so apparently I need to "create an environment" to install this program and then activate it, does that need to be done every time I run Qiime?
21:38 < phogg> gronke: I've no idea. Docs? Maybe.
21:38 < phogg> gronke: "create an environment" probably just means "set certain env vars like PATH and LD_LIBRARY_PATH so the programs will work"
21:38 < gronke> phogg, was looking at this: https://docs.qiime2.org/2018.4/install/native/
21:39 < gronke> "Now that you have a QIIME 2 environment, activate it using the environment’s name:"
21:39 < phogg> gronke: you need to know what conda is and what a 'conda environment' is to continue. I cannot tell you for sure what is correct.
21:39 < gronke> hmm ok
21:40 < phogg> gronke: since "activation" is done using the *source* command, I expect that they are indeed just setting env vars
21:40 < jim> gronke, one thing I do fairly typically, is arrange to install things into places like /home/me/something-install, and then I have to add stuff to my shell startup script that adds /home/me/something-install/bin to PATH and /home/me/something-install/lib to LD_LIBRARY_PATH
21:40 < phogg> the "environment name" is probably just a text file and you are sourcing it to set up the bash environment
21:40 < gronke> ok
21:40 < gronke> yeah I'm not too familiar with virtual environments and the like, just learning
21:41 < phogg> gronke: so far this has nothing to do with virtual anything
21:41 < gronke> ah okay, I was thinking a "conda environment" was similiar to a virtual environment
21:42 < jim> virtual environments is the name the python folks give to something you create with a tool that can be the recepticle for python modules to be installed, and later blown away (maybe)
21:42 < phogg> gronke: It could be (but I doubt it)
21:43 < phogg> jim: but even then aren't these basically just "a bunch of env vars set *just right* so the right modules and python version can be found together"?
21:43 < phogg> pretty sure that's all it is
21:44 < linuxthefish> do you have to register with nickserv to talk here?
21:44 < Sulc> How do I transfer a large file over a slow/wonky network? This will fail over 85% of the time when I have a 100Gig file. tar cfj - /etc /tmp/mysql.sql | openssl aes-256-cbc -k something 2>>/tmp/email | curl --retry 60 -T - -u user:password ftp://xxxx.mine.nu/server-20180529-FULL.tbz
21:45 < jim> phogg, yes, exactly
21:45 < brutser> phogg: i can confirm that script on that page does not work
21:45 < jim> root, just so you know, ircing as root can cause problems for you :)
21:46 < bls> Sulc: save the file locally, then copy it over with rsync so you can resume on failure
21:46 < prussian> Sulc: use a multipart-form instead
21:46 < bls> oh, FTP. nevermind
21:46 < prussian> o
21:46 < prussian> i didn't see the ftp either
21:47 < phogg> linuxthefish: yes
21:47 < Sulc> bls: I don't have that much space locally. I'm open to another suggestions.
21:48 < linuxthefish> thanks phogg, ah could be different navigating someone to use nickserv :p
21:48 < Sulc> I have control over the receiving end, so it deosn'nt need to be ftp
21:49 < phogg> Sulc: do you need to encrypt? YOu could save some overhead by just doing it in the clear
21:51 < Sulc> phogg: i would like to leave the encryption in. It adds a few kilobytes to the filesize which doesn't matter transferring a 100G file.
21:57 < bls> you could maybe try using a fifo and rsync, but not sure how much more resilient that's going to be, especially if the input data is going to change between invocations
21:57 < jim> sounds like you want to encrypt the file as opposed to the filesystem
21:57 < phogg> jim: doesn't sound like either. His only encryption is SSL.
21:58 < Sulc> i'm encrypting the file.
21:59 < phogg> Sulc: if you can't use rsync and have it resume for you the only other thing I know how to do is split the original file into chunks and send a piece at a time, then cat them on the other side. You need space to store the chunks, though.
21:59 < Sulc> At the receiving end I don't decrypt it. I decrypt before restore.
22:00 < bls> from looking back at it, not sure why you can't just `rsync /etc /tmp/mysql.sql xxxx.mine.nu:/backupdir`
22:00 < phogg> if you don't have the space and you can write some custom code you could make a program which reads some small amount e.g. 1MiB from the pipeline, makes a file, and sends it till it succeeds, then repeat this. If everything is streamable you never need to have RAM or disk enough to store it all. With an encryption pass I don't think this is a viable option, though.
22:01 < phogg> bls: I assume he wants both thinngs to appear in the same single archive tarball
22:01 < Sulc> bls, I don't want the files to be on the receiving end in plaintext
22:01 < phogg> next option: rsync like bls says and at the end touch a file on the remote side which causes a monitoring script to pick up and make the tarball
22:02 < phogg> Sulc: can you afford an NFS export from the remote side and to mount that on the source side?
22:02 < bls> then encrypt when making the original backup
22:02 < bls> instead of backing up to plaintext
22:02 < phogg> NFS over the internet is bad, but if you make a VPN it's doable
22:03 < Sulc> bls tar | openssl -k pw encrypts the contents of the file with the key "pw".
22:03 < phogg> bls: he is doing that
22:03 < bls> so /tmp/mysql.sql is being encrypted twice?
22:05 < Sulc> bls /tmp/mysql.sql is created with unencrypted, before running the tar | encrypt | upload pipe.
22:05 < phogg> bls: only looks like once to me
22:05 < bls> right, so I assume that's both what's important to not be xferred in plaintext and what's preventing making a local tarball
22:06 < bls> so if you encypt/compress that when making the dump, that problem goes away?
22:06 < Sulc> I'm uploading through the internet so I'd rather transfer it encrypted.
22:07 < bls> rsync will piggyback over ssh
22:07 < chris11> is there a log of network calls? Like history but also including links call from pages I visit
22:07 < bls> chris11: no, unless you've explicitly turned one on
22:08 < Sulc> If I understand correctly rsync cannot transfer a pipe
22:08 < phogg> chris11: If you want something like that for activity in your web browser there are Firefox extensions which provide it. Try umatrix, which logs what connections are made and can block them.
22:08 < phogg> Sulc: why would it need to?
22:08 < bls> it can't. I'm saying if you do things correctly beforehand, you don't need a pipe
22:09 < phogg> If you really don't want to work something out with rsync then I'm standing by "VPN + NFS" as the next least bad option.
22:09 < azarus> sshfs?
22:10 < bls> mysqldump | openssl/gpg/crypt/etc > /tmp/my.sql; rsync -avz /tmp/my.sql example.com:
22:10 < phogg> azarus: also a good option
22:10 < bls> sshfs would end up locking the box up
22:10 < bls> if the connection drops mid-transfer
22:10 < Sulc> I'm reading man rsync now, please wait a little
22:10 < phogg> bls: if the dropout is brief it can sometimes recover
22:10 < chris11> thanks
22:10 < azarus> sshfs isn't that reliable, that's true :/
22:11 < phogg> it's especially bad at large files
22:11 < phogg> so probably not the best idea
22:11 < bls> I've learned to not trust it, especially not on a connection that's already dropping out regularly
22:13 < azarus> maybe even http? wget supports continuing downloads
22:13 < phogg> azarus: not from a pipe
22:14 < phogg> there are two problems here and the first one is the need to transfer a large amount of data off the box without having it all spooled to disk at once
22:15 < mordof> hey all. i'm wondering if there's a way (or output format) i can echo in my terminal where when i click on the text, it'll run the command.  e.g.   xdg-open <path/to/img>  and click on that to show the picture  (while i'm tailing output of a log, for example)
22:15 < Sulc> the second is that the network is unstable, the third is i don't want the other people on the backup server to see my files.
22:15 < delt> Hello
22:16 < bls> so if the files were encrypted and compressed at generation time instead of transfer time, most of those problems should go away
22:16 < delt> how many symlinks can be chained before the filesystem returns not found? this used to be 72 many years ago, but im not sure if it changed
22:17 < ayecee> doesn't seem like the kind of thing someone would just know offhand
22:17 < d1z> can anyone help me fix this situation? I have my usb disk mount in my home because my harddrive failed badly and I need to work anyway so I had all my data in this usb drive
22:17 < d1z> http://termbin.com/g2z7
22:17 < phogg> mordof: maybe in some weird/advanced terminals. Generally no. Try e.g. Terminology which has fancy features
22:18 < d1z> but whenever I've suspended the machine, sometimes I have it reawakened without the usb drive plugged in
22:18 < mordof> phogg: hmm.. ok. my current one has that feature for urls (i'm on linux mint, default terminal.. i think it's the same one ubuntu uses) .  will look at terminology
22:18 < mordof> thanks
22:19 < d1z> and those ghost mounts remain mounted. The /dev/sdx that get assigned each time I plug it back are still there
22:19 < twainwek> anyone know conceptually how recent servers sending 'large' files like videos function (e.g. youtube) where they send you a portion of the data at max speed, and then throttle/stop unless you resend the request.... and any existing utilities that can be used to force the server to send full content at fullspeed?
22:20 < bls> that's usually your ISP doing that, not the remote server
22:20 < phogg> mordof: You really need to be able to identify the executable name of your terminal or discussion becomes impossible. Unfortunately it has become popular to lie to users and tell them "Terminal" instead of something useful. Most libvte based terms *can* do link detection, but so can rxvt. Some esoteric terminals do much more.
22:21 < twainwek> bls: how so? i'd imagine remote server would gain more by doing that (e.g. youtube)
22:21 < twainwek> for example, not everyone is going to finish the 1 hour video, so they're better off sending it in chunks in case people leave 5 minutes in
22:21 < phogg> twainwek: what do you mean "conceptually how"?
22:22 < bls> ISPs do it because it makes things look good when initial page loads are quick, without them having to fully deliver the bandwidth
22:22 < jnt> d1z: you have a usb drive mounted on /home, did you unplug it while the computer is on? you can likely not unmount that disk if you are logged in as a user that has his home in /home/<username>, as something probably has files open
22:22 < jesperson> Hi guys, quick question.. If it says in my dmidecode memory that the physical memory array can hold 16gb - that goes right? Because the manufacturer says the laptop can only hold 8gb
22:22 < twainwek> phogg: i'm looking for basic details of how they may be implemented so i can bypass them
22:23 < bls> jesperson: dmidecode is probably looking at it from what the processor can handle, your motherboard may not have the connectors or your case might not have the room
22:23 < phogg> twainwek: you mostly can't; they track each client separately. You'd have to make multiple fresh connections that look like different sessions *and* request new offsets (e.g. not start at the first chunk).
22:23 < jesperson> I know there's only 1 slot.. Does DDR3 SODIMM only go up to 8gb per stick?
22:23 < phogg> twainwek: in any case this is *NOT* a ##linux question, try ##internet-asshole isntead
22:24 < bls> and anyone purposefully doing this kind of throttling is likely going to detect and kill the multi-offset technique as well
22:24 < twainwek> phogg: the second part asking if any utilities exist was, and i don't see how it's an 'asshole' thing to do
22:25 < phogg> twainwek: You're trying to circumvent technical protections that prevent one user from hogging all available resources. That's not very neighborly.
22:25 < delt> ayecee: ok, let me write a simple test
22:25 < mordof> phogg:  fair enough - is `gnome-terminal` what you're talking about?
22:26 < phogg> twainwek: the program youtube-dl can download from youtube via the command line. Some other tools also exist which do this, but I don't use them and cannot comment. Consult its man page.
22:26 < phogg> mordof: for GNOME "Terminal" is indeed gnome-terminal.
22:26 < phogg> mordof: which is, for the record, based on libvte
22:26 < mordof> good to know :)
22:27 < delt> ayecee: a quick test shows a chain of 41 symlinks works, but after that the file can't be read
22:27 < phogg> it thus has a lot in common with other libvte-based terminals
22:27 < phogg> there are dozens of those
22:27 < ayecee> delt: i wonder if that's more to do with path length than number of links
22:28 < delt> ayecee: yeah good point
22:28 < delt> let's do another test
22:28 < phogg> mordof: how are you testing? If it's from a shell script be aware that your shell may separately check this. To know the kernel limitation requires C.
22:28 < delt> ayecee: nope, still 41
22:28 < gronke> Man, this thing has been "verifying transaction" for like a half hour
22:29 < ayecee> nice
22:29 < mordof> phogg: testing? ... oh.. might not've been for me
22:29 < phogg> mordof: oh yeah, sorry
22:30 < phogg> delt: sorry that bit about testing above  was for you
22:31 < delt> phogg: yeah, a quick bash command that creates a bunch of numbered symlinks each pointing to the previous one
22:31 < delt> and 0 is the actual file
22:31 < delt> prefixing everything with "dir_entry_" still gives the same number of symlinks readable 41)
22:31 < delt> (41)
22:32 < phogg> delt: what does readlink -f say?
22:32 < delt> phogg:
22:32 < delt> [pts/11][user@phobos]:~/symlinktest$ readlink -f dir_entry_42
22:32 < delt> /home/user/symlinktest/dir_entry_0
22:32 < phogg> delt: and if you add one more and try it does it fail?
22:33 < delt> phogg: nope, let's see where it fails, 2sec
22:33 < gronke> huh, looks like the server crashed completely, that can't be good
22:33 < phogg> gronke: probably not what you want, no
22:34 < delt> phogg: that's weird, i created 255 symlinks and they're all readable by readlink -f to the last one
22:35 < delt> phogg: though trying to 'cat' each symlink "almost" agrees with my 41: 40 symlinks readable
22:36 < phogg> delt: I'm not sure what readlink is doing. It may only step one at a time and thus could go on forever. I'm not sure.
22:36 < Sleepygravel> My microphone from my headset is high pitched and is like 20 times faster. I got this problem in Linux Mint 18.3. I have looked at many tips on the internet and none of them worked, not even updating the kernel to 4.15. So i took a debian live install and the micriphone worked fine there. But after installing Debian and updating packages, the microphone issue came back. What should I do?
22:37 < delt> phogg:
22:37 < delt> 40: ok
22:37 < delt> 41: cat: dir_entry_41: Too many levels of symbolic links
22:37 < Sulc> hmm, a "tar | openssl | split -b 100M --filter'curl -u ...' " might work if i'm right
22:38 < phogg> Sleepygravel: it's some combination of the driver being used, the driver's settings and the program accessing the mic. If the live version worked OK it might be that the auto-detected driver and settings are different. Go back to the livecd and find  out what kernel version and audio driver is in use *exactly*.
22:39 < phogg> Sleepygravel: it would also help to mention what program is using the mic. Is it pulse audio? What version and what is its config? Compare versions and config with your non-working version.
22:44 < ExoUNX> afternoon
22:44 < ExoUNX> is there a commonly used linux package for UPS alerts over SNMP?
22:47 < ExoUNX> nut and upsmon seem to be the goto software for this
22:47 < phogg> ExoUNX: there's a upsd, but I cannot say whether it is popular
22:47 < xamithan> upsmon and snmpd
22:48 < phogg> oh, network. Yeah nut
22:52 < Psi-Jack> Definitely nut is nice. :)
22:52 < Psi-Jack> Not for alerts, but for monitoring and reading UPS states. Other tools are for monitoring.
22:53 < Psi-Jack> But, why... snmp?
22:54 < ExoUNX> Psi-Jack, because I have multiple servers using this UPS, and a single USB or Serial connection won't work as easily
22:54 < Psi-Jack> That doesn't really answer why SNMP. :p
22:54 < ExoUNX> because it's simple
22:54 < Psi-Jack> SNMP is simple? Granted, it's part of the name, but SNMP itself is not really all that simple. LOL
22:55 < ExoUNX> well the other options are SSH and maybe an HTTPS API
22:56 < ExoUNX> not sure what's the point of your question
22:56 < Psi-Jack> Or NUT, which already does the network communication layer, and then you get whatever monitoring tool(s) you want to pull metrics out and log them into your monitoring solution.
22:57 < ExoUNX> Psi-Jack, so I'd have a server running NUT then all the servers communicate with that?
22:58 < Psi-Jack> Yep.
22:58 < ExoUNX> NUT does support my UPS
23:00 < Psi-Jack> That's why I was asking about the SNMP and Monitoring part. :)
23:01 < Psi-Jack> Besides the fact not many people actually /ask/ specifically for something /to/ support snmp. Usually people are running from snmp. :)
23:01 < ExoUNX> I don't see a problem with it, I like open and standard protocols
23:02 < ExoUNX> maybe other than the lack of TLS
23:03 < ExoUNX> anyways, heading out. Thanks
23:17 < mattfly> hello
23:17 < mattfly> im having this isue and im unable to use my usb heaphone after suspending
23:18 < mattfly> this is what syslog shows
23:18 < mattfly> https://pastebin.com/jFSVTt0X
23:21 < mattfly> thats when i plug my usb
23:21 < hans_> mattfly, can you do find /usb1/1-1/1-1:1.3/0003:1B1C:0A06.001F
23:21 < hans_> wtf
23:21 < hans_> mattfly, can you do find /usb1/1-1/1-1:1.3/0003:1B1C:0A06.001F | pastebinit                 ?*
23:22 < Psi-Jack> mattfly: Also pastebin.com is frowned upon due to many issues they themselves have caused. Pastes being reformatted, malvertising, adblock blocking, being blocked due to many reasons. See /topic for the channel's official pastebin.
23:23 < hans_> Psi-Jack, nit-picking: also their api sucks.
23:23 < Psi-Jack> Everything about them sucks. That's pretty much solidified. :)
23:24 < julius>  /newserver irc.abjects.net
23:24 < mattfly> $ find usb1/1-1/1-1:1.3/0003:1B1C:0A06.0020/
23:24 < mattfly> find: ‘usb1/1-1/1-1:1.3/0003:1B1C:0A06.0020/’: No such file or directory
23:24 < mattfly> i haved plugged it again
23:24 < hans_> you forgot an /
23:24 < hans_> mattfly
23:25 < mattfly> no still nothing
23:26 < mattfly> https://pastebin.com/kqTmicqp
23:27 < mattfly> what should i run given thats the last output now?
23:28 < hans_> mattfly, not sure why that would list as a pci-e device, but k
23:28 < hans_> mattfly, find /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/ | pastebinit
23:28 < mattfly> : Raptor HS40 is my phone
23:28 < mattfly> damn
23:28 < mattfly> my headphone
23:29 < hans_> mattfly, are you manually pastebining shit, or is your pastebinit really configured to use pastebin.com ?
23:29 < mattfly> i manually did it
23:29 < mattfly> never used pastebinit
23:29 < hans_> why
23:30 < mattfly> because i just found it out
23:30 < hans_> hehe kk
23:30 < mattfly> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/2KMs827bGS/
23:30 < mattfly> oha thats huge
23:30 < hans_> that's a little better - paste.ubuntu.com is also a rather shitty pastebin, but k
23:31 < mattfly> how to configure it to use the best one?
23:32 < hans_> which pastebin is "the best 1" is a matter of debate (and probably personal opinion), but both http://paste.debian.net and fpaste.org are good
23:35 < hans_> (my issues with paste.ubuntu.com include: you need to SIGN IN to get a plain view, that feature is not offered to not-registered people. it does not support hidden, nor password protected pastes, all pastes are public. and it does not support expiry dates.)
23:36 < ayecee> i use pastebin.com so that Psi-Jack won't peek ;)
23:36 < hans_> clever
23:37 < hans_> mattfly, cat /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/usb1/1-12/avoid_reset_quirk
23:37 < hans_> what do you get?
23:37 < hans_> err, cat /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/usb1/1-12/avoid_reset_quirk | pastebinit
23:38 < mattfly> no output it seems
23:39 < hans_> cat /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/usb1/1-12/avoid_reset_quirk | base64 | pastebinit
23:39 < mattfly> http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/M7tg9d9RjV/
23:40 < hans_> mattfly, actually, that's a zero
23:40 < mattfly> i think that path is wrong]
23:42 < hans_> mattfly, this is not 100% risk-free, i can not guarantee 100% that this won't fk something up, but maybe, just maybe this will make a difference: printf "1\n" > /sys/devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:14.0/usb1/1-12/avoid_reset_quirk
23:43 < mattfly> okay let me see ...
23:44 < mattfly> doenst work
23:45 < mattfly> still cant see my usb phone on pavucontrol
23:45 < mattfly> and i did restart alsa and pulseaudio
23:45 < mattfly> if i reboot my computer it works
23:45 < brutser> with my livecd build i have 4 /dev/loopX devices and 3 /dev/mapper/. showing under "Devices"
23:45 < mattfly> im having this problem since i started using jack on my laptop
23:45 < brutser> i like to hide them, or not show under Devices
23:45 < brutser> centos with mate livecd
23:45 < hans_> (there exist hardware, where sending the wrong signal /sys/devices/(...)/<SOMETHING>   will fk up the device so bad that the hardware needs a re-flash requiring special equipment that probably only the manufacturer have, but i don't think this is such a case)
23:46  * storge chants SEND THE SIGNAL! SEND THE SIGNAL!
23:46 < hans_> storge, already did, it didn't change anything apparently
23:47 < storge> is the goal to mount a phone so it's music can be played through the distro's media software?
23:48 < storge> (i came in late, just wondering)
23:48 < ayecee> probably no
23:48 < storge> i was wondering what alsa and pavucontrol had to do with connecting a phone
23:48 < hans_> anyone used tha Corsair AX1(5|6)00 monitor software thingy?
23:49 < ayecee> no, you are the first
23:49 < hans_> that's what i thought
23:49 < hans_> but i mean, anyone here?
23:49 < ayecee> no, you are the first
23:50 < hans_> well, given that the AX1600i came out a couple of months ago and have been nearly impossible to buy (sold out everywhere), i guess that makes sense
23:50 < hans_> for the ax1600i, but not for ax1500i
23:59 < brutser> by default /dev/loop* and /dev/mapper/* are shown under devices/places in MATE desktop caja, first of all i wonder why that is, they have no function being there and 2nd, how can i hide them? livecd iso
--- Log closed Wed May 30 00:00:37 2018